jesus was a magician!

[cardero]

It is interesting that there are very early depictions of Jesus performing many of his miracles with a wand.

Or Moses with his "rod".

 

[cardero]

Penguin, is it possible that you watch too much Family Guy?

http://youtube.com/watch?v=DCPSF0v_Urs

Classic clip harlot but I must remind you that I do not believe there is such a thing as "too much Family Guy".

 

[darkpenguin]

still think he was! and nobody has provided a strong argument really!

 

[MaddLlama]

still think he was! and nobody has provided a strong argument really!

Nobody's provided a strong argument, because you haven't presented anything of substance to argue against. And, because you're not willing to listen to what anyone else has to say.

 

[darkpenguin]

Chris Angel can walk on water!
http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=915878140


water can be made into wine!
http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=1545054990

Just a thought!

 

[darkpenguin]

10 plagues of moses
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R3nqeW5yrew

Raising the dead
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VK8GkVm4G10

Catching many fish
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M08Ghj4Ejck

 

[MaddLlama]

You do realize that modern magicians have technology and resources that someone living in Jesus' time wouldn't possibly have.
Do you think Jesus carried chemical color tablets to change water in wine? Did Moses have an intricate system of mirrors to make the red sea part?

 

[darkpenguin]

You do realize that modern magicians have technology and resources that someone living in Jesus' time wouldn't possibly have.
Do you think Jesus carried chemical color tablets to change water in wine? Did Moses have an intricate system of mirrors to make the red sea part?

Can you prove that the magicians did?
Alot of what Chris Angel and many other magicians do cannot be explained.
I change my mind from what I started this thread about, he was more than a magician to people, I just want to question his 'miracles' that can be reproduced easily and without much effort!

 

[opensoul7]

First I must state that I believe Jesus was more than a magician . But there is information out there that does debate that topic.

 

[Rough_ER]

This thread makes me think of this standup by Rowan Atkinson.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTzXJMU1sLc

 

[MaddLlama]

Can you prove that the magicians did?

Personally, I couldn't. But I'm married to a magician, and I'm sure he could explain exactly how it's done. But, changing water into blood like they did in the video, is very very easy - you buy a color changing tablet in any color you'd like (similar to easter egg dye, I would assume), you palm it, or crush it, and then drop the water on it.

Alot of what Chris Angel and many other magicians do cannot be explained.

Criss Angel is a magic genius, and he's very very secretive of how he does his tricks. All he's done is create tricks with high shock value that are not easily reproduced, so obviously if he's going to keep his popularity, he's going to guard his secrets very carefully. But, he's never claimed that they were anything more than tricks. You can't explain what magicians do easily because they keep those secrets - if that information were revealed and everyone knew how it was done, would anybody still see a magic show? No. Just because it can't be explained by people who don't understand how it's done doesn't mean anything.

Magic develops with technology. There are a lot of magic products on the market today that allow magicians to do tricks that nobody could have in the past. It's almost like saying "did Jesus drive a Ford". No, because no such technology existed back then.

Explain to me exactly how each of those miracles could have been performed by magic (specific, and with detail that makes sense in the context of the period in history), and then I'll consider what you have to say. But, until you can do that, you have no real argument at all - just a claim that is severly lacking in substantiation.

 

[Anti-World]

You make a good point, if Jesus was a magician why would he allow himself to be crucified?

 

[pladecalvo]

Hmmm .... the most recent person on your list wrote before my grandparents were married, and he was hardly a scholar, and hardly a skeptic. All it took for him to be convinced of the absolute historicity of the New Testament was to sit down and read it. Hardly a rigorous examination of the data. I wonder whether you've ever met any serious scholar at all, or anybody who openly and honestly researched the evidence. Lew Wallace?! One thing that's clear is that your idea of a serious, open, and honest scholar is somebody who embraces your idea of Christianity.

.......and then there are all the ex-religious scholars and churchmen on this site who have decided that they were wrong! http://debunkingchristianity.blogspot.com/

 

[Lindsey-Loo]

Wow, this thread has been resurrected. It's a miracle!

Sorry, lol, I just had to say that. Moving on...

I really don't think you're going to change anybody's mind. Most Christians will not entertain the idea that Jesus was merely a magician, and you are obviously not going to change your mind on the subject. Most Christians have faith in Jesus, and in the authenticity of the Bible, so I really don't think anything you say is going to change that for most of us.

 

[michel]

its quite clear that jesus was a magician, nothing more, nothing less, many other magicians has proven this by doing exactly as jesus did, they just dont claim to be the son of god, thus they dont get crucified!

If you accept that "Magicians" are people who use knowledge that isn't available to the rest of the onlookers, I dare say you could make a claim that Jesus was a Magician. The Miracles he did were understandable by him, and by God the Father; it is just that we puny humans just don't understand what is going on.

If you are using the term as in "People who do tricks" then I disagree completely.

 

[pladecalvo]

Also in another line of thinking, don't people who are found to have been pressumed dead and then burried alive or waking just before an autopsy also prove that it is possible to be pressumed dead but not be dead? Even with the technology that is available today. Also i found this article to be very intriguing!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Passover_Plot

I have read somewhere that one of the symptoms of the Plague was that the victim would sometimes go into a deep coma and would appear to be dead. There are records where such people were buried alive. This was found when some bodies of plague victims had to be removed from their coffins and scratch marks were found inside the lid, indicating that they had regained conciousness.

To prevent this happening, a piece of string was tied to the 'dead' persons finger, through the coffin lid and then attached to a bell above the grave. If the person regained conciousness, he would pull on the string and ring the bell to attract attention. This is where we get the expression 'dead ringer'.

 

[NoahideHiker]

It's maaaaaaagic!

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Alot of what Chris Angel and many other magicians do cannot be explained.

David Blaine, I know how he does most of his tricks. He is not very creative. If I had an extra 500 dollars, and a free weekend, I would have all the props and practice to go on the streets and do the exact same tricks. (Using a Raven to do it's "instruction manual" trick is not very impressive) I even almost sliped up doing his trick where he burns the paper, and then writes the name that was on the paper on his arm from the ashes. I almost started to do it, then I realised I was mising a very important item for it to work.
Chris Angel on the other hand is a magic genius. I only know how do two of his tricks. Walk on water, which as I previously stated, is very difficult, and I learned how to shove a coin into an unopened soda can.