Jews, Ezra and Qur'an

[Godobeyer]

doing this, then why does it say قَاتَلَهُمُ اللَّهُ? It must be that they are still doing
.

I am start learning how to repeat the same answser in this thread !
It's makes me feel like idiot
It's mean "damn to them" .

 

[Godobeyer]

You will have to give a more thoughtful response.

Sometimes you can't satisfy people,whom don't want to be satisfy.

I understand you were kidding. But I also understand that you didn't make an argument to prove me wrong. Because as you've shown us, you believe what you want, even without evidence.

I caught/proved servel times you wrong , and sometimes caught in caught pretending.

My stubbornness is in that I haven't given up trying to explain to you how to use your mind. You were raised in a culture that doesn't teach you to think for yourself and I have been working hard here to help you learn. You think that I am saying this to antagonize you, but I am not. I am friendly with a few Muslims here and I have no problem with you being Muslim. I don't want you to become Jewish or even kafir. I am not against Muslim people. I am not your enemy, no matter what your shaykh teaches you about me.

I never said Jews are my enemy.
or consider them my enemy.

All I am trying to do here, is to get you to think for yourself. To see the words, without what you were taught. Then you will be able to understand where all these accusations are coming from. To be able to open your mind to another person's point of view- even without accepting it. All-h blessed us with intelligence, not just memorization. He wants us to think, not parrot. This has been the biggest stumbling block of your culture. The non-Muslims of this forum that argue with you don't despise you and the other Muslims for being Muslim. They are upset that you are not using the intelligence that All-h gave you to think about what you are being taught and instead you only repeat it.

I know who I talking with,and where I am, in this thread or in RF , when I talking with people are anti-Islam,and anti-Muslims.



I fix it, just try to delay to quote my reply instantly

It looks like you left some stuff out here.

Today at 1:29 PM#389

 

[Godobeyer]

I am 100000% sure that neither Tumah nor I will convert to Islam,

I forget to comment on this
I am 1000000%
That's definitly will not make more space in the paradise

 

[Rival]

I forget to comment on this
I am 1000000%
That's definitly will not make more space in the paradise

Are you kidding me; I'm gonna be one of Allah's virgins and me and @firedragon can...

I need to go to bed. Night night.

 

[rosends]

Just try after 16 minutes, and enjoy it

I can't thank you for hypocrisy

I finished watching it. You should start. It doesn't say what you think it does. Anyone who watches it would understand that.

 

[Rival]

I finished watching it. You should start. It doesn't say what you think it does. Anyone who watches it would understand that.

I watched a few minutes but didn't have time for the whole. It kind of refuted his entire argument lol. :/

 

[Tumah]

Sometimes you can't satisfy people,whom don't want to be satisfy.

I caught/proved servel times you wrong , and sometimes caught in caught pretending.

I don't think you understand how debate works. After you make a "proof" its my job to disprove your proof. Then you have to prove why my disproof is wrong. You seem to be under the impression that after you make a proof, its already evident and I either see the truth or don't.

I never said Jews are my enemy.
or consider them my enemy.

You may not have said it...

I know who I talking with,and where I am, in this thread or in RF , when I talking with people are anti-Islam,and anti-Muslims.

Do you though? I think you would be a lot more open to what some people are saying if you really understood that.

That's not what you said before. you said prophesy stopped at Moses . just admit you made a mistake, that would not hurt

You didn't look far enough back.

Because after Mt. Sinai, G-d doesn't send prophets from the non-Jews or to the non-Jews (with some exception). The information they need is already out there and its up to them to choose to listen or not.

I am start learning how to repeat the same answser in this thread !
It's makes me feel like idiot
It's mean "damn to them" .

What should make you feel like an idiot is that you keep misunderstanding my point. As I told you before, I don't have a problem with it meaning "All-h should kill them" or anything else it means. The point is that if they aren't doing it anymore, then there is no reason to say it.

 

[Godobeyer]

I finished watching it. You should start. It doesn't say what you think it does. Anyone who watches it would understand that.

Yes, it's better to speak for your self.

 

[Godobeyer]

I watched a few minutes but didn't have time for the whole. It kind of refuted his entire argument lol. :/

When you have time, we will talk

 

[Godobeyer]

I don't think you understand how debate works. After you make a "proof" its my job to disprove your proof. Then you have to prove why my disproof is wrong. You seem to be under the impression that after you make a proof, its already evident and I either see the truth or don't.

You lost debate many times with me, by proof your error (past and present) and proof your ignorance (God stopped prophecy at Moses(pbuh)) and Muslims don't believe in Messiah(pbuh)) and proof your evil pretending you post verse how God punished group of Jews whom disobey God by transform them to apes.

I kick your ***

You may not have said it...

You don't have any control what I suppose to say.

Do you though? I think you would be a lot more open to what some people are saying if you really understood that.

I am open with all people,that's why I am here.

You didn't look far enough back.

This post don't relate to your fatal error when you said " God stopped prophesy at Moses(pbuh)".
since God will send Messiah (pbuh).

​

What should make you feel like an idiot is that you keep misunderstanding my point. As I told you before, I don't have a problem with it meaning "All-h should kill them" or anything else it means. The point is that if they aren't doing it anymore, then there is no reason to say it.

Understand it as you want, I pointed out how we understand it.

 

[Tumah]

You lost debate many times with me, by proof your error (past and present) and proof your ignorance (God stopped prophecy at Moses(pbuh)) and Muslims don't believe in Messiah(pbuh)) and proof your evil pretending you post verse how God punished group of Jews whom disobey God by transform them to apes.

I kick your ***

I can only stand by what I said previously. I understand that maybe in Islam or your culture you are not taught to question, but to accept and so in a debate you give me information and expect me to accept it rather than question it. But you are not debating here. You're stating your stance and then repeating it after I present my disproofs.

You don't have any control what I suppose to say.

That's true.

I am open with all people,that's why I am here.

I think you are here to show people the truth of Islam.

This post don't relate to your fatal error when you said " God stopped prophesy at Moses(pbuh)".
since God will send Messiah (pbuh).

For non-Jews, yes. I've been saying that the whole time. Just like I've been saying the whole time that for Jews it stopped about 1,000 years later. If I didn't spell it out every single time I mentioned it, I'm sorry. I thought that since I said it once, you'd be able to put my statement in context of what I've been saying about it until now.

​

Understand it as you want, I pointed out how we understand it.

The way that you understand it doesn't negate my question.

Here is an example of how you understand it:
Sa'id was an Arab Christian. But now he reverted to Islam. Damn him!

Is that what you as a Muslim would say?

 

[Godobeyer]

I can only stand by what I said previously. I understand that maybe in Islam or your culture you are not taught to question, but to accept and so in a debate you give me information and expect me to accept it rather than question it. But you are not debating here. You're stating your stance and then repeating it after I present my disproofs.

Just try to comment about points where I beat you.
sincerety and being direct is what matter for me

That's true.

So take a lesson for that.

I think you are here to show people the truth of Islam.

What coincidence !
excatly as you tring to show people the truth of Judaism lol

For non-Jews, yes. I've been saying that the whole time. Just like I've been saying the whole time that for Jews it stopped about 1,000 years later. If I didn't spell it out every single time I mentioned it, I'm sorry. I thought that since I said it once, you'd be able to put my statement in context of what I've been saying about it until now.

This is was your hiding comment,

According to us, the break happened because prophecy stopped. But for Christians who still have 'prophets', they need to explain why there is such a long break in between. And then Muslims need to explain the second long break between Jesus and themselves. These two breaks are what provided Baha'i with room to claim the Bab as their prophet.

Now I had a question , why we(Christians and Jews) supposed explain to you ?

I want to comment about
for Bahai whom believe in Allah,and Muhammad(pbuh) his prophet, they probalby considered Muslims to Allah.

who knows ?

​

The way that you understand it doesn't negate my question.

No, your question is prejudging . from first time, when I convinced you it's about past not present.

 

[Godobeyer]

Here is an example of how you understand it:
Sa'id was an Arab Christian. But now he reverted to Islam. Damn him!

Is that what you as a Muslim would say?

You exemple is just insulting your degnity to use such hatefull one.


Here exemple :

A story of two thiefs broke a bank and both caught in action by police,so they.
. damn to them

The first thief is keep stealling until, the second stop stealling.

 

[Limo]

Yes. But you know that the vast majority do (or did at the time of Muhammad). Right?


Yes. وَقَالَتِ is past tense. That was noted. But it is juxtaposed with Christians of whom the vast majority still say that Jesus is the son of god. Even though it says وَقَالَتِ by Christians as well.
Besides for that, in the previous ayah, it is commanding for the present: "Fight those who do not believe in All-h or in the Last Day..." After telling you who to fight now, it then goes on to list people who fit these terms, the Jews and Christians. The former believe Ezra is the son of god and the latter believe Jesus is. The Qur'an curses them that All-h should kill them. If the Jews and Christians are no longer doing this, then why does it say قَاتَلَهُمُ اللَّهُ? It must be that they are still doing this. Then the next verse continues on with things the Jews and Christians do in the present.


The word "some" is not in the Qur'an in this ayah. The entire context of the ayah proves that its meant to be understood in the context of the present. And that is why about half of the Qur'an translators actually do so even though the word وَقَالَتِ is in past tense.


He did right here.

I like your complicated analysis
But unfortunately it's built on wrong assumptions without proof.

The previous ayah doesn't say fight these people of the books because they say Uzair or Elmesiah are sons of god. The reasons is previous ayah are they are not believe and they are not watch the Haram and Halal
Second wrong assumption, if the ayah includes both cases it doesn't mean the similarity or/and patrolling other than the allegations of the calling someone as Son of God. Nothing in ayah imply the penetration rate of the allegations neither the continuty of the allegations.
Even Allah didn't say stop saying that. There is nothing in ayah about this.