Lack of belief in gods.

[Ben Avraham]

Lack of Belief in "gods".

That's great! I also don't believe in gods. So, let's keep our faith in ourselves and praise the Lord with wisdom which is the beginning of knowledge. (Proverbs 1:7)

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Only if one defines atheist as "anything not theist."

Any other definition I've ever seen either:

- quickly becomes unworkable when you scratch the surface,
- only works in an environment with only one religion, or
- ends up implying that atheists don't exist.

If you've come up with one that solves these problems, I'm all ears.

Of course, you should know that the "lack of belief in gods" definition is how people really do use the word. The "babies can't be atheists" objection is based on connotation, not denotation, like people thinking that it "sounds wrong" to describe the Pope as a bachelor, even though he meets the strict definition.

 

[Satans_Serrated_Edge]

omg.....here it is again.....

pasting labels on babies.....

Sure, you can post lots of labels on babies. This is how, with language, you can distinguish things from other things.

Some of these labels might include - small, helpless, cute, bald, toothless, and of course, atheist, apolitical, and possibly even asymmetrical.

Unless of course you know of a religious baby?

 

[Thief]

and if insistence is to be granted.....

babies are ignorant atheists.....
as are dogs.....
cats...
roaches.....
trees

and then there are rocks

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

and if insistence is to be granted.....

babies are ignorant atheists.....
as are dogs.....
cats...
roaches.....
trees

and then there are rocks

Have you figured out how to use the words "non-smoker" (someone who doesn't smoke) or "civilian" (someone who isn't in the military) without referring to cats as non-smokers or trees as civilians? If so, I'm confident that you could figure out how to do the exact same thing with the word "atheist" if you tried hard enough.

 

[Thief]

Have you figured out how to use the words "non-smoker" (someone who doesn't smoke) or "civilian" (someone who isn't in the military) without referring to cats as non-smokers or trees as civilians? If so, I'm confident that you could figure out how to do the exact same thing with the word "atheist" if you tried hard enough.

and to know what an atheist is.......
you need to know what a theist might be.....

and then make a choice

let's allow the people who are able to make the choice make their declaration

let's not paste labels on the unsuspecting

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

and to know what an atheist is.......
you need to know what a theist might be.....

and then make a choice

let's allow the people who are able to make the choice make their declaration

What declaration?

Any given person - even the most informed adult - has never even heard of most of the gods humanity has ever believed in. What sort of declaration do you expect someone to make about a god they don't even know about?

let's not paste labels on the unsuspecting

So don't use adjectives to refer to babies? That's ridiculous.

 

[Cephus]

Why wouldn't it agree that a person who believes god exists believes in God?? Of course I agree with that.

But perhaps you missed something.

There are a lot more gods than the Christian version, you know.

 

[Jeremiahcp]

omg.....here it is again.....

pasting labels on babies.....

Personally, I like barbecue sauce on my babies.

 

[Curious George]

Not more appropriately though..More narrowly. Sure, you might believe there are no gods, and you are an atheist. However, you are still atheist if you just haven't thought about it, haven't heard about it, have heard about it and remain unconvinced etc.

Babies are all atheist until such a time as some evil person brainwashes and conditions them to believe in nonsense.

I'm sorry those groups have a belief of "not-god?"

 

[Curious George]

There are a lot more gods than the Christian version, you know.

Of course.

 

[Jeremiahcp]

I'm sorry those groups have a belief of "not-god?"

And why it is important for you to view it as a belief? I don't go around telling Christians what they believe and don't believe, as I am sure that would offend the majority of them. I may challenge their beliefs or lack of beliefs, but I can't tell them what they believe in; only they can do that. So why not let atheist defined their own beliefs or lack of beliefs? What's it to you?

Perhaps the root problem of this conflict isn't so much what atheist believe, but the fact they just don't like other people telling them what they believe. It is very presumptuous on your part.

 

[Curious George]

Any other definition I've ever seen either:

- quickly becomes unworkable when you scratch the surface,
- only works in an environment with only one religion, or
- ends up implying that atheists don't exist.

If you've come up with one that solves these problems, I'm all ears.

Of course, you should know that the "lack of belief in gods" definition is how people really do use the word. The "babies can't be atheists" objection is based on connotation, not denotation, like people thinking that it "sounds wrong" to describe the Pope as a bachelor, even though he meets the strict definition.

We are not discussing "how people use the the word." What we are discussing is the etymology. You are offering other reasons for why some people define the word as you do. I object to those reasons as well. But the of mine which you are using was only addressing one line of reasoning.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

We are not discussing "how people use the the word." What we are discussing is the etymology.

No, we aren't.

You are offering other reasons for why some people define the word as you do. I object to those reasons as well.

Not "some"; virtually all... even the ones who claim they don't.

But the of mine which you are using was only addressing one line of reasoning.

I have no idea what this sentence is supposed to mean.

 

[Curious George]

And why it is important for you to view it as a belief?

I already answered this. You said the answer was ridiculous. I asked why? You never responded.

I don't go around telling Christians what they believe and don't believe, as I am sure that would offend the majority of them. I may challenge their beliefs or lack of beliefs, but I can't tell them what they believe in; only they can do that. So why not let atheist defined their own beliefs or lack of beliefs? What's it to you?

Perhaps the root problem of this conflict isn't so much what atheist believe, but the fact they just don't like other people telling them what they believe. It is very presumptuous on your part.

It's when someone transposes "not-god belief" to "belief of no gods" that they end up with a faulty assumption. Couldn't it just as appropriately be "NOT god-belief?"

That is, why assume that atheism should be parsed as atheos-ism instead of a-theism? (Isn't word play fun?)

A quick hint here -- if someone is not sure about which definition is more appropriate, why not actually listen to real atheists who say it's "a-theism."

Here's is the problem guys. I am an atheist. If you both simply lack belief in gods, you are not of the same belief as me. If we should ask an atheist, what better atheist than me?

 

[Curious George]

No, we aren't.


Not "some"; virtually all... even the ones who claim they don't.


I have no idea what this sentence is supposed to mean.

Sorry, it was supposed to read you are using a quote of mine...

 

[Curious George]

No, we aren't.

Sure we are, follow the quotes back. I was addressing a line of reasoning proffered for why some people define atheism as...

That line of reasoning was etymology.

 

[viole]

and you could say this again?....as we stand before God and heaven

Nope. I will definitely not say that again in front of God and heaven.

Ciao

- viole

 

[Thumper]

I'm sorry those groups have a belief of "not-god?"

Nope. I'm an atheist,

We are not discussing "how people use the the word." What we are discussing is the etymology. You are offering other reasons for why some people define the word as you do. I object to those reasons as well. But the of mine which you are using was only addressing one line of reasoning.

No, you are changing the word by adding "os" so that you can make up your own etymology.

The word is "atheism" not "atheosism".

 

[Satans_Serrated_Edge]

I'm sorry those groups have a belief of "not-god?"

LOL

I suppose abstinence is a sexual orientation too right?

Again, some atheists BELIEVE there are no gods(myself for instance), while others do not. The former is a subsection of the latter.