Language, the most lovely evidence of God.

[mickiel]

Now that's a statement I won't argue with.
You haven't answered my question.
Can you give a reasonable explanation as to why you think that language is evidence of god other than your own unsupported opinion?

My opinion suits my consciousness and satisfys it, I feel no need to go outside of it.

I trust it complettely.

Peace.

 

[nrg]

Thats it in your head, but it goes much farther in mine.

Peace.

What do you mean? What's in my head? How does my head go further than yours? And what difference does that make?

I have to ask, can you be a little more concrete?

 

[mickiel]

What do you mean? What's in my head? How does my head go further than yours? And what difference does that make?

I have to ask, can you be a little more concrete?

You stated I proved " One Thing and thats it", I said I have proven more than one thing to myself in my head, in your head- only one thing. I said my head goes further.

Peace.

 

[mickiel]

The spoken word. Communication. Language. By the words of a few the future of mankind will be known.

And mankind willnot be able to claim that no one said nothing.

Peace.

 

[nrg]

You stated I proved " One Thing and thats it", I said I have proven more than one thing to myself in my head, in your head- only one thing. I said my head goes further.

So why not stop reason for ourselves and share it with others so that more people can use logic to arrive at a conclusion? I might've thought about this the wrong way, and it's the same with you, so why not share how we reasoned from start to finish?

How did you, through reasoning, prove that God exists starting from languages?

 

[Ozzie]

I myself love language. Words and their definition. Communication and the defining of it. Its very powerful and meaningful, it came from God, a very powerful and meaningful individual. It has metaphor. The most fascinating property of language is metaphors. Animals cannot make metaphors, it is by metaphors that language grows. A metaphor is a figure of speech in which a term or phrase is applied to something to which it is not literally applicable, in order to suggest a resemblance. As in " She is the flower of my life." Well she is not a literal flower, but the meaning is understandble.

This is the power and evidence of a God who has introduced this, certainly evolution has no power to introduce this. Absolutely none! A metaphor is always a known metaphier operating on a less known metaphrand. Animals are nowhere near this complexity, because they have nowhere near the consciousness that humans hold. Metaphors increase enormously our powers of perception of the world around us and our understanding of it. It literally creates. Indeed language is an organ of perception and a definte proof of God, not just simply a means of communication.

Its just lovely, and I want to go into this most lovely proof of God. And I will be using some perceptive language to describe it.

Peace.

Your perceptive language will have to be prescriptive in order for you to describe it. Good luck to you.

 

[Hijabihippie]

I am not an animal, I am not continous with the idiot hiearchy of speechless apes.

Peace.

Gorillas have been taught American Sign Language. They may not have speech by your definition, but they sure are capable of language.

 

[Hijabihippie]

But there is no functional difference between ASL and English. (other than vocab. sizes) They are both different methods to achieving the same thing.

I respectfully disagree. They do not function in the same way. ASL & other sign languages exist in space & time. English does not. As to vocabulary size, new signs are being invented all the time, so I'm not sure about that one.

 

[PolyHedral]

ASL & other sign languages exist in space & time. English does not.

You're going to have be more specific, since almost all audio engineers would disagree with that assertion.

 

[Hijabihippie]

When I am using ASL, I am moving my hands in a space in front of me. That involves time in that time elapses in that space & the space around me while I am signing.

 

[Thief]

All of this and no one mentioned....

The tower of Babel....God's immediate alteration of language.

And no one mentioned prayer.....which might not require words at all.

 

[yourhopeboundheart]

All of this and no one mentioned....

The tower of Babylon....God's immediate alteration of language.

And no one mentioned prayer.....which might not require words at all.

i think you're referring to the tower of babel.
and in the story of the tower of babel, god altered the language of the people (the word used was confounded), because they were accomplishing too much. these people would be capable of anything if they had clear communication, god said, and so he had to keep the people powerless by confusing their language.
read: hissy fit.

 

[mickiel]

Whats it feel like for Atheist to be on the run?

Run Atheist, run and sing.

Peace.

 

[Thief]

i think you're referring to the tower of babel.
and in the story of the tower of babel, god altered the language of the people (the word used was confounded), because they were accomplishing too much. these people would be capable of anything if they had clear communication, god said, and so he had to keep the people powerless by confusing their language.
read: hissy fit.

Thanks for the edit....I was thread hopping rather quickly....

I thought the language was confused to hinder a method of reaching heaven that is actually unrealistic.
The change in communication would stop construction, and give people something to think about.

Consider what your thoughts might be if suddenly you spoke well enough,
but your own voice sounds different...and no one understands you.

People keep saying prove God to me....
would this not be a testimony?

Or do you want to treat the story as another myth?

 

[yourhopeboundheart]

in your defense, there is a ziggurat at babylon that might have influenced the story while the people of israel were captives to the babylonians.

I thought the language was confused to hinder a method of reaching heaven that is actually unrealistic.
The change in communication would stop construction, and give people something to think about.

Consider what your thoughts might be if suddenly you spoke well enough,
but your own voice sounds different...and no one understands you.

People keep saying prove God to me....
would this not be a testimony?

if this was the god that proved himself, it would not incur worship, it would incur spite and anger. the thought that a benevolent god would do something like 'confound' language to the effect of confusing a group of people who were working well together is not benevolent. and wouldn't the story go just about the same if he would have let things play out and allow altitude sickness to have stopped construction. he must have known that building a tower high enough to get to 'heaven' would have resulted in a prematurely halted construction due to the way he had 'created' the planet. i mean, even if they didn't allow altitude to be the factor that cut their plans short (which would mean that they had the technology to bottle and utilize oxygen in tanks, when they didn't) the issue of atmosphere would have kept them out of the heavens. the god that created the universe would know that this idea wouldn't have gone far, even without intervention. particularly if he was omniscient.

Or do you want to treat the story as another myth?

i dont know that we're left with any other option. there are much better explanations as to why language is varied.

 

[Etritonakin]

The most fascintating use of language concerning the use of language (in my opinion) is the following....

Zep 3:9 For then will I turn to the people a pure language, that they may all call upon the name of the LORD, to serve him with one consent.

The purpose of language is to make another understand/know something. Our present languages are "impure" because they were constructed by beings new to the universe to describe our limited understanding -and change as our understanding changes (which is not always a positive change).

A pure language given by God would be based on his perspective. Having created all things and defined their purpose, the pure language would be based on such. It also might not allow for misunderstanding due to multiple meanings, etc...

I also find the evolution of accents quite fascinating.

 

[Thief]

in your defense, there is a ziggurat at babylon that might have influenced the story while the people of israel were captives to the babylonians.


if this was the god that proved himself, it would not incur worship, it would incur spite and anger. the thought that a benevolent god would do something like 'confound' language to the effect of confusing a group of people who were working well together is not benevolent. and wouldn't the story go just about the same if he would have let things play out and allow altitude sickness to have stopped construction. he must have known that building a tower high enough to get to 'heaven' would have resulted in a prematurely halted construction due to the way he had 'created' the planet. i mean, even if they didn't allow altitude to be the factor that cut their plans short (which would mean that they had the technology to bottle and utilize oxygen in tanks, when they didn't) the issue of atmosphere would have kept them out of the heavens. the god that created the universe would know that this idea wouldn't have gone far, even without intervention. particularly if he was omniscient.


i dont know that we're left with any other option. there are much better explanations as to why language is varied.

You added emotional assumptions, to the story.
As if God insists upon His own glory.

Struck and confounded the language to halt construction....yes.
He did it for spite?...no.

Heaven was thought to be immediately over head.
All you needed was a means to get there.
This misconception would have proven itself if construction had continued.
Why bother?....to flex the language...why not let it play out?

Heaven had been cut off....no access.
Various stories with various causes.....

Learning the nature of heaven.....by hand made construction?...no.
The people needed something to think about.

 

[PolyHedral]

The most fascintating use of language concerning the use of language (in my opinion) is the following....

Zep 3:9 For then will I turn to the people a pure language, that they may all call upon the name of the LORD, to serve him with one consent.

The purpose of language is to make another understand/know something. Our present languages are "impure" because they were constructed by beings new to the universe to describe our limited understanding -and change as our understanding changes (which is not always a positive change).

A pure language given by God would be based on his perspective. Having created all things and defined their purpose, the pure language would be based on such. It also might not allow for misunderstanding due to multiple meanings, etc...

I also find the evolution of accents quite fascinating.

There's already unambiguous, well-defined languages, at least if formal logic can be described as a "language."

 

[MW0082]

Whats it feel like for Atheist to be on the run?

Run Atheist, run and sing.

Peace.

matture,..... wow

 

[Etritonakin]

There's already unambiguous, well-defined languages, at least if formal logic can be described as a "language."

It's "There are". (hehehehe sorry -imperfect language humor)

True -there are aspects of any language which would still exist in such a pure language -and languages we develop for specific purposes can be pure -even perfect for those purposes -(programming codes/languages, etc..).
The pure language spoken of in the bible would be a universal, spoken/written, etc.. language, however -its main function would be allowing all to serve God with one consent.

It would also originate from God's perspective -which is a complete perspective.
Even scientists find that their languages need to be altered as their understanding increases -and due to the creation of words and phrases based on imperfect perception, words often change meaning or are discarded as they are found to represent nothing true.

Such a pure language might include vast amounts of knowledge -words for things and concepts we have yet to imagine -but the principles thereof might also allow for learning at a much faster rate -without possibility of misunderstanding.

We develop languages as we go. Altering and expanding these languages actually slows progress -whereas a pure language given by one who created all that we can know (apart from what we create) -and who knows that our purpose is to create infinitely -might allow us to go where we can much faster and with greater ease -and create more efficiently.
This is even more true due to its universality. No more translating -no more languages which cannot be directly translated, etc...
No more of one person saying one thing and all present misunderstanding, etc....