Lauren Southern makes it into Australia

[Shad]

I've also heard her say that the white ethnostate is a utopian idea. My idea of utopia isn't one where people are murdered or forcibly displaced from their homes on the grounds that they aren't white, but I guess that makes me extreme left.

Are you sure that wasn't sarcasm?

 

[Estro Felino]

She is an identitarian which has host of problems due to association issues for and against.

What's wrong with being an identitarian?

 

[Yerda]

Are you sure that wasn't sarcasm?

Not 100%. I'd have to watch it again.

 

[Shad]

What's wrong with being an identitarian?

As it holds views and policy which align with white nationalist but for different goals. This ends up causing people to associate and project views from one group on to the other. In politics different group often find themselves under the same banner due to a policy. See any common GOP smear for example.

 

[columbus]

She is an identitarian which has host of problems due to association issues for and against.

I am not quite sure what that means, but it sounds a lot like @Epic Beard Man.
Tom

 

[Yerda]

I've listened to Southern speak a few times. I don't hear her being a white nationalist. I hear her defending western secular culture. Sadly, a lot of folks on the extreme left these days equate those two - very different - stances.

Also, for reference: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_genocide_conspiracy_theory

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Identitarian_movement

 

[Shad]

I am not quite sure what that means, but it sounds a lot like @Epic Beard Man.
Tom

She is a counter-reactionary to some of his views posted.

 

[columbus]

She is a counter-reactionary to some of his views posted.

Extremists often sound alike to me.
Tom

 

[Shad]

Also, for reference: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_genocide_conspiracy_theory

She does not believe it was a planned goal. See this is the problem I am talking about. Similar talking points are highlighted when details are ignored. She sees the decline in birthrates as a consequence of policy rather than the goal of.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Identitarian_movement

Different movement. She is reactionary to radicals on the left says absurd things. Things which are often ignored by MSM.

 

[icehorse]

I've heard her talk several times also. She probably isn't a white nationalist, it's hard to say. She does a fine job of rebranding it on occasion. This is reheated daily stormer chat:

White Genocide is how you might have heard of it before.

I've also heard her say that the white ethnostate is a utopian idea. My idea of utopia isn't one where people are murdered or forcibly displaced from their homes on the grounds that they aren't white, but I guess that makes me extreme left.

First off, traditionally, countries have had immigration policies for the purpose of strengthening the country taking in immigrants. There is no compulsion to allow immigrants, it's done voluntarily. Put yet another way, no one has the right to immigrate.

Second, do you think there is something wrong with a country defending its culture? Many on the extreme left have come to believe that western societies "owe it" to the rest of the world to have open borders and to allow their cultures to be overwhelmed with foreigners and foreign culture. Is that where you're coming from?

None of this is to say that wealthy countries shouldn't help poor countries. Of course they should! But the math is such that immigration is only a symbolic gesture. If wealthy countries really want to help poor countries, then "aid in place" is far more effective.

 

[Shad]

Extremists often sound alike to me.
Tom

The rhetoric is similar in a lot of cases.

 

[Estro Felino]

She is a counter-reactionary to some of his views posted.

I posted a video in post #127.
After watching that video, don't you think that it's natural and spontaneous that identitarian parties and movements have become so successful in Europe?

White Genocide is how you might have heard of it before.

I've also heard her say that the white ethnostate is a utopian idea. My idea of utopia isn't one where people are murdered or forcibly displaced from their homes on the grounds that they aren't white, but I guess that makes me extreme left.

There is a vicious circle going on. Global economy causes poverty...which leads to very low birth rates (my country has one of the lowest in the world) .
And they think that importing migrants will solve the issue...instead of worsening it.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

First off, traditionally, countries have had immigration policies for the purpose of strengthening the country taking in immigrants. There is no compulsion to allow immigrants, it's done voluntarily. Put yet another way, no one has the right to immigrate.

Second, do you think there is something wrong with a country defending its culture? Many on the extreme left have come to believe that western societies "owe it" to the rest of the world to have open borders and to allow their cultures to be overwhelmed with foreigners and foreign culture. Is that where you're coming from?

None of this is to say that wealthy countries shouldn't help poor countries. Of course they should! But the math is such that immigration is only a symbolic gesture. If wealthy countries really want to help poor countries, then "aid in place" is far more effective.

Yeah, those under the radar sharia courts are just hell on culture.

 

[Shad]

I posted a video in post #127.
After watching that video, don't you think that it's natural and spontaneous that identitarian parties and movements have become so successful in Europe?

The European movements never disappeared. It was just buried under a facade. Granted these movements made smart political moves by gaining support from the public on shared policy as I pointed out earlier. Again if someone is for restricted immigration as a major voting point but the only party supporting has a questionable ideology many could compromise for the sake of that policy. Far too many European parties follow policy which are being rejected so at times there are few options. Hold you nose and vote or abstain.

 

[icehorse]

Yeah, those under the radar sharia courts are just hell on culture.

Based on previous debates with you, I've concluded that you have little interest in defending secularism. You might try living in a theocracy for a while and see how that goes for you.

 

[CruzNichaphor]

I wonder if something similar to this might happen in Aus:

 

[Yerda]

Put yet another way, no one has the right to immigrate.

Well, in the EU we do. That aside, we're in agreement.

Second, do you think there is something wrong with a country defending its culture?

Not at all.

If wealthy countries really want to help poor countries, then "aid in place" is far more effective.

I agree completely.

I'm quite far left in most of what I want to happen in the world, but I'm not a dreamer - I know we need to control our borders.

What I'm suggesting is that the video I linked to is a laundered variant of the white genocide trope. You don't have to be an open borders hippy to find that, and her, repellent and dangerous.

 

[Estro Felino]

What I'm suggesting is that the video I linked to is a laundered variant of the white genocide trope. You don't have to be an open borders hippy to find that, and her, repellent and dangerous.

She is repellent and dangerous?
Look...I know better Stefan Molyneux than her...but both are quite rational.

 

[Lyndon]

Yes, anti immigrant sentiment in Europe goes right back to Nazi Germany and follows in its footsteps.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

Based on previous debates with you, I've concluded that you have little interest in defending secularism. You might try living in a theocracy for a while and see how that goes for you.

*LOL* What single thing have I ever said that remotely supports that conclusion, pray tell?