LDS Beliefs and the Bible (6 Discussions)

[FFH]

Do you understand the historical Protestant position in refuting the authorative claims of Rome and Salt Lake City? Please post my anwer to you.

Rome claims apostolic succession, but cannot prove it.

Salt Lake claims apostolic succession but cannot prove it.

Okay so there's no difference, but for what it's worth, we actually have been given God's authority to act in his name, by these resurrected beings/apostles of the Lord.

 

[Katzpur]

I think if I were LDS I would have stopped responding to these sort of threads long ago, and stuck with answering genuine questions in the DIR.
Why do you guys keep slogging on? Why not just link 'em to one of the (does quick count) 4,379 threads on the exact same questions that already exist?

From my perspective... There is only one reason that I keep responding. When someone makes a false statement about what my Church teaches and attempts to mislead people, if I remain silent, my silence will probably be interpreted as agreement. We feel compelled to set the facts straight when people intentionally distort them.

 

[Fish-Hunter]

Rome claims apostolic succession, but cannot prove it.

Salt Lake claims apostolic succession but cannot prove it.

Okay so there's no difference, but for what it's worth, we actually have been given God's authority to act in his name, by these resurrected beings/apostles of the Lord.

That would not be my answer as a Protestant Christian. However, since you brought up this point, did you know many other religious institutions make the exact same claim as Rome and Salt Lake City? Many religious institutions and religious leaders claim that they are speaking as God's final authority. The Jehovah Witness Watchtower organization makes a similar claim as Rome and Salt Lake City. There are many many more religious groups making an apostolic succession type of claim as compared to appealing to the Holy Bible as final authority. Please see the thread called "Final Authority" for continual insight on our ongoing discussions.

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/general-religious-debates/67051-final-authority.html

 

[Katzpur]

That would not be my answer as a Protestant Christian. However, since you brought up this point, did you know many other religious institutions make the exact same claim as Rome and Salt Lake City? Many religious institutions and religious leaders claim that they are speaking as God's final authority. The Jehovah Witness Watchtower organization makes a similar claim as Rome and Salt Lake City. There are many many more religious groups making an apostolic succession type of claim as compared to appealing to the Holy Bible as final authority. Please see the thread called "Final Authority" for continual insight on our ongoing discussions.

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/general-religious-debates/67051-final-authority.html

That's absolute nonsense. The Jehovah's Witnesses don't claim apostolic authority. They claim that all of their doctrines can be found within the pages of the Bible. Yes, they are Restorationists, but they don't even believe apostolic authority is necessary. (How they get around that, I'll never know.)

 

[Sententia]

That's absolute nonsense. The Jehovah's Witnesses don't claim apostolic authority. They claim that all of their doctrines can be found within the pages of the Bible. Yes, they are Restorationists, but they don't even believe apostolic authority is necessary. (How they get around that, I'll never know.)

The Church of the Watchtower Society... They use the king james though but they teach interpretation of the bible to back their dotrines.

They actually have a quite reasoned approach though for not celebrating the holidays tying each to the pagan celebrations they once were.

 

[Katzpur]

The Church of the Watchtower Society... They use the king james though but they teach interpretation of the bible to back their dotrines.

Yes, I know. I think that's one reason why we continue to use the KJV in our discussions with people not of our faith, and it's the reason I disagree with FFH that we should only use Joseph Smith's translation. Having common ground is the first step towards understanding, and it gets you nowhere fast to use a translation that is only acceptable to one party.

They actually have a quite reasoned approach though for not celebrating the holidays tying each to the pagan celebrations they once were.

I agree with them in theory, but I see their perspective as kind of fanatical. I celebrate Christmas, regardless of its pagan origins, because it recalls to my mind the birth of Jesus Christ. I honestly think God is far more upset with people who feel the need to bash one another over relatively insignificant issues such as this one than He is with people like me to enjoy decorating a Christmas tree once a year.

 

[FFH]

Yes, I know. I think that's one reason why we continue to use the KJV in our discussions with people not of our faith, and it's the reason I disagree with FFH that we should only use Joseph Smith's translation. Having common ground is the first step towards understanding, and it gets you nowhere fast to use a translation that is only acceptable to one party.

I post the two versions, JST and KJV, when the King James is in error, otherwise I just post the King James, if I know it's not in error.

We only have common ground with the KJV, when it's not in error, according to the Articles of Faith, "We believe in the Bible as long as it's translated correctly".

If the King James states, "God is a spirit," then we have no common ground with the King James Bible.

I agree with them in theory, but I see their perspective as kind of fanatical. I celebrate Christmas, regardless of its pagan origins, because it recalls to my mind the birth of Jesus Christ. I honestly think God is far more upset with people who feel the need to bash one another over relatively insignificant issues such as this one than He is with people like me to enjoy decorating a Christmas tree once a year.

Uh oh, don't get me started on the Santa (Satan) thing again...

 

[Theocan]

I post the two versions, JST and KJV, when the King James is in error, otherwise I just post the King James, if I know it's not in error.

We only have common ground with the KJV, when it's not in error, according to the Articles of Faith, "We believe in the Bible as long as it's translated correctly".

If the King James states, "God is a spirit," then we have no common ground with the King James Bible.

Uh oh, don't get me started on the Santa (Satan) thing again...

This is my biggest problem with Mormonism, because they see God as a man. An immortal man.

 

[Katzpur]

This is my biggest problem with Mormonism, because they see God as a man. An immortal man.

I would just love to debate this with you, but not on this thread. If you're ever interested, let me know. We could either do a one-on-one or a same-faith debate or whatever you want. This is one of my favorite topics, by the way.

 

[Theocan]

I would just love to debate this with you, but not on this thread. If you're ever interested, let me know. We could either do a one-on-one or a same-faith debate or whatever you want. This is one of my favorite topics, by the way.

Okay, I think this would be fun and informative

 

[Katzpur]

If the King James states, "God is a spirit," then we have no common ground with the King James Bible.

You know what? Even if we use the KJV, there are quite a number of ways of interpreting that verse besides it meaning, "God's just a big blob of air."

Uh oh, don't get me started on the Santa (Satan) thing again...

I wouldn't even think of it. And don't you either!

 

[Theocan]

Hey Katzpur, I made a thread for us to debate
http://www.religiousforums.com/foru...manifestation-god-spirit-man.html#post1195509

 

[Orontes]

Hey Katzpur, I made a thread for us to debate
http://www.religiousforums.com/foru...manifestation-god-spirit-man.html#post1195509

Too bad this is only a one on one discussion.

 

[McBell]

Too bad this is only a one on one discussion.

Start the discussion thread.
On another forum I frequent, there have been many times the discussion thread was much more active and lively and informative than the one on one thread it was created to discuss.

 

[Theocan]

Okay Where in the forum shall I make it an open discussion?

 

[FFH]

Hey Katzpur, I made a thread for us to debate

The King James is in gross error here.

God is not a spirit.

The verse numbers will be different because of missing and incorrect scripture.

John 4 (King James)
19 The woman saith unto him, Sir, I perceive that thou art a prophet.

20 Our fathers worshipped in this mountain; and ye say, that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship.

21 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father.

22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.

23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.(incorrect verse)

25 The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things.

26 Jesus saith unto her, I who speak unto thee am he.


Notice the difference in the verse numbers.

John 4 (Joseph Smith inspired version)
21 The woman said unto him, Sir, I perceive that thou art a prophet.

22 Our fathers worshipped in this mountain; and ye say that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship.

23 Jesus said unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father.

24 Ye worship ye know not what; we know what we worship; and salvation is of the Jews.

25 And the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshipers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth; for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

26 For unto such hath God promised his Spirit. And they who worship him, must worship in spirit and in truth. (corrected verse)

27 The woman said unto him, I know that Messias cometh, who is called Christ; when he is come, he will tell us all things.

28 Jesus said unto her, I who speak unto thee am the Messias.

 

[Theocan]

We can debate this issue here: The Manifestation of God (Spirit or Man?)

 

[Orontes]

Start the discussion thread.
On another forum I frequent, there have been many times the discussion thread was much more active and lively and informative than the one on one thread it was created to discuss.

It looks like one has been started. I'll go there.

We can debate this issue here: The Manifestation of God (Spirit or Man?)

 

[FFH]

Jesus is God the Son.

Jesus is the creator of this world and the God of the Old and New Testament..

Jesus is God.

Jesus came to show us who the Father (God) is and what characteristics a god has, that being a man like any other, only perfect and immortal.

Luke 24: 39
Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

Doctrine and Covenants 129
1 There are two kinds of beings in heaven, namely: Angels, who are resurrected personages, having bodies of flesh and bones—

2 For instance, Jesus said: Handle me and see, for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

 

[SimonCross]

Hello
These are some cool photos/pictures I have just!
Finding God is for the person to find on her/his own, but there are those along the way who pop up to lend a hand in one's mission as guides they light the way. It is amazing to see so many faiths and it is interesting to read but as all things no matter what path we take it leads back to the one that is God!!