Legalize Marijuana?

[lamplighter]

As Father Heathen pointed out, it wasn't THC that killed her. For all practical purposes, it's impossible to have a fatal overdose of marijuana.

Yeah I have to agree here, she either consumed something else, or she had a predisposition for schizophrenia to begin with, which would have come up later anyway.

However, you did touch on something else that I think is important: the idea that marijuana is a gateway drug to harder and more dangerous drugs. To a certain degree, I think this is true: for many people, buying marijuana is their first introduction into the underground economy of drugs: if the guy who sells you pot can't sell you harder stuff as well, he probably knows someone who can.

Effectively, what we've done through our legal structure is create a ladder for people to climb up, where every higher rung is a nice, easy step from the one below: first, you start with legal drugs. Then, you move on to illegal "soft" drugs like pot, that have equivalent (or lesser) harm than legal ones. This makes the step from "soft" to "hard" drugs much more manageable.

Personally, I do have a problem with hard drugs: I think that they can be very damaging, both to individuals and to societies. I would be quite happy if we could eradicate drugs like crack and heroin. I think the best way to do this is to make that climb up the "drug ladder" as difficult as possible, and I think the best way to do that is to take out a "rung" by making pot legal. If marijuana users never have to delve into that illegal drug market, then the step from pot to harder drugs become much more daunting, and therefore one that fewer people will take.

And this doesn't even address the significant harm associated with the illegal trade in drugs. Around here, biker gangs have made the production, distribution and sale of marijuana big business... and they have no qualms about using violence to gain market share from their competitors, much like the mobsters and bootleggers who engaged in violence for the alcohol trade during prohibition. And just like with alcohol, if marijuana is made legal, this violence would go away.

The La Guardia Committee Report also stated that marijuana is NOT a gateway drug. I have come to the same conclusion as well, if it was legalized and you got rid of the drug dealer factor, people wouldn't be exposed to situations that led to harder drug use. I mean if caffeine was illegal and you had to go to a drug dealer to get coffee, IMO it would result in coffee being just as much of a gateway drug as marijuana is now.

 

[lamplighter]

cigarettes and Alcohol are legal here but counterfeit and smuggled smokes and booze is big business , because no one wants to pay the tax. If they legalized it you could grow your own skunk for yourself and you could make a fortune selling it cheaper than the legal stuff with tax on.---------- oh thats illegal

I suppose this is true, last year there was a bust here in Mississippi, someone was making a bunch of Moonshine and selling it, even though it is legal to distill a personal amount of Moonshine for one's self, but tax evasion seems a little less problematic than violating everyone's rights. But if you could grow it yourself, how much money could you really make off of it? Growing marijuana isn't as involved as distilling alcohol or growing and curing tobacco, sure growing skunk with a hydroponic set up might be, but would the average person even bother buying it if they can grow their own regular stuff easily enough, and how much more expensive would taxed marijuana be in comparison to what it costs on the street anyway?

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Growing marijuana isn't as involved as distilling alcohol or growing and curing tobacco, sure growing skunk with a hydroponic set up might be, but would the average person even bother buying it if they can grow their own regular stuff easily enough, and how much more expensive would taxed marijuana be in comparison to what it costs on the street anyway?

See, I agree. They can go ahead and make it legal...then people will just grow there own at home without fear of getting caught. Truth be told a DIY Hydro setup is easier and cheaper these days but the home grown stuff (basic) is a no brainer.

When they make it legal I think I'll start my own Weed Lounge, You know...similar to a cigar lounge but I'll also serve food.......Ahh yea baby....

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I suppose this is true, last year there was a bust here in Mississippi, someone was making a bunch of Moonshine and selling it, even though it is legal to distill a personal amount of Moonshine for one's self, but tax evasion seems a little less problematic than violating everyone's rights.

Really?

Here, distilling without a licence is illegal... and IMO with good reason: if you don't know what you're doing you'll end up with wood alcohol, which can blind or kill you.

With home fermenting, this concern isn't there; really, the worst a homebrewer could do would be to make a beer that tastes really bad or is way too fizzy.

But if you could grow it yourself, how much money could you really make off of it? Growing marijuana isn't as involved as distilling alcohol or growing and curing tobacco, sure growing skunk with a hydroponic set up might be, but would the average person even bother buying it if they can grow their own regular stuff easily enough, and how much more expensive would taxed marijuana be in comparison to what it costs on the street anyway?

I don't know. But it's not that involved to make bread, cookies or coffee, but plenty of stores do lots of business selling those things.

Anyhow, this is only a problem if you look at things from a certain way. To me, the big issue is the link between organized crime and pot. Whether you're buying your weed legally or growing it yourself, that link is broken.

 

[methylatedghosts]

Hey I have a question.....Isn't Amsterdam doing OK with legalized weed or is that just fallacy or media hype?

Far as I know, they're doing great!

You're allowed to carry a small amount for personal use - leaves police to deal with the drugs with a higher social impact like cocaine and heroin, instead of running around after small-time recreational pot smokers.

Note: most of the customers in hash cafes in Amsterdam are tourists - not locals.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Far as I know, they're doing great!

You're allowed to carry a small amount for personal use - leaves police to deal with the drugs with a higher social impact like cocaine and heroin, instead of running around after small-time recreational pot smokers.

Note: most of the customers in hash cafes in Amsterdam are tourists - not locals.

Yea....I thought I remember watching a Discovery special about them. Woohoo..way to go Amsterdam.

 

[kai]

I suppose this is true, last year there was a bust here in Mississippi, someone was making a bunch of Moonshine and selling it, even though it is legal to distill a personal amount of Moonshine for one's self, but tax evasion seems a little less problematic than violating everyone's rights. But if you could grow it yourself, how much money could you really make off of it? Growing marijuana isn't as involved as distilling alcohol or growing and curing tobacco, sure growing skunk with a hydroponic set up might be, but would the average person even bother buying it if they can grow their own regular stuff easily enough, and how much more expensive would taxed marijuana be in comparison to what it costs on the street anyway?

How much money could you make out of it ? good skunk here fetches £150 per ounce.

i dont know about yours but our government taxes the hell out of everything. hence the market for smuggled and counterfiet Tobbaco and alcohol which is legal here. at one time everyman and his dog was going to france and loading up duty frees coming back and selling it , then they cracked down and started confiscating peoples vehicles etc so now its mainly organised crime doing it.

If they legalised it here which is unlikely as they have just reclassified it from class C to class B, they would probably make it so expensive that people would still buy it from dealers.

 

[England my lionheart]

Far as I know, they're doing great!

You're allowed to carry a small amount for personal use - leaves police to deal with the drugs with a higher social impact like cocaine and heroin, instead of running around after small-time recreational pot smokers.

Note: most of the customers in hash cafes in Amsterdam are tourists - not locals.

This is true,when i visited Amsterdam it was packed with tourists and the Caf'es are great but you cannot drink and smoke in the same room and all have seperate floors for each recreation.

 

[Zephyr]

YouTube - Cannabis & Multiple Sclerosis

Seriously, check it out, it's only just over 2 minutes of your time. This is a clip from "The Union: The Business Behind Getting High" where they interview a MM patient with severe Multiple Sclerosis. Just compare how he goes from shaking like mad (as well as being nearly incapable of speech) to mostly normal (and at least able to function just fine) after smoking. I've seen this in person many times before with a friend's family member.

How much money could you make out of it ? good skunk here fetches £150 per ounce.

Weed is making big money because it's so illegal. For instance, around here (and a lot of the country) it can go for about 10 bucks a gram (though the unit price does go down in quantity) to 200 or so for an ounce. 200 an ounce for something that is ****-easy to grow (unless you're going for high-potency quality weed). It's only so pricey because it's illegal. Btw, that 10 bucks for a gram? Imagine that as a single cigarette. Does your government tax things so severely that a single cigarette costs anywhere close to 10 bucks (£7)? If it were legalized, the only way people would buy from dealers is if they gutted their prices, or if taxes were through the roof.

 

[lamplighter]

How much money could you make out of it ? good skunk here fetches £150 per ounce.

i dont know about yours but our government taxes the hell out of everything. hence the market for smuggled and counterfiet Tobbaco and alcohol which is legal here. at one time everyman and his dog was going to france and loading up duty frees coming back and selling it , then they cracked down and started confiscating peoples vehicles etc so now its mainly organised crime doing it.

If they legalised it here which is unlikely as they have just reclassified it from class C to class B, they would probably make it so expensive that people would still buy it from dealers.

Why is the UK cracking down on marijuana when so many other places are looking to at least decriminalize it?

Weed is making big money because it's so illegal. For instance, around here (and a lot of the country) it can go for about 10 bucks a gram (though the unit price does go down in quantity) to 200 or so for an ounce. 200 an ounce for something that is ****-easy to grow (unless you're going for high-potency quality weed). It's only so pricey because it's illegal. Btw, that 10 bucks for a gram? Imagine that as a single cigarette. Does your government tax things so severely that a single cigarette costs anywhere close to 10 bucks (£7)? If it were legalized, the only way people would buy from dealers is if they gutted their prices, or if taxes were through the roof.

I hope I don't break rule six again, but that's at least twice as much as it costs throughout the south of the US. It's anywhere from $80-100 per once, with prices broken down accordingly. Of course drugs being sold illegally is probably the purist form of capitalism this day and age. So it could just be the area you live in has no competition, it's hard to obtain, inflation is high, or a combination of the above.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

For instance, around here (and a lot of the country) it can go for about 10 bucks a gram (though the unit price does go down in quantity) to 200 or so for an ounce. 200 an ounce for something that is ****-easy to grow (unless you're going for high-potency quality weed). It's only so pricey because it's illegal. Btw, that 10 bucks for a gram? Imagine that as a single cigarette. Does your government tax things so severely that a single cigarette costs anywhere close to 10 bucks (£7)?

Damn, that's expensive. While I have seen even more expensive for very high quality, it's usually about half price.

Growing marijuana isn't as involved as distilling alcohol or growing and curing tobacco, sure growing skunk with a hydroponic set up might be, but would the average person even bother buying it if they can grow their own regular stuff easily enough, and how much more expensive would taxed marijuana be in comparison to what it costs on the street anyway?

I really doubt a legal market for weed would have very high prices, just because anyone could grow and smoke their own. While their is a gold mine in taxes to be made, the government can't set too many taxes or price floors too high or then people will just grow their own, or just go through someone else that does.

 

[Zephyr]

For the record, that 200/oz estimation was mostly due to the fact that there is seemingly no brickweed in the Pacific Northwest. It's all higher-end, which really skews things.

 

[kai]

YouTube - Cannabis & Multiple Sclerosis

Seriously, check it out, it's only just over 2 minutes of your time. This is a clip from "The Union: The Business Behind Getting High" where they interview a MM patient with severe Multiple Sclerosis. Just compare how he goes from shaking like mad (as well as being nearly incapable of speech) to mostly normal (and at least able to function just fine) after smoking. I've seen this in person many times before with a friend's family member.


Weed is making big money because it's so illegal. For instance, around here (and a lot of the country) it can go for about 10 bucks a gram (though the unit price does go down in quantity) to 200 or so for an ounce. 200 an ounce for something that is ****-easy to grow (unless you're going for high-potency quality weed). It's only so pricey because it's illegal. Btw, that 10 bucks for a gram? Imagine that as a single cigarette. Does your government tax things so severely that a single cigarette costs anywhere close to 10 bucks (£7)? If it were legalized, the only way people would buy from dealers is if they gutted their prices, or if taxes were through the roof.

a pack of cigarettes carries a tax of about £3.27 its enough tax for people to buy off criminals instead. in order for cannabis to be decriminalized completely it would have to be cheaper than tobacco. or not worth while smuggling or producing for sale illegally.

 

[kai]

Why is the UK cracking down on marijuana when so many other places are looking to at least decriminalize it?

I hope I don't break rule six again, but that's at least twice as much as it costs throughout the south of the US. It's anywhere from $80-100 per once, with prices broken down accordingly. Of course drugs being sold illegally is probably the purist form of capitalism this day and age. So it could just be the area you live in has no competition, it's hard to obtain, inflation is high, or a combination of the above.

Mainly due to concerns over Skunk which is a far diferent animal than the cannabis the government was thinking about when it lowered the classification.


Since cannabis was downgraded there has been widespread concern about the increased prevalence of stronger "skunk" varieties. Ms Smith said this now accounted for 80% of the cannabis seized on the streets and the drug was nearly three times stronger than in 1995.
BBC NEWS | Politics | Cannabis laws to be strengthened
Gordon Brown planning clampdown on cannabis over health concerns - Times Online

 

[Zephyr]

Mainly due to concerns over Skunk which is a far diferent animal than the cannabis the government was thinking about when it lowered the classification.


Since cannabis was downgraded there has been widespread concern about the increased prevalence of stronger "skunk" varieties. Ms Smith said this now accounted for 80% of the cannabis seized on the streets and the drug was nearly three times stronger than in 1995.
BBC NEWS | Politics | Cannabis laws to be strengthened
Gordon Brown planning clampdown on cannabis over health concerns - Times Online

Oh no, a more potent weed! Just wait until they find hash. Weed being stronger does not cause any ill effects that brickweed doesn't. People are going to get high all the same. All that changes is the amount of material used. "Skunk" isn't a far different animal than cannabis any more than vodka is a far different animal from beer.

 

[kai]

Oh no, a more potent weed! Just wait until they find hash. Weed being stronger does not cause any ill effects that brickweed doesn't. People are going to get high all the same. All that changes is the amount of material used. "Skunk" isn't a far different animal than cannabis any more than vodka is a far different animal from beer.

#
and a domestic cat isnt a far different animal than a tiger LoL

 

[Dezzie]

It's hard to say whether it should be legalized or not... One reason being is that, people do it anyway... what would the difference be?

I personally dislike drugs and alcohol. It has never been my scene and I plan to keep it that way. One reason why legalizing it may be bad is that people will have easier and more ways of getting their hands on it. I'm sure people that do it would smoke it constantly, instead of just sneaking it. People should realize their actions and what's good for you and what's not. I do not want drugs anywhere near me, so that would be the only thing I ask... that people keep it confined to their own home. There are many people out there that have no respect for anothers feelings on the issue and that is what drives me crazy.

In a way it wouldn't make any sense why they would legalize alcohol after all the dangers it causes and then not legalize marijuana... Alcohol is one of the leading causes in death... lol what would the difference be? All drugs are dangerous... whether they be for medical purposes or not but they can also be very helpful.

It's hard to give an answer to this question... I would say to not legalize it because of my morals but it truly doesn't make sense about the alcohol thing.

 

[McBell]

They needs legalize it, regulate it, then tax the hades out of it.
At least then they will have some sort of control over it.....

 

[kai]

i don't really care if they legalese it or not what i do care about is finding out whether its harmful or not in itself, and the actual act of burning and inhaling a substance any substance cannot be good for you, i wouldn't try to stop you doing it ,its your funeral after all but you have to know don't you?




However, we conclude that there is now sufficient evidence to warn young people that using cannabis could increase their risk of developing a psychotic illness later in life.

Cannabis use and risk of psychotic or affective mental health outcomes: a systematic review : The Lancet


Robin Murray, professor of psychiatry at London's Institute of Psychiatry, estimates that at least 25,000 of the 250,000 schizophrenics in the UK could have avoided the illness if they had not used cannabis. "The number of people taking cannabis may not be rising, but what people are taking is much more powerful, so there is a question of whether a few years on we may see more people getting ill as a consequence of that."


Cannabis: An apology - Health News, Health & Wellbeing - The Independent

 

[DarkSun]

I can guarentee one thing... If cannabis is decriminalised people will grow to regret it.

That will be my last post for this thread.