Let's Give Thanks That A&E Ate That Apple

[Audie]

everything
pronoun
ev·ery·thing | \ ˈev-rē-ˌthiŋ \
Definition of everything
1a : all that **exists**

The future does not “exist”.....yet.

Oh? I thought "god" is omnipresent.
And omnipresent.

And how can he know the future he is bound by time?

Also-

I wonder if you have ever thought about how
God must be a cowboy, at heart.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Why would God build a fence or put the tree elsewhere? He had it there for a purpose. Obviously, God knew they would eat the fruit, but nevertheless, He gave them clear instructions not to. They didn't have to eat the fruit. God had given them a beautiful home with everything they needed. He loved and interacted with them daily..They made the choice to listen to the lies of the serpent and ignore the words of God. They betrayed the loving relationship with God and broke trust.
The tree was there to give them a choice. A very simple test of their loyalty. They chose to trust lies and their own perceptions over the wisdom, goodness, and love of God.

But God knew they would fail the test and gave them the apple anyway... so he must have wanted them to eat it.

You talk about loyalty; wasn't God capable of instilling then with enough loyalty to pass the test? Also, in the story, it was only Adam's loyalty to God that was really tested. God never tells Eve directly not to eat the apple; she only ever gets hearsay from Adam.

And the test: who was it for? Not God: he already knew the outcome. Presumably, then, it was for Adam and Eve... but what lesson are they supposed to take from it? Isn't it God's way of telling them "I have made you to be flawed creatures?"

 

[Audie]

But God knew they would fail the test and gave them the apple anyway... so he must have wanted them to eat it.

You talk about loyalty; wasn't God capable of instilling then with enough loyalty to pass the test? Also, in the story, it was only Adam's loyalty to God that was really tested. God never tells Eve directly not to eat the apple; she only ever gets hearsay from Adam.

And the test: who was it for? Not God: he already knew the outcome. Presumably, then, it was for Adam and Eve... but what lesson are they supposed to take from it? Isn't it God's way of telling them "I have made you to be flawed creatures?"

It is of course the first in a series of stories about
how ya gotta have faith.

 

[Skwim]

Skwim,
From what I have read, your estimates are too high, but that makes no difference. Notice what God said when He created Adam and Eve, Genesis 1:26-28, God said to multiply and fill the earth, not over fill it.

And you think A&E could have made sure it wasn't over filled? I don't think so.

If God could create all the things He did, I don’t think it would have been too hard to stop procreation, when He wanted to.

And if god could create all things he did I don’t think it would have been too hard to stop the serpent from tempting the two.

I have read that only about 20 to 30 Billion have lived on earth, which would make about a fourth of all that have ever lived, are alive today. One reason for the discrepancy is that many believe that man has been on earth much longer than he has. Bible Chronology, found in Kings and Chronicles, which can be traced back to Adam and Eve, show that Adam was created in 4026BC.

This you'd have to take up with my linked source:

Population Reference Bureau
1875 Connecticut Avenue, NW Suite 520
Washington, DC 20009
Phone: 800-877-9881
Fax: 202-328-3937
Email: [email protected]​

A very important point that ismissed here is, if Adam had not sinned all people living on earth today would be enjoying a Paradise earth, with everlasting life to look forward to, with no sickness and many, many things to interest all of us.

Who said it would be "Paradise on earth"?

.

 

[Etritonakin]

God is quoted as stating that the heavens were not formed in vain, but formed to be inhabited.

There is plenty of room, but limiting the destruction caused by disobedience to a small area was wise.

God wasn't really surprised -and did make the decision to allow them to interact with Satan -but gave them to opportunity to make their own decisions.

Limiting human lifespans to 120ish years allowed for many individuals in a relatively closed system -within a specified time frame -to gain enough experience to make an informed decision later -after knowing both good and evil -and eventually knowing God.

Isaiah 45:5 I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:
6That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else.
7I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

 

[InChrist]

And you trust all the lies in that book.

No, I trust the truths in that book.

 

[InChrist]

No, he didn't. Re-read the tale. It was not until after they are that they knew.

To put it mildly your version of God screwed the pooch. He made Adam and Eve with a design flaw and then blamed them for his error.

I think it is you who have the wrong version and complete lack of knowledge about God. Sad.

 

[Audie]

No, I trust the truths in that book.

Well, there you go! So do I!

You need to work a bit on the skill of
not being conned, tho. The
gullible dont last long in any open market.

Lets give you a little test. You say it is "truth"?

If I say something that is 10% false, is that
"truth"? 90 percent is good but that last 10%,
well not so much.

How about 1%?

Like I am an account, and only cook your books by
oh, .01% Still truth?

What do you think?

 

[ecco]

And you trust all the lies in that book.

No, I trust the truths in that book.

... and just ignore the lies.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I think it is you who have the wrong version and complete lack of knowledge about God. Sad.

No, backwards as usual. You have a belief that is inconsistent. You claim to follow the Bible, but the God of the Bible,especially of the Old Testament is an incompetent, vile, monster. As a result you have to make obviously flawed reinterpretations of that book.

 

[InChrist]

But God knew they would fail the test and gave them the apple anyway... so he must have wanted them to eat it.

You talk about loyalty; wasn't God capable of instilling then with enough loyalty to pass the test? Also, in the story, it was only Adam's loyalty to God that was really tested. God never tells Eve directly not to eat the apple; she only ever gets hearsay from Adam.

And the test: who was it for? Not God: he already knew the outcome. Presumably, then, it was for Adam and Eve... but what lesson are they supposed to take from it? Isn't it God's way of telling them "I have made you to be flawed creatures?"

I don't quite know what you mean when you ask..."wasn't God capable of instilling then with enough loyalty to pass the test?" Loyalty is not something that is programmed, God did not create robots. Loyalty is a quality dependent on personal volition and choice. The purpose of the tree was so that they would have a real choice to believe, trust, and follow God's wisdom or believe, trust, and follow their ideas or enticing lies. For God to program them to be loyal would defeat the purpose.

As I have said, sure God knew the outcome, but that did not discount the fact that Adam and Eve made the choice they did, of their own volition. Since it was only Adam and Eve in the beginning and they both spent time with each other every day, as well as God during a certain part of each day, I think it is reasonable to conclude that Eve got the message about the tree.

 

[InChrist]

No, backwards as usual. You have a belief that is inconsistent. You claim to follow the Bible, but the God of the Bible,especially of the Old Testament is an incompetent, vile, monster. As a result you have to make obviously flawed reinterpretations of that book.

You have a false caricature of god in your imagination, not the actual God of the Bible, the Creator of heaven and earth.

 

[ecco]

I think it is you who have the wrong version and complete lack of knowledge about God. Sad.

Facts:

Omniscient God created Adam
Adam failed
God punished everyone​

Conclusion:

Omniscient, omnipotent God created Adam in a specific way knowing that Adam would fail and that He would then blame Adam, Eve and all offspring.
​

It's very simple and very straightforward.

If you believe that the above are incorrect or the "wrong version" or based on a lack of knowledge, please indicate where and how.

 

[InChrist]

... and just ignore the lies.

There are no lies. God is holy and cannot lie...

God is not a man, that He should lie,
Nor a son of man, that He should repent.
Has He said, and will He not do?
Numbers 23:19

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I don't quite know what you mean when you ask..."wasn't God capable of instilling then with enough loyalty to pass the test?" Loyalty is not something that is programmed, God did not create robots.

If you don't think that loyalty can be instilled, then I take it you've never been a teacher or parent, or held a leadership position.

Loyalty is a quality dependent on personal volition and choice. The purpose of the tree was so that they would have a real choice to believe, trust, and follow God's wisdom or believe, trust, and follow their ideas or enticing lies. For God to program them to be loyal would defeat the purpose.

We don't choose our values. The values that God gave Adam and Eve were compatible with eating the fruit. The fault is ultimately God's.

As I have said, sure God knew the outcome, but that did not discount the fact that Adam and Eve made the choice they did, of their own volition.

Irrelevant. Responsibility isn't a zero-sum game.

Since it was only Adam and Eve in the beginning and they both spent time with each other every day, as well as God during a certain part of each day, I think it is reasonable to conclude that Eve got the message about the tree.

... from Adam. For her, the "test" was as much to do with loyalty to Adam as it was about loyalty to God. And if she didn't trust him, then it wouldn't be about loyalty to God at all.

 

[InChrist]

Facts:

Omniscient God created Adam
Adam failed
God punished everyone​

Conclusion:

Omniscient, omnipotent God created Adam in a specific way knowing that Adam would fail and that He would then blame Adam, Eve and all offspring.
​

It's very simple and very straightforward.

If you believe that the above are incorrect or the "wrong version" or based on a lack of knowledge, please indicate where and how.

God created the human race in a specific way, starting with Adam and Eve, specifically.in His image, giving them freewill.

He placed them in a good environment blessing them with everything they needed and more.

They only had one straightforward rule.They chose to disregard this rule and sinned.

God did not blame Adam or punish everyone because of Adam's sin. It would not have mattered if it were John or Kate, Jane or Kevin. Any person who is less than the perfection of God would fall short and make a wrong choice at some point. We all sin and fall short of our own accord. But Freedom is utmost important to God, so He allowed the option of a wrong choice, sin and the ensuing consequences...yet also offers deliverance and hope.

 

[MonkeyFire]

Hate brought the fight and all the nihilist that day and Invincibility went toe to toe with All-Mighty. And here we are.

 

[Subduction Zone]

You have a false caricature of god in your imagination, not the actual God of the Bible, the Creator of heaven and earth.

No, I have mp caricature of god. Once again you are saying that others have your flaws. If you claim to believe the Genesis accounts then you openly admit to believing in an evil and incompetent God. He screwed up his creation in that myth and then blamed his creation and not himself. As a Christian you do have an out. Since to believe in the Genesis account you also have to believe in a lying God it makes much more sense to see it as allegory, fable, and morality tales. Not as reality.

 

[Subduction Zone]

God created the human race in a specific way, starting with Adam and Eve, specifically.in His image, giving them freewill.

He placed them in a good environment blessing them with everything they needed and more.

They only had one straightforward rule.They chose to disregard this rule and sinned.

God did not blame Adam or punish everyone because of Adam's sin. It would not have mattered if it were John or Kate, Jane or Kevin. Any person who is less than the perfection of God would fall short and make a wrong choice at some point. We all sin and fall short of our own accord. But Freedom is utmost important to God, so He allowed the option of a wrong choice, sin and the ensuing consequences...yet also offers deliverance and hope.

Once again, what was their specific sin in the myth?

 

[InChrist]

Once again, what was their specific sin in the myth?

What myth? I don't waste my time believing in myths.
I could give my perspective concerning the specific sin that occurred in the Genesis account, but if it is just a myth to you why should I bother and why do you care?