Let's not talk about the Big Bang

[Polymath257]

But you by self admission are not enlightened, so anything and everything you say about the subject is second hand claims, Now do it yourself or forever hold your peace.

And you are also not enlightened. So your statements are equally invalid. You might take your own advice.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

And you continue playing the silly game of intellectual dishonesty and borderline ad hominem "argumentation" instead of actually addressing the points raised head-on.
This does not reflect good on you or your case.

Oh well.

Here, have an appropriate trophy:

View attachment 75915

Unaccustomed as I am to public speaking, I am honored to receive your trophy, it will go on the shelf next to my picture of Roy Rogers's horse.
Thank you Spag

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Unaccustomed as I am to public speaking, I am honored to receive your trophy, it will go on the shelf next to my picture of Roy Rogers's horse.
Thank you Spag

Ow, you seem "triggered".



I note you are honored of receiving a trophy for intellectual dishonest dodging.
Wrong and proud of it. Typical.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Realizations can be wrong.



No, I do not 'mistake' it. I believe it.



So you also, have not had the experiences you talk about. So you are also not an authority.

No, but there is more to it,

Believing is a mistake in the sense that it is not the reality represented by the belief.

There is ego memory, but the ego did not have the experience.

 

[ratiocinator]

Yet again: many people claim 'spiritual realisation', 'revelation' and so on, but they contradict each other, so, even if we're generous and concede that it might offer some access to truth, it is clearly very unreliable.

Cue more running away...

But you by self admission are not enlightened, so anything and everything you say about the subject is second hand claims, Now do it yourself or forever hold your peace.

I am a true prophet!

All you're doing is just dismissing everybody else's 'realisations' if they don't agree with yours. Your own experiences seem to have been elevated in your own mind to arbiters of absolute truth. The arrogance and irrationality are staggering.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Ow, you seem "triggered".



I note you are honored of receiving a trophy for intellectual dishonest dodging.
Wrong and proud of it. Typical.

It's what the higher class do when they indulge the perceived ummm less evolved,

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Sorry, I had to go back and find where I said it, and it was definitely an inappropriate, I meant unenlightened. My apologies.

Well, here is the joke about that. The rest of us as unenlightened are still, Oneness, but Twoness or we are not real there and it is all happening in your mind, because you are not really experiencing this post. So ither your model is absurd and it is all in your mind OR it is too simple.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

I am a true prophet!

All you're doing is just dismissing everybody else's 'realisations' if they don't agree with yours. Your own experiences seem to have been elevated in your own mind to arbiters of absolute truth. The arrogance and irrationality are staggering.

Allah hu akbar!

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Well, here is the joke about that. The rest of us as unenlightened are still, Oneness, but Twoness or we are not real there and it is all happening in your mind, because you are not really experiencing this post. So ither your model is absurd and it is all in your mind OR it is too simple.

There is no duality in the still mind state, there are no mental conceptions, no mental models, no personal mental experiences, just pure transcendent awareness.

Stop thinking about it, it can't be realized in all eternity by the thinking mind,

 

[Polymath257]

No, but there is more to it,

Believing is a mistake in the sense that it is not the reality represented by the belief.

Yes, yes. Belief is a personal thing and the translation from reality to belief is imperfect.

Now can you get away from trivial philosophy?

There is ego memory, but the ego did not have the experience.

So, again, you are not an authority. You have a memory of an experience, but that is all you have.

 

[Polymath257]

There is no duality in the still mind state, there are no mental conceptions, no mental models, no personal mental experiences, just pure transcendent awareness.

I understand the claim. And I find that state to be an undesirable one. It fails to provide reliable results and so counts as self delusion.

Stop thinking about it, it can't be realized in all eternity by the thinking mind,

yes, there are so many truths you can get if you simply stop thinking......

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

It's what the higher class do when they indulge the perceived ummm less evolved,

And again with the schoolyard attempt at personal insult.
And again with no trace of actually addressing points raised.

Same old, same old.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

There is no duality in the still mind state, there are no mental conceptions, no mental models, no personal mental experiences, just pure transcendent awareness.

Stop thinking about it, it can't be realized in all eternity by the thinking mind,

Yeah just do that for all of the everyday world and answer that way for your answer here. Then I will listen.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

I understand the claim. And I find that state to be an undesirable one. It fails to provide reliable results and so counts as self delusion.


yes, there are so many truths you can get if you simply stop thinking......

The problem is that it can actually work. I have met one Buddhist, who didn't confuse the 2. But I have also met those, who start acting as The Truth.

 

[ratiocinator]

Allah hu akbar!

More running scared.

 

[Polymath257]

The problem is that it can actually work. I have met one Buddhist, who didn't confuse the 2. But I have also met those, who start acting as The Truth.

Of the great religions, I find Buddhism most conducive to my way of thinking. At least, the Theravada version. Mahayana is not so wonderful, in my view.

That said, when I visited a Buddhist shrine in China, it was one of the most peaceful places I have been.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Of the great religions, I find Buddhism most conducive to my way of thinking. At least, the Theravada version. Mahayana is not so wonderful, in my view.

That said, when I visited a Buddhist shrine in China, it was one of the most peaceful places I have been.

Well, I am to scatter brained to do that. So I find nice in the absurd as a skeptic. Yeah, I know.

 

[Polymath257]

Well, here is the joke about that. The rest of us as unenlightened are still, Oneness, but Twoness or we are not real there and it is all happening in your mind, because you are not really experiencing this post. So ither your model is absurd and it is all in your mind OR it is too simple.

Alternatively, we are ALL enlightened, but just don't realize it.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Alternatively, we are ALL enlightened, but just don't realize it.

Well, years ago among on a rather intelligent forum I was among the runner ups for both most rational and most irrational. I learned a lot from that. So as a joke about enlightened. I am not that, but I capable of telling you, that I am not that. That is as close as I can get as a skeptic.

 

[Zwing]

The important point is that its predictions match reality.

Yes, and when a Physicist says, “after x amount of time has elapsed”, he is really saying, “after this succession of events has occurred”, which, after all, even he might not realize.