Let's not talk about the Big Bang

[Subduction Zone]

A god snapped his fingers
A unicorn farted
A fairy waved her wand
Who knows

Wouldn't time have to exist for something to begin to "start" expanding?
Wouldn't a place have to exist for that something to "exist in" before expansion?

Possibly not. I cannot do the math myself but there are models where time starts with the Big Bang. The phrase "before the Big Bang" may be as meaningless as "North of the North Pole". How it started is beyond me.

The problem is that some believers take that as evidence that God did it It is not evidence for that. It is not evidence against God either. It is just a neutral concept when it comes to the existence of a god.

 

[We Never Know]

Possibly not. I cannot do the math myself but there are models where time starts with the Big Bang. The phrase "before the Big Bang" may be as meaningless as "North of the North Pole". How it started is beyond me.

The problem is that some believers take that as evidence that God did it It is not evidence for that. It is not evidence against God either. It is just a neutral concept when it comes to the existence of a god.

Time has to exist for a "start" to happen.
You can't have a "start" without time.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Time has to exist for a "start" to happen.
You can't have a "start" without time.

Does it? I do not see why. Existence and time could have begun simultaneously.

 

[We Never Know]

Does it? I do not see why. Existence and time could have begun simultaneously.

"Existence and time could have begun simultaneously."

Can you support that?

 

[We Never Know]

Does it? I do not see why. Existence and time could have begun simultaneously.

"Existence and time could have begun simultaneously.

Or.....
A god could have snapped his fingers
A unicorn could have farted
A fairy could have waved her wand

 

[Mock Turtle]

"Existence and time could have begun simultaneously."

Can you support that?

Can you support a God coming into existence or having existed for all time? Why the difference?

 

[YoursTrue]

Be serious, why was the big bang?
When did time start?
What existed before time started?
What is outside the expanding universe?

If I am being serious as you ask, I would say I don't know if there was a "Big Bang." I don't know when "time started," I'd have to do some looking into the matter before I answer the next question but offhand I think the answer is that God existed without beginning, and the last question I'll leave for later.

 

[YoursTrue]

Evolution is a scientific theory.

Abiogenesis is still a hypothesis...but it is a falsifiable hypothesis, because there are already some evidence and some experiments that support at least 3 of the models.

Abiogenesis is a working (falsifiable) hypothesis, because biologists, molecular biologists and biochemists are still actively searching for more evidence.

They need more evidence and data, before they can conclude which of the numbers of models is potentially the candidate of being the new “scientific theory”.

Upon examining so many claims, hypotheses and theories here, I have decided most of them don't make sense (to me). If they make sense to you and/or others -- hey, have a good one! If you ask which ones do I mean, list them and you tell me and/or pick and choose.

 

[Subduction Zone]

"Existence and time could have begun simultaneously.

Or.....
A god could have snapped his fingers
A unicorn could have farted
A fairy could have waved her wand

And there is only evidence for matter existing right now. Your examples show how weak a belief in a God is. For the theist it is best to agree with the scientists and say "we do not know how the universe began". You seem to want me to be saying something that I am not. Why do you keep repeating yourself? To what end? You are arguing more strongly against a God than I am.

 

[We Never Know]

Can you support a God coming into existence or having existed for all time? Why the difference?

I don't believe in a god . Thats my point.. What is the difference?

 

[We Never Know]

And there is only evidence for matter existing right now. Your examples show how weak a belief in a God is. For the theist it is best to agree with the scientists and say "we do not know how the universe began". You seem to want me to be saying something that I am not. Why do you keep repeating yourself? To what end? You are arguing more strongly against a God than I am.

Posting that to you once isnt repeating. However there is not only matter, there is also anti-matter.

 

[Subduction Zone]

If I am being serious as you ask, I would say I don't know if there was a "Big Bang." I don't know when "time started," I'd have to do some looking into the matter before I answer the next question but offhand I think the answer is that God existed without beginning, and the last question I'll leave for later.

If one refuses to study or understand the sciences of course they will not know. The Big Bang is not an atheistic idea. In fact the astrophysicists that came up with it was a very devout Christian. I even provided you with a link about him.

If there even was a "before the Big Bang" has not been answered yet. Some of the models have time beginning then..

 

[Subduction Zone]

I don't believe in a god . Thats my point.. What is the difference?

I thought that you claimed to be a moderator at Christian Forums. To be one there one would have to have agreed to their statement of faith. Are you saying that you lied there?

 

[gnostic]

Upon examining so many claims, hypotheses and theories here, I have decided most of them don't make sense (to me). If they make sense to you and/or others -- hey, have a good one! If you ask which ones do I mean, list them and you tell me and/or pick and choose.

What you need to learn and know is that you don’t need how life first started - hence Abiogenesis - to understand Evolution.

Evolution isn’t about how life first started.

You keep confusing Evolution with Abiogenesis, refusing to learn from your errors.

I have noticed that all creationists - OEC, YEC & ID creationists - suffered from the willful ignorance when it comes to their inability to distinguishing the “mechanisms of biodiversity” (Evolution) from the (Abiogenesis) mechanisms of “origin of first life”.

Willful ignorance isn’t a virtue.

Creationism seemed to be like cesspool of ignorance, where people (creationists) are incapable of being educated in even the most basic of science.

Until you finally understand the differences between the two, you will never be able to move forward.

 

[We Never Know]

I thought that you claimed to be a moderator at Christian Forums. To be one there one would have to have agreed to their statement of faith. Are you saying that you lied there?

It seems you have been misinformed. Like here some believe and some don't. It gives balance.
Plus its discriminatory.

 

[Jose Fly]

"Existence and time could have begun simultaneously."

Can you support that?

Are you expecting people who post at "religiousforums.com" to be able to walk you through the math behind the standard model of big bang cosmology? If you're truly interested in getting an answer, wouldn't you be better served posing your questions to actual cosmologists and/or theoretical physicists?

 

[We Never Know]

Are you expecting people who post at "religiousforums.com" to be able to walk you through the math behind the standard model of big bang cosmology? If you're truly interested in getting an answer, wouldn't you be better served posing your questions to actual cosmologists and/or theoretical physicists?

"Existence and time could have begun simultaneously."

That's an unkown.

 

[Jose Fly]

"Existence and time could have begun simultaneously."

That's an unkown.

And?

Also, you didn't address the issue I raised. Again, are you expecting people at "religiousforums.com" to be able to explain the math behind the standard model of big bang cosmology? Why not ask actual cosmologists and/or theoretical physicists?

 

[Astrophile]

Be serious, why was the big bang?

I don't know. Lawrence Krauss, in A Universe from Nothing, suggested that 'nothing' is unstable, but that is only one hypothesis. Stay around for a few years, and we may have an answer.

When did time start?

About 13.8 billion years ago.

What existed before time started?
What is outside the expanding universe?

These questions are probably meaningless. If they have any meaning, I don't know the answers.

 

[We Never Know]

And?

Also, you didn't address the issue I raised. Again, are you expecting people at "religiousforums.com" to be able to explain the math behind the standard model of big bang cosmology? Why not ask actual cosmologists and/or theoretical physicists?

I said its unknown. That does address your post.
They can't answer what isn't known.