Life Begins at Conception

[lockyfan]

from the moment of conception God can read your heart and tell whether you will be one of his people or not

so yes life starts from the moment of conception

Psalm 139:16
Your eyes saw even the embryo of me,
And in your book all its parts were down in writing,
As regards the days when they were formed
And there was not yet one among them

Also the following scripture talks of if there is a fight and a woman miscarries what it is equal to in the eyes of Jehovah God
Exodus 21:22-23
And in case men should struggle with each other and they really hurt a pregnant woman and her children do come out but no fatal accident occurs, he is to have damages imposed upon him without fail according to what the owner of the woman may lay upon him; and he must give it through the justices. But if a fatal accident should occur, then you must give soul for soul

 

[McBell]

from the moment of conception God can read your heart and tell whether you will be one of his people or not

Opinion.
In fact, this is an opinion that many Christians will have many many a problem with.

so yes life starts from the moment of conception

No it doesn't.
Why?
Because the sperm and the egg are both ALIVE BEFORE conception.
If either the sperm or the egg is dead, there is no conception.

 

[DallasApple]

I guess I'm dense. I still fail to see the relevence. Is the question when human life begins? I fail to see where a net change in material is relevant. A car isn't a car until all of the parts are put together. A human isn't a human until the sperm and the egg comes together.

I could also ask why the Bible refers to being pregnant as "being with child?"

Probably because the word pregnant didnt exist.

Women who are pregnant dont say "I have a child with me"..they say "Im pregnant or Im GOING TO have a baby.

I imagine they said "with child' because they knew eventually a child woud be born.

Love

Dallas

 

[DallasApple]

Opinion.
In fact, this is an opinion that many Christians will have many many a problem with.


No it doesn't.
Why?
Because the sperm and the egg are both ALIVE BEFORE conception.
If either the sperm or the egg is dead, there is no conception.

I agree..but I would say a "unique" life begins at conception.

Love

Dallas

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I guess I'm dense. I still fail to see the relevence. Is the question when human life begins? I fail to see where a net change in material is relevant. A car isn't a car until all of the parts are put together. A human isn't a human until the sperm and the egg comes together.

Depends on your definition of human. And just because you rearrange the parts doesn't mean that what results has some special importance. For example, if you took all the parts of a car and lined them up in alphabetical order, the result would not be a car, and would not be especially more meaningful than if they had been arranged in an unordered pile.

Also, as I mentioned, I'm fairly certain that at the time the Bible was written, the commonly held view was that the baby came from the man (his "seed") and the women's contribution was only to provide a place for that "seed" to grow. Given this, I can't think of a good reason to assume conception as the lower limit on when the Bible might consider life to begin.

I could also ask why the Bible refers to being pregnant as "being with child?"

I don't know, but the Bible does use non-literal euphemisms for other things, so I think it's reasonable to allow that possibility here.

Also, I don't know whether this is an artifact of translation. Does the original text say "with child", or does it say something else like "pregnant"?

 

[DallasApple]

Thats sounds right.If the woman was just an incubator for the mans seed.They would have concluded that he just "deposits" a "child" into her womb.

Love

Dallas

 

[Kurgan]

I am totally confused why that sentient/sapient beings are different than my dog and my cat?

I like my dog beter than I like most people. I believe in the code of the west and in Texas we have justifiable homocide as well as praiseworthy.

The problem with making abortion aginst the law is that it is against the constitution and the right to individual freedom. You can believe what you want but there are many very good reasons the Bible is not the law of the land. The bible is the greatest book every written but do not read it as the word of God and do not read it literally. It is a 4000 year old myth that is ment to show man how to live in Biblical times with Biblical rules. This is the 21st century folks.

 

[Storm]

I am totally confused why that sentient/sapient beings are different than my dog and my cat?

I'd like to help, but I can't make heads or tails of this sentence.

 

[Smoke]

There are several scriptures that indicate that God knows that life begins at conception, Ps 139:13-16.

For thou hast possessed my reins: thou hast covered me in my mother's womb. I will praise thee; for I am fearfully and wonderfully made:
marvellous are thy works; and that my soul knoweth right well.
My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret,
and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth.
Thine eyes did see my substance, yet being unperfect;
and in thy book all my members were written,
which in continuance were fashioned, when as yet there was none of them.
​

Doesn't say a thing about life beginning at conception. It does say the psalmist was "curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth," which is kind of interesting.

Consider how God spoke about Jeremiah when he was in his mothers belly, Jere 1:4,5.

Then the word of the Lord came unto me, saying, Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.
​

This indicates that the Lord knew Jeremiah before he was conceived.

Proof positive iis found at Ex 21:22,23. We are toold that if two men were fighting and they caused the death of a baby by premature birth, the man responsilbe should be put to death. The Mosaic Law required a life for a life.

That's not what it says:

If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine. And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life.
​

The "mischief" of which this passage speaks is the death of the mother. Judaism has never considered an unborn fetus to be more than a potential person, and until relatively recently Christians didn't believe a soul was present immediately after conception, either. Jews and Christians were able to believe these things because there is no biblical basis for the notion that life begins at conception.

Think about Jesus, who was transferred to the womb of Mary, by God. This is a very good indication that life begins in the womb for mankind. Of course Jesus was alive in heaven billions of years before he came to earth, Luke 1:32-35, Col 1:15, Rev 3:14, Prov 8:22-31.

As outlined here, your peculiar Christology says nothing about when human life begins.

 

[DallasApple]

For thou hast possessed my reins: thou hast covered me in my mother's womb. I will praise thee; for I am fearfully and wonderfully made:
marvellous are thy works; and that my soul knoweth right well.
My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret,
and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth.
Thine eyes did see my substance, yet being unperfect;
and in thy book all my members were written,
which in continuance were fashioned, when as yet there was none of them.
​

Doesn't say a thing about life beginning at conception. It does say the psalmist was "curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth," which is kind of interesting.

Then the word of the Lord came unto me, saying, Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.
​

This indicates that the Lord knew Jeremiah before he was conceived.


That's not what it says:

If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine. And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life.
​

The "mischief" of which this passage speaks is the death of the mother. Judaism has never considered an unborn fetus to be more than a potential person, and until relatively recently Christians didn't believe a soul was present immediately after conception, either. Jews and Christians were able to believe these things because there is no biblical basis for the notion that life begins at conception.


As outlined here, your peculiar Christology says nothing about when human life begins.

Also if our soul exist before we are born and is sent down into the mothers womb the second we are concieved there are a lot of souls sent here to never even have a thought or heartbeat or see or hear or breath or do anything but sit in the mothers womb as a glomp of cells only to be miscarried.

Love

Dallas

 

[DallasApple]

Also..

If a sperm embedding into an ovum is the moment of life..and when the soul enters therefore has the 'right" as a person to live ...but can not do so without the "life support" of the mother then why do we take people off of life support who are brain dead who are clearly people with souls?And please dont say one is artificial and modern technology and the other isnt.So is life support for a preemie.So is chemo therapy for cancer..So is putting a splint in someone with with a head injury to relieve pressure so their brain stem isnt squeezed and they stop breathing on their own.. so is seperating conjoined twins...so are many things.It all adds up to if the mother gets pregnant..Somehow she "owes it " to a potential life to carry full term and give birth.

Love

Dallas

 

[logician]

All life is important, but no life is sacred, let the mother decide what's best for herself, according to her own beliefs, not somebody else's beliefs, or some group or church's beliefs.

 

[DallasApple]

All life is important, but no life is sacred, let the mother decide what's best for herself, according to her own beliefs, not somebody else's beliefs, or some group or church's beliefs.

I agree except add that many women are deciding whats best for more than just herself.Believe it or not some women will abort because if they can't be there to make sure the baby is taken care of they are putting a child at risk for unknown and potentially horrible consequences.IOW death is better than the unknown...Not to mention women with children already they have to consider and not to mention the fathers input..and yes herself..most mothers who have had abortions have also born children either before or after and they are sacrificial unselfish people.

Love

Dallas

 

[S-word]

from the moment of conception God can read your heart and tell whether you will be one of his people or not

so yes life starts from the moment of conception

Psalm 139:16
Your eyes saw even the embryo of me,
And in your book all its parts were down in writing,
As regards the days when they were formed
And there was not yet one among them

Also the following scripture talks of if there is a fight and a woman miscarries what it is equal to in the eyes of Jehovah God
Exodus 21:22-23
And in case men should struggle with each other and they really hurt a pregnant woman and her children do come out but no fatal accident occurs, he is to have damages imposed upon him without fail according to what the owner of the woman may lay upon him; and he must give it through the justices. But if a fatal accident should occur, then you must give soul for soul

He is the First and the Last, The Beginning and End, The Alpha and Omega, The father and Son. He is the essential and divine reality of the universe, the eternal spirit from which all being originates and to which all must return.

The reason that he knows your future is because you exist in his dead past, He knows what you will do, simply because he knows what you had done in the previous cycle of universal activity, which must be resurrected in this ever oscillating evolving universe.

From the Book of Adam and Eve, 28: 1-4; But the Lord turned to Adam and said: “I will not suffer thee henceforward to be in paradise.” And Adam said, “Grant me, O Lord, of the Tree of Life that I might eat of it, before I be cast out.” Then the Lord spake to Adam, “Thou shalt not take of it now, for I have commanded the cherubim and the flaming sword the turneth (everyway) to guard it from thee that thou taste not of it; but thou hast the war that the adversary hath put into thee, yet when thou art gone out of paradise, if thou shouldst keep thyself from all evil, as one about to die, when again the resurrection hath come to pass, I will raise thee up and then there shall be given to thee the Tree of Life.”

 

[Sunstone]

Life begins at the university.

 

[DallasApple]

Life begins at the university.

Oh yeah...I went there one time..I think I was in my mothers womb.LONG time ago.

Love

Dallas

 

[Humanistheart]

Is there any biblical basis for the claim that life begins at conception?

Not in the Hebrew bible at least. This is why the official jewish position is not technically against abortion.

 

[TurkeyOnRye]

Life began billions of years ago, and it continues to thrive. Let's worry more about war and famine than what a woman decides to do with her own body. More pain and sentient suffering would exist in the loss of my index finger than the loss of an embryo.

 

[DallasApple]

Life began billions of years ago, and it continues to thrive. Let's worry more about war and famine than what a woman decides to do with her own body. More pain and sentient suffering would exist in the loss of my index finger than the loss of an embryo.

What about a fetus?

Love

Dallas

 

[TurkeyOnRye]

What about a fetus?

Love

Dallas

I can't say. Whatever a mother does to her baby she also does to herself.