Man made traditions from the Church or the Word of God - Who do you believe and follow?

[PruePhillip]

I may have to go for a while all. Thanks very much though for the freindly discussion. I will pop back in latter to catch up. Bye for now

God bless

When does YOUR Sabbath actually begin?

 

[3rdAngel]

Hi 74x12, as this is a large post might respond to it in a group of smaller posts so it is earier to read .

For your doctrine to work; you have to differentiate between the 10 commandments and the rest of God's Law. This comes from the erroneous idea that God only said the 10 commandments and Moses said the rest of the Law. However we can easily prove the error of this reasoning by citing the numerous times throughout the Law of Moses that God affirms it is Himself who is speaking.

Not really brother as it is not my doctrine. It is God's Word and not mine. How many commandments are there in the God's 10 commandments; 9; 10; 613 according to God's Word (not mine)? Here is a hint...

Exodus 34:28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote on the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.

Deuteronomy 4:13 And he declared to you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he wrote them on two tables of stone.

Deuteronomy 10:4 And he wrote on the tables, according to the first writing, the ten commandments, which the LORD spoke to you in the mount out of the middle of the fire in the day of the assembly: and the LORD gave them to me.

Yep pretty sure God says there are ten commandments that he wrote with his own finger on two tables of stone that were his work alone and no one elses..

Exodus 32:16, And the tables were the work of God, and the writing was the writing of God, graven on the tables.

Yep pretty sure that it is God differentiating between the 10 commandments that he made and spoke to God's people (not me) * Exodus 20:1-17; Exodus 32:15 with the Mosaic book of the law which was written and spoken by Moses and placed in the side of the Ark of the covenant.

Deuteronomy 31:24-26 [24] And it came to pass, when Moses had made an end of writing the words of this law in a book, until they were finished, [25], That Moses commanded the Levites, which bore the ark of the covenant of the LORD, saying, [26], Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against you

Exodus 25:21And you shall put the mercy seat above on the ark; and in the ark you shall put the testimony that I shall give you.

Deuteronomy 10:1-5 [1], At that time the LORD said to me, Hew you two tables of stone like to the first, and come up to me into the mount, and make you an ark of wood.[2], And I will write on the tables the words that were in the first tables which you brake, and you shall put them in the ark. [3], And I made an ark of ****tim wood, and hewed two tables of stone like to the first, and went up into the mount, having the two tables in my hand. [4], And he wrote on the tables, according to the first writing, the ten commandments, which the LORD spoke to you in the mount out of the middle of the fire in the day of the assembly: and the LORD gave them to me. [5], And I turned myself and came down from the mount, and put the tables in the ark which I had made; and there they be, as the LORD commanded me.

Yep looks like this is God's doing alrighty as shown in the scriptures above (not mine) and it show that God has made the separation between his Law (10 commandments) and the Mosaic book of the old Covenant not me.

Do you believe God's Word here brother? It is God's Word not mine and it disagrees with you.

May you receive God's Word and be blessed.

 

[3rdAngel]

Here is a simple keyword search of the phrase "I am the LORD" in the books of Exodus through Deuteronomy. BibleGateway.com - Keyword Search You will notice that throughout the Law and even as Moses is delivering various commandments God keeps saying "I am the LORD". That is to assure us that it is indeed God giving every single commandment and not Moses. Moses is only the messenger.

As shown through the scriptures from the previous post above. Moses had nothing to do with God's 10 commandments except to carry them down from the mountain and put them inside the ark of the Covenant. God was the one who made them; spoke them and wrote them. It is God's work alone and there are 10 commandments that he wrote on two tables of stone that he commanded Moses to keep separated from the Mosaic book of the law as shown from the scriptures in the previous section *Exodus 34:28; Deuteronomy 4:13; Deuteronomy 10:4; Exodus 32:16; Deuteronomy 31:24-26; Exodus 25:21; Deuteronomy 10:1-5. God directed Moses to write the book of the covenant *Galatians 3:19.

Hope this is helpful

 

[3rdAngel]

Even Jesus said that not one jot or tittle will pass away until all is fulfilled. (Matthew 5:18) That means you cannot say that most of the Law is fulfilled and only 10 commandments are still valid. No, either the whole Law is fulfilled or none of it.

You are confused all the "shadow laws" from the Mosaic book of covenant *Exodus 24:7 for remission of sins are fulfilled in Christ because they pointed to him as our great sacrifice for sin *John 1:29 who is our great high priest in the heavenly sanctuary above of which the earthly was only a copy..

Hebrews 10:1-7
[1], For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.
[2], For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.
[3], But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.
[4], For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins.
[5], Why when he comes into the world, he said, Sacrifice and offering you would not, but a body have you prepared me:
[6], In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin you have had no pleasure.
[7], Then said I, See, I come in the volume of the book it is written of me, to do your will, O God.

Yep not talking about the ten commandments here. The shadow laws from the Mosaic book of the law in the old covenant *Exodus 24:7 is for remission of sin were all fulfilled at the coming of JESUS. Jesus also kept all of God's LAW (10 commandment) fulfilling them perfectly to become our perfect sacrifice for the sins of the world.

Now brother fulfilled from your definition is in error. Matthew 5:17-19 in not saying JESUS fulfilled God's 10 commandments that we no longer need to keep them as it says in verse 18, For truly I say to you, Till heaven and earth pass, one stroke or one pronunciation mark shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Obviously, heaven and earth has not passed away. Then again...

[19], Whoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. [20], For I say to you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven

So now we are moving from JESUS fulfilling all the laws in the torah to laws of "RIGHTEOUSNESS" How does God's Word define righteousness?

Psalms 119:172 My tongue shall speak of your word: for all your commandments are righteousness.

So whever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven is in reference to God's 10 commandment and unless our righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

JESUS came to magnify the LAW from the INSIDE OUT quoting MATTHEW 5:17-32 (thoughts and feelings) in fulfillment of *ISAIAH 42:21. This is to show that unless our RIGHTOUESNESS EXCEEDS the RIGHTOUESNESS of the Scribes and Pharisees we can in no way enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN. Jesus is saying the problem runs deeper then outward observance to the 10 Commandments. EVIL begins in the HEART.

BREAKING GOD's 10 COMMANDMENTS from the heart defile a man *MATTHEW 15:18-19. JESUS is saying we can be outwardly perfect and blameless like the Scribes and Pharisee but inwardly like dead mans bones *MATTHEW 23:27-28. JESUS magnified the LAW to the INSIDE OUT. To show us that we are all sinners in need of a Saviour and that sin originates in the HEART (thoughts and feelings). That is why we have the NEW COVENANT promise and need to be BORN AGAIN by Faith in God's WORD for salvation to be free from SIN (breaking any one of God's 10 commandments) *HEBREWS 8:10-12; 1 JOHN 3:3-10.

If we are not BORN AGAIN into the NEW COVENANT promise and continue in it we will not enter the kingdom of Heaven *1 JOHN 2:3-4; 1 JOHN 2:3-4. ALL those who KNOWINGLY break any one of God's 10 commandments stand guilty before God of sin *JAMES 2:10-11. All those who KNOWINGLY CONTINUE in UNREPENTANT SIN will not enter into God's KINGDOM *HEBREWS 10:26-27 because they reject the gift of God's dear son *ROMANS 6:23. God's 4th Commandment is one of the 10 Commandments that give us the KNOWLEDGE of what sin is. There is no such thing as the 9 commandments in God's WORD. The same as there is no scripure that says God's 4th commandment is Abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a Holy day.

RIGHTESOUSNESS comes from LOVE because LOVE is the fulfilling of God's LAW and the very expression of what LOVE is *ROMANS 13:8-10. He that does not LOVE does not KNOW GOD for GOD IS LOVE * 1 JOHN 4:8. All those who are BORN AGAIN have a NEW HEART TO LOVE and FOLLOW GOD *1 JOHN 4:7. This is the NEW COVENANT promise *HEBREWS 8:10-12.

Those who are BORN AGAIN do not practice SIN (breaking God's Commandments) *1 JOHN 3:4-9. This is why JOHN finishes on this subject by saying; For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous *1 JOHN 5:3 and is why JESUS says IF you LOVE me KEEP my commandments *JOHN 14:15. UNLESS we are BORN AGAIN under the NEW COVENANT to LOVE we will not enter the KINGDOM of HEAVEN *JOHN 3:3-7. We need to be changed from the INSIDE OUT.

Can we have GRACE without God's LAW if the purpose of God's LAW is to give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTOUESNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4; PSALMS 119:172 and lead us to Christ that we might be forgiven by faith *GALATIONS 3:22-25

Can you see your error here brother?

 

[3rdAngel]

This is why James says "For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all."

Indeed although as shown above through the scriptures already James 2:8-12 only supports what is being shared with you here through the scriptures. There are 10 Commandments in God's 10 commandments and God's 4th Commandment is one of God's 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when we break it *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4; JAMES 2:10-11.

Hope this helps

 

[3rdAngel]

Sorry, but you're misrepresenting those scriptures. Virtually none of them are legitimate proof of the sabbath day being commanded to be kept in the new Covenant. Without going through every single verse you list; I will give some examples.

Well that is not true whatsoever. All you have provided here are your words dear brother and your words are not God's Word but yours. Let's go through your words and claims with God's Word and see if there is any truth in them?

In Matthew 5:17-19, Jesus is clearly talking about the entire Law of Moses not just the 10 commandments. So either the whole thing is fulfilled or not any of it.

As shown above Jesus is talking about both the book of the law pointing to him as our great sacrifice for sin and also God's Law (10 commandments) as shown in the scriptures from the previous section. It does not say God fulfilled the 10 commandments in order that we can break them but that he fulfilled them in order to fulfill all righteousness *Matthew 3:15 to become our perfect sacrifice. As shown above Jesus then goes on to magnify the 10 Commandments *Matthew 5: stating that unless our rightouesness shall exceed the righteousness of the Scribes and Pharisees we shall in no wise enter into God's kingdom going on to quote some of the 10 commandments and applying them to our thoughts and feelings *Matthew 5:19-28; Isaiah 42:21. This has application to the new covenant of God's law being written in our heart (thoughts and feelings) in Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34. Can you see your error here brother?

Hebrews 4:1-11 is not talking about keeping the sabbath day every week but instead is speaking of the rest of God that is to come for people who endure to the end.

Sure it is. Let's have a look....
HEBREWS 4:1-11
[1], Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into HIS REST, any of you should seem to come short of it.
[2], For to us was the gospel preached, as well as to them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.
[3], For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into MY REST: ALTHOUGH THE WORKS WERE FINISHED FROM THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD.
[4], FOR HE SPOKE IN A CERTAIN PLACE (GENSIS 2:1-3) OF THE SEVENTH DAY ON THIS WISE, AND GOD DID REST THE SEVENTH DAY FROM ALL HIS WORKS.
[5], And in this place again, If they shall enter into MY REST.

NOTE: CONTEXT is God's REST from the SEVENTH DAY SABBATH REST OF CREATION (v4-5) and those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW GOD's WORD enter into God's SABBATH REST as GOD did on the SEVENTH DAY of the week. CONTEXT is GOD's SEVENTH DAY SABBATH REST and those who BELIEVE AND FOLLOW GOD'S WORD enter into that rest which God's WORD defines as the SEVENTH DAY SABBATH which is GOD'S REST! Let's continue...

[6], Seeing therefore it remains that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:
[7], Again, he limits a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if you will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.
[8], For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.
[9], SO THEN IT REMAINS FOR THE PEOPLE OF GOD TO KEEP THE SABBATH.

Now notice Hebrews 4, verse 9: “There remains therefore a SABBATH rest to the people of God.” In verses 1, 3, 4 and 8, the Greek word for “rest” is katapausin. It means “rest.” But in verse 9, the Greek word for “rest” is sabbatismos, which is a Hebrew word—Sabbat, which means “the Sabbath”—combined with a Greek suffix—ismos, which means “a keeping of” or “a doing of.” Put together, sabbatismos means “a keeping of the Sabbath (noun).” When correctly translated, Hebrews 4:9 should read, “There remains therefore a keeping of the Sabbath to the people of God.” Sabbatizo is the verb form of sabbatismos

[10], For he that is entered into HIS REST (v9 God's SABBATH REST), he also has ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
[11], LET US LABOR THEREFORE TO ENTER INTO THAT REST (God's SEVENTH DAY SABBATH REST), lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief (HEBREWS 3).

.............

CONCLUSION: HEBREWS 4 is talking about the Gospel rest of BELIEVING and FOLLOWING God's WORD; v29 Learn of me; v30 my burden (doing) is light. This agrees with Hebrews 4:2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it. HEBREWS 4:1-11 is in reference to GOD'S REST which God's WORD defines is the SEVENTH DAY SABBATH which is the CONTEXT shown in HEBREWS 4:1-5. HEBREWS 4 therefore with context added is saying that no one enter God's Sabbath rest if they do not BELIEVE AND FOLLOW God's WORD.

Yep not saying what your saying brother. Can you see your error here?

Many of these verses are from the gospels before the new Covenant was given! So of course the sabbath was being kept at that time! For example Mark 2:27-28. IT's important for people to understand that the new Covenant doesn't come about except through the death and resurrection of Jesus. THEN and only then is the new Covenant given. (see Matthew 26:28, Mark 14:24, Luke 22:20, 1 Corinthians 11:25) So before the blood of Jesus was spilled; the Law of Moses is in full effect and the sabbath had to be kept. Because the blood of Jesus is the blood of the new Covenant.

You were provided many scriptures about JESUS teaching us how to keep the Sabbath correctly *Matthew 12:1-12, even scripture showing that JESUS is the creator of the Sabbath that he made for all mankind *Mark 2:27-28. Does not seem to make any sense on your part of your trying to argue that there is no sabbath in the New Covenant when JESUS is teaching us to to keep it correctly now does it. You were also provided scripture outside of the Gospels that show the disciples keeping the Sabbath according to God's 4th commandment after the death and resurrection of JESUS in the new covenant * Acts 13:14; 13:27; 13:44; 15:21; 16:13; 17:2; 18:4; Rev 1:10. You seem to be just ignoring the scriptures provided with your words which are not God's Word.

Acts 18:4 doesn't prove that the Sabbath has to be kept in the new Covenant. All it says is that he reasoned with the Jews in the synagogue every sabbath.

What is shows is that Paul kept the Sabbath. Acts 18:4 was also given to you with other scriptures showing that the disciples after the death and resurrection of JESUS in the new covenant kept the Sabbath *Acts 13:14; 13:27; 13:44; 15:21; 16:13; 17:2. Seems you say; well those set of scripture of JEsus teaching us that he is the creator of the Sabbath and teaching us how to keep the Sabbath correctly cannot be right because it was before the new covenant, than when you are provided scripture of the disciples keeping God's 4th commandment Sabbath in the new covenant your simply looking for excuses not to believe God's Word with your words.

Can you see your error here brother? No scripture has been misrepresented at all. These are God's Word not mine.

May you receive God's Word and be blessed.

 

[3rdAngel]

The Revelation references just say the "Lord's day". I don't see how you think that is proof the Sabbath has to be kept.

There is no scripture that says "Sunday" or the first day of the week is "THE LORDS DAY". This is a teaching and tradition of men that is not biblical. So what does God's Word say?

Which day is "THE LORDS DAY" according to God's Word?

MATTHEW 12:8 For the Son of man is LORD EVEN OF THE SABBATH DAY

Well hope this helps brother and I pray that you may receive them in the Spirit that they were given (love). What you are sharing is only the teachings of the Churches that are trying to lead us away from the pure Word of God. Surface readers are like sifting sand going no where. JESUS promises to be our guide and teacher as we prayerfully seek him through his Word *John 14:26; 16:13; 17:17:1:17; 8:31-36; Hebrews 8:11; 1 John 2:27 but we must turn away from the teachings and traditions of men that break the commandments of God and seek JESUS with all of our hearts.

God bless

 

[3rdAngel]

When does YOUR Sabbath actually begin?

As the scriptures teach brother from evening to evening (Friday sunset to Saturday sunset).

God bless

 

[PruePhillip]

As the scriptures teach brother from evening to evening (Friday sunset to Saturday sunset).

God bless

1 - do you think Jesus broke the first commandment by making himself equal with God?
2 - do you think Jesus broke the 2nd commandment by doing a work on the Sabbath?
3 - do you think Jesus in Matt 5:21 "you have heard do no murder, but I say..." was casting doubt on 5th Commandment?
4 - do you think Jesus in Matt 5:27 "you have heard it say do not commit adultery, but I say..." was casting doubt on the 6th Commandment?
5 - do you think Jesus' message was the Ten Commandments?
6 - why didn't Jesus pull his followers up when they made Sunday their Sabbath?
7 - why was it necessary for Moses to give the Jews a list of Commandments?

 

[3rdAngel]

Hi Phillip nice to meet you here . Thanks for your thoughts. Some comments are provided below for your consideration. Although I will make this over a few posts so it covers everything and it is easier to read.

1 - do you think Jesus broke the first commandment by making himself equal with God?

Nope! Jesus was God.....

Matthew 1:23 - “Behold, the virgin shall be with child, and bear a Son, and they shall call His name Immanuel,” which is translated, “God with us.”

Isaiah 9:6 - For unto us a Child is born, Unto us a Son is given; And the government will be upon His shoulder. And His name will be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Isaiah 43:10,11 - “You are My witnesses,” says the Lord, “And My servant whom I have chosen, That you may know and believe Me, and understand that I am He. Before Me there was no God formed, Nor shall there be after Me. I, even I, am the Lord, and besides Me there is no Savior.”
Revelation 1:17-18; Revelation 2:8 - (Jesus is the First and the Last)

Isaiah 44:6 - (God is the Redeemer)
2 Peter 1:1 (Jesus is the Redeemer) - “To those who have obtained like precious faith with us by the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ”

Isaiah 44:24 - (God created the world by Himself alone)
John 1:3; Colossians 1:16 - (Jesus made all things)

John 1:1-3 - In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made... 1:14 - And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us,

John 5:17,18 - “My Father has been working until now, and I have been working.” Therefore the Jews sought to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God.

John 5:23 - that all should honor the Son just as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him.

John 8:24 - “Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I AM [He], you will die in your sins.”

John 8:58 - Then Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.”

John 10:30-33 - Jesus answered them, “I and My Father are one.” Then the Jews took up stones again to stone Him. Jesus answered them, “Many good works I have shown you from My Father. For which of those works do you stone Me?” The Jews answered Him, saying, “For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy, and because You, being a Man, make Yourself God.”

John 14:6-7 - Jesus said to him, “I AM the way, the truth, and the Life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.”

John 14:9-11 - Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you so long and yet you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, 'Show us the Father'?”

John 20:28 - And Thomas answered and said to Him, “My Lord and my God!”

Acts 4:12 - “Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved.”

Acts 20:28 - (God purchased us with His own blood)
Revelation 1:5-6; Revelation 5:8-9 - (Jesus' blood purchased us)

Philippians 2:5-7 - Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus, who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God, but made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a bond-servant, and coming in the likeness of men.

Colossians 2:9 - For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily

1 Timothy 3:16 - And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifested in the flesh, Justified in the Spirit, Seen by angels, Preached among the Gentiles, Believed on in the world, Received up in glory.

Titus 2:13 - looking for the blessed hope and glorious appearing of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ

Hebrews 1:8-9 - But to the Son He says: “Your throne, O God, is forever and ever; A scepter of righteousness is the scepter of Your kingdom. You have loved righteousness and hated lawlessness; Therefore God, Your God, has anointed You with the oil of gladness more than Your companions.”

2 John 1:7 - For many deceivers have gone out into the world who do not confess Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

Revelation 1:8 - “I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End,” says the Lord, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.”

Revelation 22:13 - “I AM the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last.”... 22:16 - “I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches.”

1 Timothy 6:14-16 - “our Lord Jesus Christ's appearing, which He will manifest in His own time, He who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings and Lord of lords, who alone has immortality, dwelling in unapproachable light, whom no man has seen or can see, to whom be honor and everlasting power. Amen.”

and man....

Matthew 12:8, For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day.

Mark 2:27-28 [27], And he said to them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath: [28], Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.

Hope this helps...

 

[3rdAngel]

2 - do you think Jesus broke the 2nd commandment by doing a work on the Sabbath?

Nope! Jesus is the creator of the Sabbath *John 1:1-4; 14 and taught us how to keep the Sabbath *Matthew 12:1-12.

In the days of Jesus the religious teachers of the day had placed so many man made traditions around Sabbath keeping that it had become a burden to the people. It was though in their eyes MANKIND was made for the Sabbath. It was so bad in fact that these religious teachers were constantly looking for ways to accuse Jesus of breaking the Sabbath (Matt 12:1-2; 10; Mark 3:2'; Luke 6:1-2).

Jesus rebuked these religious teachers by saying that the Sabbath was made for MAN and NOT MAN for the SABBATH (Mark 2:27 and that he was the CREATOR or LORD of the Sabbath (Mark 2:28) and it was LAWFUL to do GOOD on the SABBATH (Matt 12:12)

Jesus did God's WORK on the Sabbath and so should we everyday but God's WORK is not the work we are commanded NOT to do on God's Sabbath for it is lawful to do GOOD on the Sabbath.

Have you not read what David did, when he was hungry, and they that were with him; How he entered into the house of God, and did eat the showbread, which was not lawful for him to eat, neither for them who were with him, but only for the priests?

Or have you not read in the law, how that on the sabbath days the priests in the temple profane the sabbath, and are blameless? Is it lawful to do good on the sabbath days, or to do evil? to save life, or to kill? How much then is a man better than a sheep? Therefore it is lawful to do well on the sabbath days.

GOD'S 4TH COMMANDMENT

Exodus 20:8-11, Remember the SABBATH DAY, to KEEP IT HOLY. <Why?> Because God m0ade it Holy for mankind and commands us to keep it as a Holy day)
9, Six days shalt thou labor, and do all thy work:
10, But the SEVENTH DAY IS THE SABBATH of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: <WHY>
11, For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the SEVENTH DAY: wherefore the LORD BLESSED THE SABBATH, and HALLOWED IT.

Doing GOD'S WORK is NOT what the 4th Commandment is talking about please read it.

God's 4th Commandments says we are NOT to do OUR OWN WORK. Yep NO secular business or paid work, no unnecessary domestic work, no buying and selling, shopping. This can be done on the other days of the week. God has made the SEVENTH DAY a HOLY DAY and we are to REST in HIM by FAITH in the LORD of the SABBATH. This is the 4th Commandment and one of the God's 10.

.......................
SIN is the breaking of God's Commandments (James 2:9-11; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4) Those who CONTINUE in UNREPENTANT SIN will NOT enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN.
......................

God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has led many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

There is not one scripture in all of God's Word that says that God's 4th Commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to KEEP Sunday as a Holy day.

Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of men or the Word of God? Who should we believe the Words of men or the Word of God?

In times of ignorance God winks at but now ,<when a KNOWLEDGE of the truth has come> calls all men everywhere to REPENT (FOLLOW) (Acts 17:30-31).

 

[3rdAngel]

3 - do you think Jesus in Matt 5:21 "you have heard do no murder, but I say..." was casting doubt on 5th Commandment? 4 - do you think Jesus in Matt 5:27 "you have heard it say do not commit adultery, but I say..." was casting doubt on the 6th Commandment? 5 - do you think Jesus' message was the Ten Commandments?

Nope! Jesus came to magnify the law and make it honorable in fulfillment of Isaiah 42:21 by applying God's 10 Commandments to our very thoughts and feelings. The context of Matthew 5:21 is Matthew 5:20 which says..

MATTHEW 5:20 [20], For I say to you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

JESUS came to magnify the LAW from the INSIDE OUT quoting MATTHEW 5:17-32 (thoughts and feelings) in fulfillment of *ISAIAH 42:21. This is to show that unless our RIGHTOUESNESS EXCEEDS the RIGHTOUESNESS of the Scribes and Pharisees we can in no way enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN. Jesus is saying the problem runs deeper then outward observance to the 10 Commandments. EVIL begins in the HEART.

BREAKING GOD's 10 COMMANDMENTS from the heart defile a man *MATTHEW 15:18-19. JESUS is saying we can be outwardly perfect and blameless like the Scribes and Pharisee but inwardly like dead mans bones *MATTHEW 23:27-28. JESUS magnified the LAW to the INSIDE OUT. To show us that we are all sinners in need of a Saviour and that sin originates in the HEART (thoughts and feelings). That is why we have the NEW COVENANT promise and need to be BORN AGAIN by Faith in God's WORD for salvation to be free from SIN (breaking any one of God's 10 commandments) *HEBREWS 8:10-12; 1 JOHN 3:3-10.

If we are not BORN AGAIN into the NEW COVENANT promise and continue in it we will not enter the kingdom of Heaven *1 JOHN 2:3-4; 1 JOHN 2:3-4. ALL those who KNOWINGLY break any one of God's 10 commandments stand guilty before God of sin *JAMES 2:10-11. All those who KNOWINGLY CONTINUE in UNREPENTANT SIN will not enter into God's KINGDOM *HEBREWS 10:26-27 because they reject the gift of God's dear son *ROMANS 6:23. God's 4th Commandment is one of the 10 Commandments that give us the KNOWLEDGE of what sin is. There is no such thing as the 9 commandments in God's WORD. The same as there is no scripure that says God's 4th commandment is Abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a Holy day.

RIGHTESOUSNESS comes from LOVE because LOVE is the fulfilling of God's LAW and the very expression of what LOVE is *ROMANS 13:8-10. He that does not LOVE does not KNOW GOD for GOD IS LOVE * 1 JOHN 4:8. All those who are BORN AGAIN have a NEW HEART TO LOVE and FOLLOW GOD *1 JOHN 4:7. This is the NEW COVENANT promise *HEBREWS 8:10-12.

Those who are BORN AGAIN do not practice SIN (breaking God's Commandments) *1 JOHN 3:4-9. This is why JOHN finishes on this subject by saying; For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous *1 JOHN 5:3 and is why JESUS says IF you LOVE me KEEP my commandments *JOHN 14:15. UNLESS we are BORN AGAIN under the NEW COVENANT to LOVE we will not enter the KINGDOM of HEAVEN *JOHN 3:3-7. We need to be changed from the INSIDE OUT.

Can we have GRACE without God's LAW if the purpose of God's LAW is to give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTOUESNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4; PSALMS 119:172 and to lead us to Christ that we might be forgiven through faith *GALATIANS 3:22-25?

Hope this is helpful

 

[3rdAngel]

6 - why didn't Jesus pull his followers up when they made Sunday their Sabbath?

Jesus did not need to as his followers never made Sunday their Sabbath and there is no scripture in all of God's Word that says so.

7 - why was it necessary for Moses to give the Jews a list of Commandments?

The JEWS were slaves in Egypt *EXODUS 20:1-2 and had mostly forgotten God's ways.

Now back to the OP please.....

Can anyone please show me where in all the bible does is say (SOLA SCRIPTURA; Scripture only please)...

1. That God's 4th commandments 7th day Sabbath has been abolished?

2. That Jesus is a Sabbath?

3. The Sabbath (seventh day) was ever changed from the seventh to the first day of the week?

4. Where we are told to keep the first day of the week holy?

5. Where the first day of the week (Sunday) is ever called a holy day?

6. That says that Jesus ever kept the first day (Sunday)?

7. That tells us to keep the first day in honour of the resurrection of Christ?

8. Where the first day is ever given any sacred name?

9. That affirms that any of the apostles ever kept the first day as the Sabbath?

10. From any apostolic writings that authorizes Sunday observance as the Sabbath of God?

11. Where we are told not to work on the first day of the week?

12. That says the seventh day is no longer God's Sabbath day?

13. That says the seventh day Sabbath is ABOLISHED?

14. Where the apostles ever taught any convert to keep the first day of the week as a Sabbath?

15. Where the first day was ever appointed to be kept as the Lord's Day?

16. Where the first day of the week is ever called the Lord's Day?

17. That says that the first day of the week was ever sanctified and hallowed as a day of rest?

18. That says that the Father or the Son (Jesus) rested on the first day of the week?

19. That says that Jesus, Paul or any other of the apostles taught anyone to observe the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

20. That calls the seventh day the “Jewish Sabbath” or one text that calls Sunday the “Christian Sabbath”?

21. Telling man to keep the first day of the week holy or to worship or rest on the first day of the week?

22. Authorizing anyone to set aside God's Sabbath and observe any other day?

23. Showing any of the apostles keeping the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

24. Authorizing someone to set aside the fourth Commandment and observe any other day of the week?

25. Where any apostle taught us to keep the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

26. Declaring that the seventh day is no longer the Eternal Sabbath day?

27. Where Sunday is now appointed to be kept as the New Testament Sabbath or holy day?

If you have no scriptures for anyone of these questions who are we following; God's Word or the teachings and traditions of men that break the commandments of God *MATTHEW 15:3-9?

May you receive God's Word and be blessed.

 

[PruePhillip]

Hi Phillip nice to meet you here . Thanks for your thoughts. Some comments are provided below for your consideration. Although I will make this over a few posts so it covers everything and it is easier to read.
Nope! Jesus was God.....

We had this trinity discussion last night. I think it did both our heads in.
Jesus is the Son of God. He did God's will. He did not know the time of
His return, only His father did. But this trinity things is a huge black hole.
Jesus was ONE with his Father, but He calls upon us to be ONE with
him and His father too.

 

[PruePhillip]

Jesus did not need to as his followers never made Sunday their Sabbath and there is no scripture in all of God's Word that says so.

It is historically incontrovertible that Christians held the
Sunday to be their Sabbath. And this was given its
first impetus with Jesus chosing this day for His
three appearances to them as they themselves
gathered.

In the Sermon on the Mount Jesus was making it
clear that the Ten Commandments were not going
to save anyone.

 

[3rdAngel]

It is historically incontrovertible that Christians held the
Sunday to be their Sabbath. And this was given its
first impetus with Jesus chosing this day for His
three appearances to them as they themselves
gathered.

In the Sermon on the Mount Jesus was making it
clear that the Ten Commandments were not going
to save anyone.

Actually no Phillip. God's people have always kept the Sabbath all through time to Jesus and the Apostle during the life of Jesus and after his death and ressurrection unbroken right to this very present day. The apostles never kept Sunday as God's Sabbath and there is no scripture that says that they did. According to God's Word in the new covenant God's Law (10 Commandments) gives us the knowledge of "Good and Evil; Sin and Righteouness" *Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4 and if we break any one of God's commandments we stand guilty before God of sin *James 2:10-11. God's 4th commandment is one of God's 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is *Exodus 20:8-11 and just like any other of the commandments of God if we knowingly break it we commit sin because sin is the trangression of God's Law *1 JOHN 3:4.

Now in times of ignorance God does not hold us accountable for sin until we are given a knowledge that something is sin *James 4:17; Acts 17:30-31. If we are given a knowledge of the truth and continue in sin than God holds us accountable for that sin we commit *Hebrews 10:26-39.

God has his people in every church living up to all the knowledge of his Word that he has revealed to them *John 10:16. God knows that many Churches are teaching man made teachings and trqaditions that break the commandments of God and are leading his people away from his Word *Matthew 15:3-9 but the hour is coming and now is when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeks such to worship him. God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth *John 4:23-24.

God is calling his people out where ever they may be from following man made teachings and traditions that break the commandments of God back to the pure Word of God *Revelaiton 18:1-5.

God's Sheep will hear his Voice (the Word) and follow him.

 

[PruePhillip]

Actually no Phillip. God's people have always kept the Sabbath all through time to Jesus and the Apostle during the life of Jesus and after his death and ressurrection unbroken right to this very present day. The apostles never kept Sunday as God's Sabbath and there is no scripture that says that they did. According to God's Word in the new covenant God's Law (10 Commandments) gives us the knowledge of "Good and Evil; Sin and Righteouness" *Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4 and if we break any one of God's commandments we stand guilty before God of sin *James 2:10-11. God's 4th commandment is one of God's 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is *Exodus 20:8-11 and just like any other of the commandments of God if we knowingly break it we commit sin because sin is the trangression of God's Law *1 JOHN 3:4.

Now in times of ignorance God does not hold us accountable for sin until we are given a knowledge that something is sin *James 4:17; Acts 17:30-31. If we are given a knowledge of the truth and continue in sin than God holds us accountable for that sin we commit *Hebrews 10:26-39.

God has his people in every church living up to all the knowledge of his Word that he has revealed to them *John 10:16. God knows that many Churches are teaching man made teachings and trqaditions that break the commandments of God and are leading his people away from his Word *Matthew 15:3-9 but the hour is coming and now is when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeks such to worship him. God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth *John 4:23-24.

God is calling his people out where ever they may be from following man made teachings and traditions that break the commandments of God back to the pure Word of God *Revelaiton 18:1-5.

God's Sheep will hear his Voice (the Word) and follow him.

The secular history of Christendom states clearly that
EVERY church treated Sunday as the "Lord's Day."
This history goes right back to the First Century. There
never was, until much later, any church that tried to
differentiate itself with Saturday worship.
And if Jesus respected their "first day of the week"
service then I am fine with that. I don't live under the
Ten Commandments.

 

[Katzpur]

The Bible clearly says that Jesus was crucified on a Wednesday and resurrected on a Saturday.

I ask you to -read- the site I have linked to you.
When Was Jesus Christ Crucified and Resurrected? : Did He Really Die on Good Friday and Come Back to Life on Easter Sunday?

I'm not interested in what the site you provided says. I'm interested in what the Bible says. If the Bible "clearly says" something, I'd like to know where.

 

[3rdAngel]

The secular history of Christendom states clearly that
EVERY church treated Sunday as the "Lord's Day."
This history goes right back to the First Century. There
never was, until much later, any church that tried to
differentiate itself with Saturday worship.
And if Jesus respected their "first day of the week"
service then I am fine with that. I don't live under the
Ten Commandments.

Sunday worship or the claim to Sunday worship being "THE LORDS DAY" is only a man-made teaching and tradition that breaks the commandments of God that is not biblical. There is no scripture for this tradition taught in the churches today and that is why this thread has been started and the questions are being asked; who are we following; God or man?

Many Churches today are teaching man made teachings that are not biblical and leading all away from God's Word. Jesus does not respect the practice of following man made teachings and traditions over the Word of God and warns us against doing it. This is very plain to see in Matthew 15:3-9; John 4:23-24; 1 John 2:3-4; John 3:15-21; Matthew 7:22-26.

Sin is defined in God's Word as breaking anyone of God's 10 Commandments *James 2:10-11; 1 John 3:4 and Sin is the difference between the children of God and the children of the devil *1 John 3:6-10; Revelation 14:12; 22-14.

God's 4th commandment is one of God's 10 commandments that define what sin is when broken *James 2:10-11

According to God's Word all those who knowingly practice sin will not enter the kingdom of heave because they reject the gift of God's dear son and count the blood of the covenant an unholy thing *Romans 6:23; Hebrews 10:26-39.

God has hjs people in every Church *John 10:16 and knows that his people have been led astray by these Churches and in times of ignorance God does not hold us accountable for sin but when he gives us a knowledge of the truth of his Word calls all men everywhere to believe and follow him *Acts 17:30-31. God is calling his people out from following man made teachings and traditions *Matthew 15:3-9 back to the pure Word of God *John 4:23-24; Revelation 18:1-4

God's Sheep hear His Voice (the Word of God) and follow him *John 10:26-27

 

[3rdAngel]

The "Lord's day" had another meaning when Jesus rose and appeared to them on three separate Sundays as they were gathered IN SERVICE.
Why do YOU think the Christians honored the Sunday in the First Century?

As shown earlier brother there is no scripture that says that "THE LORDS DAY" is Sunday or the first day of the week. "THE LORDS DAY" according to the scriptures alone is the sabbath day *Matthew 12:8. Sunday proclaimed as "THE LORDS DAY" is simply a man made teaching and tradition handed down that is not supported by Gods' Word. God's people worship God everyday of the week and have kept God's 4th commandment all through time unbroken to this very present day. Many churches today are teaching people things that are not biblical and leading people away from Gods Word.