'Man was created in the image of G-d'

[Katzpur]

I read the texts in the context of the religion. Jesus=God, therefore we can find Scripture to back this fact up.

Okay, but Jesus' Father is also God, right. And yet you say you are not a Trinitarian. So I'm wondering, are they both God? Are they the same God? Was the Father involved in the creation or was Jesus alone the Creator? Not trying to start an argument here. Just trying to figure out where you're coming from.

 

[Katzpur]

No offence mate, but you seem to completely fail to understand the basics of Christianity.

No the texts do not equate Jesus to god, Jesus is the son of god. God is the father.

Jesus is not equal to god, Christianity posits a divine trinity. God the father, god the son and the holy spirit.

Jesus being the son of god.

You make it sound as if Christianity is one, undivided religion where all 2 billion believers are in agreement. Many Christians believe Jesus is God. Many Christians believe He is equal to God. Many do not believe in a trinity (i.e. "The Trinity"). One can be a Christian and hold different opinions on these points (which is why I'm trying to understand disciple's).

 

[Bunyip]

You make it sound as if Christianity is one, undivided religion where all 2 billion believers are in agreement. Many Christians believe Jesus is God. Many Christians believe He is equal to God. Many do not believe in a trinity (i.e. "The Trinity"). One can be a Christian and hold different opinions on these points (which is why I'm trying to understand disciple's).

Well over half of Christianity is one such undivided faith in the holy trinity -Catholicism. But yes, I do understand that there is a diversity of views. Almost as many different interpretations as there are believers.

 

[McBell]

I read the texts in the context of the religion. Jesus=God, therefore we can find Scripture to back this fact up.

So present it already.
I mean, you have only bee flat out asked numerous times to present, but you never do.

Rather revealing.

 

[McBell]

Well over half of Christianity is one such undivided faith in the holy trinity -Catholicism.

Interesting claim.

What have you to support it?

 

[Desert Snake]

Okay, but Jesus' Father is also God, right. And yet you say you are not a Trinitarian. So I'm wondering, are they both God? Are they the same God? Was the Father involved in the creation or was Jesus alone the Creator? Not trying to start an argument here. Just trying to figure out where you're coming from.

Personally I would just say Jesus is God, no trinity, also known as the Father. Same Deity, different names/titles in essence. Therefore no trinity.


p.s I should mention, Jesus the man is different from Jesus the God in my opinion.

 

[Bunyip]

Interesting claim.

What have you to support it?

Support what? The fact that Catholicism is over half of all Christianity, or the fact that Catholicism worships the holy trinity?

 

[Desert Snake]

So present it already.
I mean, you have only bee flat out asked numerous times to present, but you never do.

Rather revealing.

Actually, I don't know what you want me to 'prove'. My belief is that Jesus=God, that's how I read the Bible. There are references to Jesus the God, many Christians believe Jesus is God, it is pretty standard theology. It just isn't the flavor you want i.e. trinity I have to assume.

 

[Desert Snake]

One can be a Christian and hold different opinions on these points (which is why I'm trying to understand disciple's).

I'm not trying to be confusing, I think when Jesus said 'the Father and I are one', He meant the Deity Jesus, and also that He was representing God in human form.

If Jesus had meant that statement literally, you would be reading it as Jesus calling himself God, That doesn't make sense to me.

 

[Ingledsva]

Is that how you normally use the word "image" or do you reserve that particular definition exclusively for when you're talking about our being created in the image of God? Can you use the word "image" in a sentence, referring to absolutely anything except our image as it relates to God, in such a way that it it not understood to mean "the representation of someone or something's physical attributes?

For instance, we say that a little boy who looks a lot like his dad is said to be "the spittin' image of his dad." We say that identical twins, who looks almost exactly alike, are "the mirror image" of one another. We say that when we see what we look like in a mirror, we are looking at our "image." We say that a photographer captures the image of what someone looks like with his camera. We even say that a person is "the image of health" when he looks to be healthy. We never, ever, ever use the word to refer to free will in normal conversation. Why should the meaning of the word be completely different when we're talking about God creating man in His image?

Indeed. Interestingly the word it is from, is "tselem," meaning - shade - phantom - ghost - illusion - resemblance - image, etc.


That leaves it open to several interpretations.


But it is most likely they meant the more ethereal part of us, that in their religion, survives death.


No bearded old man sitting out there.



*

 

[Ingledsva]

Personally I would just say Jesus is God, no trinity, also known as the Father. Same Deity, different names/titles in essence. Therefore no trinity.


p.s I should mention, Jesus the man is different from Jesus the God in my opinion.

Then why does he pray to himself, numerous times, even asking - if it is God's will - that this "cup" be taken from him? Is he schizophrenic?


Mat 26:39 And he went a little further, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt.


*

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Personally I would just say Jesus is God, no trinity, also known as the Father. Same Deity, different names/titles in essence. Therefore no trinity.


p.s I should mention, Jesus the man is different from Jesus the God in my opinion.

Sounds like this: Oneness Pentecostalism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Desert Snake]

Sounds like this: Oneness Pentecostalism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Thanks!

 

[Desert Snake]

Can't frubal you yet.

 

[John Martin]

It is very useful to understand Jesus Christ in different levels of consciousness. We can see four levels: Jesus Christ identified with his physical body, a human being, a man. Secondly Jesus Christ identified with his Jewish belief system. He was Jew. thirdly Jesus Christ who transcended his Jesus identity and realized to be universal. Fourthly Jesus Christ identified with God.
Let us use the analogy of tree. A tree has leaves,branches,trunk and the roots. Leaves represent individuality, physical. Branches represent collective consciousness, religions or belief systems. Trunk represents universal consciousness. Roots represent divine consciousness.
First Jesus Christ as a physical human being is a leaf. As a Jew he was living according to the precepts of the Jewish branch. At the moment of his baptism he transcended the Jewish branch and entered into the consciousness of the Trunk. Finally his awareness entered into the roots realizes being one with God. His awareness has to return to the leaf level. But the life in the life manifest the spirit of the roots,divine. His humanity becomes the vehicle of the divine. Jesus Christ is the whole tree. His first two levels,body and religious identity belong to the process of time and space. His other two levels the trunk and the roots belong to his eternal level. He is fully human in one level and fully divine in other level. His humanity is a vehicle for his divine level. At the level of the roots his consciousness is one with the divine.At the level of the leaves his consciousness is one with his body, with his humanity.
The expression son of God has to be understood from different levels. The word 'son' is more metaphorical than metaphysical. At the level of a leaf, body, Jesus is a son of God. At the level of the branch Jesus, as a Jew, is a collective son of God. Here it is not one individual but the whole people of Israel, as one son of God. God says, I have called my son, out of Egypt.. Here the expression 'son' refers to the whole people of Israel. At the level of the trunk, it is the universal son of God. The universal Son of God is one who stands before God representing the whole of humanity and of creation. The Son of God speaks to the whole of humanity and creation in the name of God. The Son of God says, I am in God and God is in me. He says. I am in the Father and Father is in the Son. The Father is like the Sun and the Son is like the Moon. The Spirit of the Sun reflects in the Moon. The expression of Trinity belongs to this level. God is the Father, the universal consciousness is the Son and the reflection of the Father in the Son is the Holy Spirit.
Finally at the level of the roots, Jesus Christ consciousness is one with God. There is only one God.
The problem comes only when we project the third level to the fourth level and say God is the Trinity, the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. Trinitarian experience of Jesus belong to the third level of consciousness.

 

[Katzpur]

Personally I would just say Jesus is God, no trinity, also known as the Father. Same Deity, different names/titles in essence. Therefore no trinity.


p.s I should mention, Jesus the man is different from Jesus the God in my opinion.

Okay, well I have no argument with you about Jesus being God, and I'm not a Trinitarian either, so we're on the same page there. But who do you think Jesus was talking to/referring to when He spoke of "my God"?

 

[Desert Snake]

Okay, well I have no argument with you about Jesus being God, and I'm not a Trinitarian either, so we're on the same page there. But who do you think Jesus was talking to/referring to when He spoke of "my God"?

I assume that He would be referring to God in the usual sense, as He was separated in the sense of being a man. The man aspect was separated.

The apparence of separation is only present when the aspects of God are being shown in more than one manner. Not sure if I explained that properly, but we can't have total seperation and oneness (clearly spoken of by Jesus), at the same time.

p.s. these concepts are explained better elsewhere. It seems on the basic level we agree.

 

[Desert Snake]

It is very useful to understand Jesus Christ in different levels of consciousness. We can see four levels: Jesus Christ identified with his physical body, a human being, a man. Secondly Jesus Christ identified with his Jewish belief system. He was Jew. thirdly Jesus Christ who transcended his Jesus identity and realized to be universal. Fourthly Jesus Christ identified with God.
Let us use the analogy of tree. A tree has leaves,branches,trunk and the roots. Leaves represent individuality, physical. Branches represent collective consciousness, religions or belief systems. Trunk represents universal consciousness. Roots represent divine consciousness.
First Jesus Christ as a physical human being is a leaf. As a Jew he was living according to the precepts of the Jewish branch. At the moment of his baptism he transcended the Jewish branch and entered into the consciousness of the Trunk. Finally his awareness entered into the roots realizes being one with God. His awareness has to return to the leaf level. But the life in the life manifest the spirit of the roots,divine. His humanity becomes the vehicle of the divine. Jesus Christ is the whole tree. His first two levels,body and religious identity belong to the process of time and space. His other two levels the trunk and the roots belong to his eternal level. He is fully human in one level and fully divine in other level. His humanity is a vehicle for his divine level. At the level of the roots his consciousness is one with the divine.At the level of the leaves his consciousness is one with his body, with his humanity.
The expression son of God has to be understood from different levels. The word 'son' is more metaphorical than metaphysical. At the level of a leaf, body, Jesus is a son of God. At the level of the branch Jesus, as a Jew, is a collective son of God. Here it is not one individual but the whole people of Israel, as one son of God. God says, I have called my son, out of Egypt.. Here the expression 'son' refers to the whole people of Israel. At the level of the trunk, it is the universal son of God. The universal Son of God is one who stands before God representing the whole of humanity and of creation. The Son of God speaks to the whole of humanity and creation in the name of God. The Son of God says, I am in God and God is in me. He says. I am in the Father and Father is in the Son. The Father is like the Sun and the Son is like the Moon. The Spirit of the Sun reflects in the Moon. The expression of Trinity belongs to this level. God is the Father, the universal consciousness is the Son and the reflection of the Father in the Son is the Holy Spirit.
Finally at the level of the roots, Jesus Christ consciousness is one with God. There is only one God.
The problem comes only when we project the third level to the fourth level and say God is the Trinity, the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. Trinitarian experience of Jesus belong to the third level of consciousness.

This is false. Jesus was not a 'normal person who had a religious experience'. He was divine from birth, indicated by worship from the three wise men. You are simply trying, again, to mesh religious concepts that don't mix. Christianity doesn't believe that Jesus was just like the rest of us, Trinitarians don't believe that, oneness Christians don't believe that, it isn't part of the religion.

 

[Nakosis]

'Man was created in the image of G-d'.
The G-d that is the likeness of man is Jesus, not an "invisible' god.

Jesus is The Creator G-d.

You have to first accept this ancient story of which we are not even certain of it''s origin, has any validity. No good reason to do so other then your faith requires it and you want to believe it.

You also interpret to support your beliefs.

As someone else mentioned, in "our" image and "our" likeness. Huh? How many entities where hanging around when God created the universe?

I'm happy to allow you to believe what you want. But really nothing here that should make you think someone else would accept the validity of this statement.

 

[Desert Snake]

You have to first accept this ancient story of which we are not even certain of it''s origin, has any validity. No good reason to do so other then your faith requires it and you want to believe it.

You also interpret to support your beliefs.

Every religion does that.

I'm happy to allow you to believe what you want. But really nothing here that should make you think someone else would accept the validity of this statement.

Merely your opinion.