Curious George
Veteran Member
I don’t know that there are too many counter examples. But feel free to address the arguments. Let us hear how the counter examples stack up.
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Mass shooting at gay nightclub.
- Thread starter Father Heathen
- Start date
Watch your language, missy!
But thank you for posting in a manner that
apes those who can't discuss real solutions
while in that mode.
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
The time for **** moods is here. People are getting killed and some people don't want anything done about it. Some even want it worse. Seriously, whackass Lefts and Rights even want criminals armed. We see Reps pushing against keeping guns away from those who have a history of aggression. We see Cons endlessly repeat "guns don't kill" and "good guys with a gun" like they're a scratched record.
And what do they do when pressed for a sollution? They blame mental illness, which is terrible because it further stigmatizes mental illness and furthers the myth that those with mental illness are likely to be violent.
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
I have addressed it. I gave examples. What's worse that the Aussies are seeing since they banned assault rifles?
I know.
So I'm joining in...but in that other thread.
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
It's closed. I typed out a response to you but the forum said nope.
Basically the two of us agree on many things, but I'm quicker with a middle finger to those who disagree on certain issues, like the boneheaded idea of letting people get guns without first making sure they are trained to safely and properly use them. Or blaming mental illness. I don't like that one either.
Curious George
Veteran Member
No, you didn’t address it. Nor does anecdotal evidence for a short time period address it.
Rather convenient since we have footage from the last year of streams where he referred to himself as a boy even during high stress situations such as confronting police over a bomb threat. And even his neighbors who he was on good terms with were never informed of a nonbinary identity. As well as him regularly using slurs against gay and trans people noted by many witnesses. Almost like it's a ploy to get hate crimes dropped recommended by lawyers.
People who think they will fight off modern technological warfare with their handguns and AR-15s are deluded and should be told so. Fear of government is a handy tool to motivate gun sales but fear of unmitigated wealth hoarding is a much more pressing issue. Because enough resources with today's technology makes armed rebellions look like plants vs zombies.
Instead of thinking the solution is everyone has guns, how about we put more in place to prevent wealth hoarding? It has the added benefit of addressing how wealth inequality leads to increased crime, both crime by the wealthy and the destitute.
I too had a fun post all ready to go,
but the thread was closed.
Some people sure know how to
create a thread doomed to fail.
Curious George
Veteran Member
I think I sense a straw man.
I think the statistics show that populations that have lost their gun rights and live in more totalitarian or authoritarian countries are at a risk for much more loss than we have seen with all of the school shootings combined. I think that the US has a history of abusing authority, oppression, and dishonesty. Nothing I have seen leads me to believe that it is a good idea to sacrifice the right to keep and bear arms or that any government should have the authority to do so.
in the US, each individual is responsible for protecting themselves. The police and other authorities only owe a duty to the public at large. I think that people who ask for gun regulation are no different than those who ask for regulating women’s access to reproductive care. I think that both are deluded and should be told so.
*glances at Japan*
Yeah thats simply not true.
Furthermore, it's a fear response used by organizations like NRA to prey upon vulnerable communities whom are much more vulnerable to the application of their product then they are of 'the man.' And whom would be better off fighting against potential Tyrants by regulating class warfare beforehand than sporting their pea shooters against drones and napalm after the fact.
Curious George
Veteran Member
you mean the Japan:
“From the invasion of China in 1937 to the end of World War II, the Japanese military regime murdered near 3,000,000 to over 10,000,000 people, most probably almost 6,000,000 Chinese, Indonesians, Koreans, Filipinos, and Indochinese, among others, including Western prisoners of war. This democide was due to a morally bankrupt political and military strategy, military expediency and custom, and national culture (such as the view that those enemy soldiers who surrender while still able to resist were criminals)”
https://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/SOD.CHAP3.HTM
Are you trying to pigeon hole me into an argument about citizens and government fighting a war or something? I just do not see how your last comment is relevant.
I mean the Japan that basically has no citizen rights to guns yet has the longest life spans, lowest crime, better standards of livin, better access to education, healthcare, etc, and has not suffered in the slightest by guns being absent from daily life. The posit that Japan was formerly tyrannical and that's why Japanese citizens should have guns even more objectively wrong.
Guns don't make our situation better. It just furthers toxic gun culture. Where the shadowy man/tyrant is the thing to fear and the solution is guns, rather than reforms to prevent Tyrants to come into power in the first place. Something we can do without encouraging toxic gun culture.
Curious George
Veteran Member
You forgot to mention higher suicide rates.
and lol at the shadowy man/tyrant. This is precisely the fear mongering that is being used to restrict access to self defense in the first place.
I am not positing that Japan should have access to guns, I am noting that assumptions of less killing based on citizens having access to less guns is wishful thinking not rooted in facts as proponents of gun control would have people believe. Japan is an example of this.
marvelously easily solutions to complex problems are rarely solutions at all. This is the case with gun control. People see killing and think well if they didn’t have a gun or it was harder to access a gun then all would be hunky-dory. I haven’t even taken a stance here saying that gun control couldn’t help the issue. I have suggested that there might be more to the story, more factors to consider, and other threats at play.
We Never Know
No Slack
IMO we don't have a toxic gun culture.
We have toxic people using guns to carry out their toxic twisted idea's.
Ordinary people don't commit mass shootings.
I'm going to call it toxic gun culture for the same reason I call it toxic diet culture, or toxic gym culture or toxic video game culture. Yes people are involved. That doesn't change that they're using a specific tool to propagate a specific and toxic culture.
We Never Know
No Slack
"Yes people are involved. That doesn't change that they're using a specific tool"
Yep. Its a people problem.
Sure. It's a problem with people abusing tools that should be regulated to prevent abuse, as well as addressing the cultural and sociological reasons people come to abuse the tools to begin with. Not unlike how we address the drug issue.