Mosque at Ground Zero

[EtuMalku]

Muslim apologetics is boring, al-Qaeda are dangerous, they lurk behind passive Islam. This makes me nervous (and many others it seems). So, what do you propose can be done about this situation?

Isn't that an argument not to build anything?

 

[Alceste]

Muslim apologetics is boring, al-Qaeda are dangerous, they lurk behind passive Islam. This makes me nervous (and many others it seems). So, what do you propose can be done about this situation?

You and all the other "nervous" Americans can educate yourselves and make friends with some mainstream Muslims. Then you will feel much better about the whole thing, if the polls are any indication.

 

[HonestJoe]

Muslim apologetics is boring, al-Qaeda are dangerous, they lurk behind passive Islam. This makes me nervous (and many others it seems). So, what do you propose can be done about this situation?

That's significantly more specific than your concern which I originally responded to.

I believe the situation can be improved by us accepting moderate Muslims in to our society just as we do moderate Christians, Jews, Hindus etc. Of course, that equally requires those Muslims to accept that place in our society with the compromises that entails (by all accounts, this group seems to have already been doing that). It is easier for extremists and terrorists to hide amongst the moderates when the moderates are themselves feel forced in to hiding to a greater or lesser extent. That is essentially why I think this centre should go ahead.

I doubt we can eradicate your nervousness of them (or theirs of you I suspect). That's just human nature which we have to deal with. You can't hide away from everything which makes you nervous.

 

[Magic Man]

I give up. I try showing the potion of the offended, and you don't care or "don't get it" and that is the point I am trying to make. That you just don't get where they are coming from. You don't get it and you don't care.

You should probably try paying attention before giving up. We get it and we care. Some people are offended because they equate a symbol of Islam with the people who committed the 9/11 attacks. What you're not getting is that there is no reason to associate this center with Muslim extremists.

Further, since you are not here this discussion as to whether or not it should be built is moot because you are not in NYC. You don't see both sides. You only see your own. Which is neither side involved in the issue.

First, it doesn't matter where we are. This has become a national debate because we're talking about whether or not Muslims should build a community center. Living in NYC makes no difference, even if you want to pretend that non-NYCers clearly don't understand the issue like you do.

Second, we see both sides. The problem is not our lack of understanding; it's yours. The one side is against them building the center because they incorrectly associate such a building with Muslim extremists. The other side is trying to tell them how incorrect that association is.

YOu don't see the danger involved. and no I am not talking about Muslims pretending not to be al-quada coming in. I am talking about all that think al-quada will be involved. I don't want people hurt but I am just one. I see the raising tide coming. I see the hatred boiling. I see the that one day, someone scared enough(yes I said scared) will come along and go serial on any that go near any mosque.

Well, that's the chance they take. Just like people like Martin Luther King Jr. took the chance of being assassinated for doing what was right. If they're willing to take the risk, good for them. They can do a lot of good that way.

 

[Magic Man]

Muslim apologetics is boring,

I assume by "Muslim apologetics" you mean "people who uphold the Constitution and speak out against the intense bigotry we see towards Muslims". And if we're that boring, why are you still here?

al-Qaeda are dangerous

That's true. Luckily they have no part in this community center.

they lurk behind passive Islam.

No, they don't.

This makes me nervous (and many others it seems). So, what do you propose can be done about this situation?

I propose you can educate yourself, and stop this irrational nonsense.

 

[EtuMalku]

Over 13,000 posts and you still don't know how to reply in a constructive and well mannered way, take a lesson from AverageJoe, his reply was constructive and well mannered.

I assume by "Muslim apologetics" you mean "people who uphold the Constitution and speak out against the intense bigotry we see towards Muslims". And if we're that boring, why are you still here?



That's true. Luckily they have no part in this community center.



No, they don't.



I propose you can educate yourself, and stop this irrational nonsense.

 

[tumbleweed41]

Over 13,000 posts and you still don't know how to reply in a constructive and well mannered way, take a lesson from AverageJoe, his reply was constructive and well mannered.

Well, that was constructive and well mannered.....

 

[Alceste]

Over 13,000 posts and you still don't know how to reply in a constructive and well mannered way, take a lesson from AverageJoe, his reply was constructive and well mannered.

A lecture in manners from a man whose every post in this thread drips with anti-Islamic bigotry? That's rich.

 

[YmirGF]

A lecture in manners from a man whose every post in this thread drips with anti-Islamic bigotry? That's rich.

I'm beginning to wonder if you see a bigot under every rock. You have heard the story of the boy who cried, "Wolf". Right?

 

[Magic Man]

Over 13,000 posts and you still don't know how to reply in a constructive and well mannered way, take a lesson from AverageJoe, his reply was constructive and well mannered.

:spit:

Believe me, I know how to reply in a constructive and well-mannered way. There was nothing unconstructive or ill-mannered about my response. But if you really want people to reply to you in an extra-respectful way, it might be best for you to stop making irrational comments that display bigotry, while simultaneously ignoring what others are saying.

Bottom line: don't make comments like "Muslim apologetics are boring..." and expect people to respond respectfully to you.

 

[Alceste]

I'm beginning to wonder if you see a bigot under every rock. You have heard the story of the boy who cried, "Wolf". Right?

Lol. Wold. No, haven't heard that one. If you're not seeing anti-Islamic sentiment in Etu's posts, you're not seeing it anywhere. That explains a lot, to be honest.

Edit: wolf. You're too fast for me.

 

[Magic Man]

I'm beginning to wonder if you see a bigot under every rock. You have heard the story of the boy who cried, "Wolf". Right?

Hey, it's not her fault people have been showing their anti-Muslim bigotry so much lately.

 

[EtuMalku]

Just so you are aware, I speak this way towards most religions . . . I despise most religions. So, it's really not anti-Islamic.

Look, I'm a musician, I'm in contact with a large amount of races and creeds, if you've ever heard any of my recordings you'll hear Arabic women all over them . . . I adore their voices and language as well as many different ethnic instrumentalists, of whom I am great friends with.

So, the bigot thing is actually way off.

Anyway . . . back to our prescheduled program of Islamaphobics and those who hate them

Lol. Wold. No, haven't heard that one. If you're not seeing anti-Islamic sentiment in Etu's posts, you're not seeing it anywhere. That explains a lot, to be honest.

Edit: wolf. You're too fast for me.

 

[Alceste]

Just so you are aware, I speak this way towards most religions . . . I despise most religions. So, it's really not anti-Islamic.

Look, I'm a musician, I'm in contact with a large amount of races and creeds, if you've ever heard any of my recordings you'll hear Arabic women all over them . . . I adore their voices and language as well as many different ethnic instrumentalists, of whom I am great friends with.

So, the bigot thing is actually way off.

Anyway . . . back to our prescheduled program of Islamaphobics and those who hate them

You're not worried one of those women you have on your recordings might be hiding a secret al Qaeda training camp up her backside? If not, then I see a little inconsistency here.


I'm no fan of religion either, but I tend to give mainstream believers a pass and direct the majority of my contempt toward the Phelpses and bin Ladens of the world, and I do my best not to mix it all up into one homogenous, spooky mass of deluded, dangerous freaks.

 

[gnomon]

And where do YOU live?

That was a non-responsive ejaculation.

 

[gnomon]

I give up. I try showing the potion of the offended, and you don't care or "don't get it" and that is the point I am trying to make. That you just don't get where they are coming from. You don't get it and you don't care.
Further, since you are not here this discussion as to whether or not it should be built is moot because you are not in NYC. You don't see both sides. You only see your own. Which is neither side involved in the issue.
YOu don't see the danger involved. and no I am not talking about Muslims pretending not to be al-quada coming in. I am talking about all that think al-quada will be involved. I don't want people hurt but I am just one. I see the raising tide coming. I see the hatred boiling. I see the that one day, someone scared enough(yes I said scared) will come along and go serial on any that go near any mosque.
Right now the only ones you will find protesting outside a mosque, here, are those who are fundamental Islam and feel that the imams are too moderate. They are largely ignored even by the imams. No one is worried about them.
And, yes, those that protest the new mosque/community center are also a minority, but we see them. What about the ones we don't see?

I get why people are offended. I just don't give a damn. They can ***** and moan all they want.

News we don't see?

If people started paying attention to what was going in this nation in regards to government malfeasance and the destruction of civil liberties than maybe they would grow up and realize that attempting to use emotional sensationalism to protest a community center comes across as a childish endeavor.

 

[YmirGF]

Lol. Wold. No, haven't heard that one.

I am a bit too thick to wear my spectacles and caught it right after posting, lol.

If you're not seeing anti-Islamic sentiment in Etu's posts, you're not seeing it anywhere. That explains a lot, to be honest.

You are very quick at making assumptions.

Edit: wolf. You're too fast for me.

Food for though, dear Alceste. Food for thought.

 

[Alceste]

You are very quick at making assumptions.

Au contraire - it takes me ages to leap to conclusions. It would be so much easier if I were more receptive to mob mentality. It's a cross I bear...

 

[I.S.L.A.M617]

There's already another mosque a couple blocks away, I don't see anyone screaming to have it closed down. Why is this new one such an issue? I guess Fox News can make anything into a controversy.

 

[gnomon]

There's already another mosque a couple blocks away, I don't see anyone screaming to have it closed down. Why is this new one such an issue? I guess Fox News can make anything into a controversy.

The sad thing is the Masjid Manhattan couldn't renew their lease two years ago. For obvious reasons they have stated that if the parties funding Park 51 offered monetary assistance for a new lease or for them to buy their own place they would refuse. The media has basically made them too hot.

Now imagine if members of the Christian cathedral across the street from the WTC and the members of the Synagogue across from the WTC as well as the protestors focused their efforts on helping the Masjid Manhattan buy their own building so they wouldn't have to rent out a garage right now. That might go a long way in showing that the people of New York do care. But then again, times are tough economically and I can only imagine the problems of trying to get real estate in New York City.