Muhammad said Christians are exalted until Judgement Day, why?

[1213]

What do you mean by what Jesus said? Are you talking about what is written in the Bible?

Yes, I mean what he says in the Bible.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

Why are you using the word christians ? Like I said before you are ignoring why the Tafsir is explaining and try to impose your beliefs in the text.

So again, it says followers of Jesus, there is a dispute who it is referring to. Deciples, true followers of Jesus who don’t believe in the trinity, the Muslims ourselves since we follow more the example of Jesus then Christian’s themselves

If the Christians who live today, are not true followers of Jesus, why, the verse says, until Day of Resurrection?


You already said, you don't have an answer for it.

There could be only two explanation:

Either, Quran is contradicting itself, or saying a wrong thing

Or

What Quran means by "Day of Resurrection", is, Day of Manifestation of Muhammad. If you accept this as the case, then, the verse can be understood as saying, Allah exalted the followers of Jesus until Manifestation of Muhammad. Now, this makes sense, because the folowers of Jesus were exalted for as long as they didn't deny the Messenger after Jesus.

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

Yes, I mean what he says in the Bible

Well we dont use the Bible to verify our beliefs. Not saying there is no truth to it but we have the Quran as our yardstick, so if it doesn’t contradict the Quran we take the position that it’s possible he said that. God knows best

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

If the Christians who live today, are not true followers of Jesus, why, the verse says, until Day of Resurrection?


You already said, you don't have an answer for it.

There could be only two explanation:

Either, Quran is contradicting itself, or saying a wrong thing

Or

What Quran means by "Day of Resurrection", is, Day of Manifestation of Muhammad. If you accept this as the case, then, the verse can be understood as saying, Allah exalted the followers of Jesus until Manifestation of Muhammad. Now, this makes sense, because the folowers of Jesus were exalted for as long as they didn't deny the Messenger after Jesus.

Nice try but that not how it works. Never said I don’t know, I have provided 3 options which could be possible. You can ignore that, that’s your issue.
We don’t interpret text if we don’t have certainty from the Hadith or otherwise. Unlike other beliefs we take the position of not knowing for certain.
You can accept that or not,
Cheers

 

[John D. Brey]

Why are you using the word christians ? Like I said before you are ignoring why the Tafsir is explaining and try to impose your beliefs in the text.

So again, it says followers of Jesus, there is a dispute who it is referring to. Deciples, true followers of Jesus who don’t believe in the trinity, the Muslims ourselves since we follow more the example of Jesus then Christian’s themselves

Since all we have as a record of Jesus and his sayings is in the New Testament, and since the Quran is written long after the New Testament, it seems like the New Testament record of Jesus and his sayings would be all a "follower of Jesus" would have to go on?

Point being, the verse from the Quran, in the thread-seeder, would put great emphasis on interpreting the New Testament correctly since it (the verse from the Quran) legitimized Jesus.



John

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

Since all we have as a record of Jesus and his sayings is in the New Testament, and since the Quran is written long after the New Testament, it seems like the New Testament record of Jesus and his sayings would be all a "follower of Jesus" would have to go on?

Sure and that maybe the case for you. But we have a different opinion on who Jesus was and who his followers were. Same as some Christian’s think that an others denominations aren’t the followers of Jesus.
The Quran isn’t a biography about jesus, it isn’t even a biography of prophet Mohamed. so wat god told us about Jesus is enough. He was born without a father and was send to the Jews, god raised him alive and will return before the end of days.

Point being, the verse from the Quran, in the thread-seeder, would put great emphasis on interpreting the New Testament correctly since it (the verse from the Quran) legitimized Jesus.

You may think that but that isn’t our position. We look at the Tafsir for interpretation and accept it we have more then 1 interpretation of a verse

 

[InvestigateTruth]

Nice try but that not how it works.

why not?

Never said I don’t know, I have provided 3 options which could be possible. You can ignore that, that’s your issue.

do you believe the opinions of scholars is always correct?

do you just accept what scholars explained?

We don’t interpret text if we don’t have certainty from the Hadith or otherwise. Unlike other beliefs we take the position of not knowing for certain.

that is fair.

You can accept that or not,
Cheers

Fair enough.

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

do you believe the opinions of scholars is always correct?

do you just accept what scholars explained?

If their opinions are based on evidence that is deemed credible then yes, but if not saying that the scholars are infallible , they are still humans and scholars have been corrected in the past if they made a mistake.

Hadith studies - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[1213]

Well we dont use the Bible to verify our beliefs. Not saying there is no truth to it but we have the Quran as our yardstick, so if it doesn’t contradict the Quran we take the position that it’s possible he said that. God knows best

Ok, thank you. I hope everyone who thinks Jesus is God's prophet, also reads what he said.

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

Ok, thank you. I hope everyone who thinks Jesus is God's prophet, also reads what he said.

He?

 

[1213]

He?

Yes, reads what Jesus said.

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

Yes, reads what Jesus said.

Sorry don’t understand, Jesus isn’t talking here

 

[stevecanuck]

What Quran means by "Day of Resurrection", is, Day of Manifestation of Muhammad. If you accept this as the case, then, the verse can be understood as saying, Allah exalted the followers of Jesus until Manifestation of Muhammad. Now, this makes sense, because the folowers of Jesus were exalted for as long as they didn't deny the Messenger after Jesus.

There are very many verses that define that as Judgement Day.

 

[Muffled]

Quran 3:55

"God said, "Jesus, I will cause you to die and raise you up to me, and purify you from those who denied the truth, and I will exalt your followers over those who deny you until the Resurrection Day. Then you all will return to me, and I will judge between you in matters about which you disagree."



Why did Muhammad say, Christians are exalted above those who deny Jesus until Day of Resurrection?
Consider, Christians themselves have been denying the Quran, and Muhammad, and mostly believe in Trinity. So, the Christians themselves are the new deniers, and misguided people, in Islamic belief.

I believe is some ways Muslims are Jesus deniers.

There is also a warning about denying the Qu'ran as well but Christians get forgiven a great deal and I am sure Jesus will let everyone know what is right and what isn't at His coming again.

 

[Muffled]

Hi
From what I know and read concerning this verse is that we don’t consider Christian to be the true followers of Jesus.
From my understanding is that the people who followed him and accepted his teachings which is the belief in the oneness of god and not the belief in the trinity . We considered them true follower of Jesus to be Muslims. .

I believe that falls under self confirmation bias.

 

[Muffled]

Yes, you are correct.

Then, why does allah say, Jesus followers are exalted till Day of Resurrection, if, there is no true followers of Jesus?

It would've made sense, if Allah had said, the Christians will be exalted for as long as, they will be a follower of Next Messenger, and choose Islam later, instead of saying "Until Resurrection Day".

I believe the way it works is that when people want to believe something they can interpret it in a way that confirms their belief.

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

I believe that falls under self confirmation bias.

Sure you may think that

I believe the way it works is that when people want to believe something they can interpret it in a way that confirms their belief.

The interpretation is already done by prophet Mohammed companions and the scholars.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

I believe is some ways Muslims are Jesus deniers.

There is also a warning about denying the Qu'ran as well but Christians get forgiven a great deal and I am sure Jesus will let everyone know what is right and what isn't at His coming again.

The question is, why would Muhammad who is a false prophet in your view, would speak of exaltation of Christians till Resurrection Day?
It would make more sense, that He would not have said this, considering Muhammad wanted Christians leave Christianity and join Islam instead.
Do you have a logical explanation for this?

 

[firedragon]

"God said, "Jesus, I will cause you to die and raise you up to me, and purify you from those who denied the truth, and I will exalt your followers over those who deny you until the Resurrection Day. Then you all will return to me, and I will judge between you in matters about which you disagree."

What's this translation you are using?

And, why do you call his "followers" as Christians? On what basis? And what are the connotations? Are you calling them Trinitarian Christians, Catholics who follow the doctrine of theotokos? Protestants after Martin Luther? What's your meaning behind this?

Why did Muhammad say, Christians are exalted above those who deny Jesus until Day of Resurrection?

Well, I think you believe the Qur'an was Muhammed's word not God's and that's why you said "why did Muhammad say". And the "Christian" thing would be answered after you answer the previous question.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

What's this translation you are using?

Please look it up in Islamawakened.com

And, why do you call his "followers" as Christians? On what basis? And what are the connotations? Are you calling them Trinitarian Christians, Catholics who follow the doctrine of theotokos? Protestants after Martin Luther? What's your meaning behind this?

If Christians are not followers of Jesus, then who are the followers of Jesus who, till Day of Resurrection are exalted?

Well, I think you believe the Qur'an was Muhammed's word not God's and that's why you said "why did Muhammad say"

Do you believe God has a mouth and a tongue and speaks Arabic language? Do you believe a voice came from God in Arabic?
if God does not have a mouth, then how would voice of God was heard by the Angel?

. And the "Christian" thing would be answered after you answer the previous question.

Please explain. I don't think you would have a explanation to be sincere.