Muhammad said Christians are exalted until Judgement Day, why?

[firedragon]

Please look it up in Islamawakened.com

The Ahmadiya translation?

If Christians are not followers of Jesus

You flipped it around. And didn't answer the question.

I will cut and paste my question once more. "And, why do you call his "followers" as Christians? On what basis? And what are the connotations? Are you calling them Trinitarian Christians, Catholics who follow the doctrine of theotokos? Protestants after Martin Luther? What's your meaning behind this?"

Do you believe God has a mouth and a tongue and speaks Arabic language? Do you believe a voice came from God in Arabic?
if God does not have a mouth, then how would voice of God was heard by the Angel?

Why should God have a mouth to send his word to Muhammed? Have you read the Qur'an? God is nothing like anything and nothing is like God. So if you are quoting the Qur'an, you should believe this. The Qur'an does not say it's what "Muhammed" said. It says directly that it's Allah's Kalam. You are misquoting and twisting it.

Please explain. I don't think you would have a explanation to be sincere.

Projection.

Mate. Even according the Bible, the word Christian was first discovered in Turkey after Jesus has long passed. So the disciples of Jesus were not called Christians and Jesus never called them Christians. So you have completely twisted it in all fronts.

The Qur'an does not call the disciples of Jesus as "Christians". In the Qur'an the disciples are called "Muslims". And they are quoted in the first person or Alshaksul awwal. They say "Anna Muslimeena".

 

[InvestigateTruth]

The Ahmadiya translation?

I don't know. But sounds correct. Tell me if anything wrong with the translation.

You flipped it around. And didn't answer the question.

I will cut and paste my question once more. "And, why do you call his "followers" as Christians? On what basis? And what are the connotations? Are you calling them Trinitarian Christians, Catholics who follow the doctrine of theotokos? Protestants after Martin Luther? What's your meaning behind this?"

The obvious answer is, Christians are followers of Christ. In Arab and Persian language, they are called Massihiyoon.
المسيحيون

It is like saying, Muslims are followers of Muhammad.

But to your point, I understand, Muslims believe, Christians are not true followers of Jesus, because, in the mind of Muslims, Jesus teachings are distorted or Changed from the original Revelation that Jesus had, which was called Injil.

So, now, we have a puzzle here. If Day of Resurrection is a future event, and in our time there is no true followers of Jesus, then why Allah says, followers of Jesus will be exalted till Day of Resurrection?

I would say, We need to solve this puzzle, instead of ignoring it.

Why should God have a mouth to send his word to Muhammed? Have you read the Qur'an? God is nothing like anything and nothing is like God.

Then, if God does not have a mouth to pronounce Arabic sentences and verses, how the Angel heard them from God?

So if you are quoting the Qur'an, you should believe this. The Qur'an does not say it's what "Muhammed" said. It says directly that it's Allah's Kalam. You are misquoting and twisting it.

again, here we have a puzzle. If Allah does not have a mouth to pronounce Arabic words, then how His words are written in the Quran? Did not God dictate them word to word, to the Angel?

We need to solve this puzzle, instead of scaping from it.




Also, consider, the Quran does not claim, they are words of Allah.
Just consider, it says in the Name of Allah, the most kind...

Does God says, in the Name of God?

Or it says, الحمدلله الرب العالمين
Praise be to God, the creator of the world. Does Allah say Praise be to Allah?

 

[firedragon]

The obvious answer is, Christians are followers of Christ. In Arab and Persian language, they are called Massihiyoon.

Not in the Qur'an.

I guess you don't b believe the Qur'an.

again, here we have a puzzle. If Allah does not have a mouth to pronounce Arabic words

If you actually read the Qur'an, God is "lam yakulluhoo kufuwan ahad".

 

[InvestigateTruth]

There are very many verses that define that as Judgement Day.

Day of Resurrection and Judgement Day are the same. Both mean, the next Revelation.

 

[England my lionheart]

One of the requirements of being a Muslim is that we have to accept and believe in all the prophets god has send.

Why doesn’t Islam accept Mirza Ghulam Ahmad as a prophet and how can you tell whether he is or not?

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

t is like saying, Muslims are followers of Muhammad

Not really. Muslims doesn’t mean the followers of the prophet Muhammad unlike Christian’s mean followers of Christ

So, now, we have a puzzle here. If Day of Resurrection is a future event, and in our time there is no true followers of Jesus, then why Allah says, followers of Jesus will be exalted till Day of Resurrection?

I would say, We need to solve this puzzle, instead of ignoring it.

well I already give the Islamic position on this verse provided by the Tafsir. It’s seems like you are the one ignoring it since it doesn’t fit your beliefs

Then, if God does not have a mouth to pronounce Arabic sentences and verses, how the Angel heard them from God?

Allah has his way of communication with his creation.

gain, here we have a puzzle. If Allah does not have a mouth to pronounce Arabic words, then how His words are written in the Quran? Did not God dictate them word to word, to the Angel?

Allah is nothing like us so to imagine Allah has a mouth is a flawed description of the creator of all the worlds ?
Since the Quran was revealed in Arabic and the prophet language was Arabic, so it makes sense that his companions written it in Arabic

Also, consider, the Quran does not claim, they are words of Allah.
Just consider, it says in the Name of Allah, the most kind...

Does God says, in the Name of God?

Or it says, الحمدلله الرب العالمين
Praise be to God, the creator of the world. Does Allah say Praise be to Allah?

this how the Quran was revealed. You can compare it how for example how royals speak when giving speech.

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

Why doesn’t Islam accept Mirza Ghulam Ahmad as a prophet and how can you tell whether he is or not?

The Quran is very clear that prophet Muhammad is the seal of the prophethood.

Quran 33-44
Muḥammad is not the father of any of your men,1 but is the Messenger of Allah and the seal of the prophets. And Allah has ˹perfect˺ knowledge of all things.

 

[England my lionheart]

The Quran is very clear that prophet Muhammad is the seal of the prophethood.

Quran 33-44
Muḥammad is not the father of any of your men,1 but is the Messenger of Allah and the seal of the prophets. And Allah has ˹perfect˺ knowledge of all things.

In the Quran it does but anyone could author a book confirming their prophethood,Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s followers say he is a prophet but it doesn’t mean he is,as “the mahdi “ he failed obviously but there’s still ahmadiyas who believe he is.

There is no verifiable evidence of any so called prophet or messenger,Adam Abraham Moses Jesus etc,there is zero proof of their prophethood and unless you can get a two way communication with your god to confirm their credentials the bottom dollar is they are just humans with a claim.

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

In the Quran it does but anyone could author a book confirming their prophethood,Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s followers say he is a prophet but it doesn’t mean he is,as “the mahdi “ he failed obviously but there’s still ahmadiyas who believe he is.

There is no verifiable evidence of any so called prophet or messenger,Adam Abraham Moses Jesus etc,there is zero proof of their prophethood and unless you can get a two way communication with your god to confirm their credentials the bottom dollar is they are just humans with a claim.

Sure any book could claim their prophet is the last. I have basic knowledge about ahmadyans. But from what know is that they see Mohamed as the last prophet. And their prophet to be Jesus in an other body, you can correct me if I am wrong.

Sure we don’t have evidences for that other then the words of god I’m the Quran.

 

[England my lionheart]

Sure any book could claim their prophet is the last. I have basic knowledge about ahmadyans. But from what know is that they see Mohamed as the last prophet. And their prophet to be Jesus in an other body, you can correct me if I am wrong.

Sure we don’t have evidences for that other then the words of god I’m the Quran.

The words of a god are in other books too and not just Ahbramic,there isn’t any evidence for any of them but indoctrinated faith seems to work well even today imo.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

Not really. Muslims doesn’t mean the followers of the prophet Muhammad unlike Christian’s mean followers of Christ

Looks like some Muslims think it is wrong to say, they are followers of their Messenger. But, if that was false, why then Quran says, follow the Messenger to be guided?

"Those who follow the Messenger, the unlettered prophet, whom they find written in what they have of the Torah and the Gospel, who enjoins upon them what is right and forbids them what is wrong and makes lawful for them the good things and prohibits for them the evil and relieves them of their burden and the shackles which were upon them. So they who have believed in him, honored him, supported him and followed the light which was sent down with him - it is those who will be the successful." 7:157

well I already give the Islamic position on this verse provided by the Tafsir. It’s seems like you are the one ignoring it since it doesn’t fit your beliefs

I am sorry, but Coping and pasting some tafseer is not a valid way to prove your point.
Explain and answer the question in your own words, while you support your view with verses and authentic Hadithes.

Allah has his way of communication with his creation.

Allah is nothing like us so to imagine Allah has a mouth is a flawed description of the creator of all the worlds ?
Since the Quran was revealed in Arabic and the prophet language was Arabic, so it makes sense that his companions written it in Arabic

this how the Quran was revealed. You can compare it how for example how royals speak when giving speech.

Kindly explain, how Allah revealed the Quran to the Prophet. Will you?

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

The words of a god are in other books too and not just Ahbramic,there isn’t any evidence for any of them but indoctrinated faith seems to work well even today imo

Okay thanks for sharing that, I think

 

[MayPeaceBeUpOnYou]

Looks like some Muslims think it is wrong to say, they are followers of their Messenger. But, if that was false, why then Quran says, follow the Messenger to be guided?

No I am talking about the definition of the word Muslim. You compared it with the word Christian’s which I said you can’t do that. But I get your point.

We are guided by Allah and use the prophet as our example

am sorry, but Coping and pasting some tafseer is not a valid way to prove your point.
Explain and answer the question in your own words, while you support your view with verses and authentic Hadithes.

I am figuring out what your aim is here, if you wanna depth answer about certain things then you seek contact with a scholar or walk into a mosque and ask your quistion.
What I can do for you is give our way of how we interpret our scripture.
Our position is that we don’t exactly know who Allah is referring here, we have different scenarios.

You can demand a answer but that’s not how Islam works. If we don’t know for sure then we take the position that Allah knows best.

But let me ask you something since you are demanding a answer with a explanation .
Let say for argument sake this verse is saying what you want to say it. Would you then also accept the other verses that is clear and not suit your narrative?

Kindly explain, how Allah revealed the Quran to the Prophet. Will you?

through the angel Gabriel

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Quran 3:55

"God said, "Jesus, I will cause you to die and raise you up to me, and purify you from those who denied the truth, and I will exalt your followers over those who deny you until the Resurrection Day. Then you all will return to me, and I will judge between you in matters about which you disagree."



Why did Muhammad say, Christians are exalted above those who deny Jesus until Day of Resurrection?

He didn't. In that Surah, it is very clear that Muhammed is speaking of Jesus, not Christians.

 

[stevecanuck]

Day of Resurrection and Judgement Day are the same. Both mean, the next Revelation.

Yes, they are the same. They define the day that everybody who has ever lived gets sent to either heaven or hell.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

Yes, they are the same. They define the day that everybody who has ever lived gets sent to either heaven or hell.

Yes, and, Hell and Heaven always appeared after Judgement Day, "in this world".

 

[stvdv]

Quran 3:55

"God said, "Jesus, I will cause you to die

God "killed" (caused) Jesus (to die)

and raise you up to me

God resurrected Jesus

, and purify you from those who denied the truth

And God purified Jesus from truth deniers (resurrection purifies you)

, and

I will exalt your followers over those who deny you

God will uplift followers of Jesus (Christians)
God will not uplift those who deny Jesus
(Makes sense, thinking of Jesus uplifts me)
(Nice promise/Gift of God, to help believers)

until the Resurrection Day

Until the day that they are resurrected
(God need not uplift them anymore)

. Then you all will return to me, and I will judge between you in matters about which you disagree."

Then "ALL return to God", all humans (believers + unbelievers + Atheists)
AND
"God will judge between you in matters about which you disagree"
(What a relieve, we need not judge each other; God takes care of that)
Nice, straightforward simple verse. Thanks @InvestigateTruth for sharing

 

[Elihoenai]

Quran 3:55

"God said, "Jesus, I will cause you to die and raise you up to me, and purify you from those who denied the truth, and I will exalt your followers over those who deny you until the Resurrection Day. Then you all will return to me, and I will judge between you in matters about which you disagree."



Why did Muhammad say, Christians are exalted above those who deny Jesus until Day of Resurrection?
Consider, Christians themselves have been denying the Quran, and Muhammad, and mostly believe in Trinity. So, the Christians themselves are the new deniers, and misguided people, in Islamic belief.

This verse in the Quran/Koran is Inspired. Elohim/God teaches Esoteric and Exoteric Knowledge in the Holy Books. Almost every person on the planet Cherishes Exoteric Knowledge because of Natural Inheritance. Exoteric Knowledge produces Left-Hand Path Religious Practitioners.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

No I am talking about the definition of the word Muslim. You compared it with the word Christian’s which I said you can’t do that. But I get your point.

We are guided by Allah and use the prophet as our example

I am figuring out what your aim is here, if you wanna depth answer about certain things then you seek contact with a scholar or walk into a mosque and ask your quistion.
What I can do for you is give our way of how we interpret our scripture.
Our position is that we don’t exactly know who Allah is referring here, we have different scenarios.

But When did Allah say in Quran, if you don't know, go to mosque and ask a scholar?
I mean, Jews and Christians had this same approach and were mislead by their scholars.

You can demand a answer but that’s not how Islam works. If we don’t know for sure then we take the position that Allah knows best.

Quran says, it is written in a way, it is easy to understand. So, why would God reveal a verse in Quran, that you do not know who, it is referring to?

I mean, don't you see there is something wrong here?

But let me ask you something since you are demanding a answer with a explanation .

sure...

Let say for argument sake this verse is saying what you want to say it.

what do you think what I want this verse to say?

It says what it says...

Would you then also accept the other verses that is clear and not suit your narratithrough

of course....

what verses are you thinking?

through the angel Gabriel

Did Allah speak the verses of Quran in Arabic to Gabriel? If so, how Allah did that, if He does not have a mouth and a tongue to speak Arabic?

 

[Link]

Salam

In Quran, Ibrahim (a) is called a follower of Nuh (a). To follow Isa (a), we follow Mohammad (s), not church leaders. It's simple, you follow someone who inherits the position of Isa (a), which Mohammad (s) did inherit and succeed to.

Also from another perspective, Isa (a) will have followers again when he returns, so if it's assumed it means direct following, this solves it too.