Multiculturalism vs. Cultural Appropriation - say what??

[Stevicus]

I can't help but wonder what the poster was wearing at the time they posted. Kinda hypocritical if it was jeans and a rock band T-shirt.

Tom

Exactly. Or we can see a picture of this guy wearing a Western suit and tie:

Is he guilty of cultural appropriation?

 

[Sunstone]

Cultures are beautiful, and they grow and develop best when allowed to intermingle with others.

They stagnate and die when cut off and insular.

Me, I favor a "Cultural Free Market". Let everyone pick and use the best parts of cultures that work best for them and let our cultures flourish, grow, and mix into new and exciting cultures and subcultures.

I'll continue cooking Mexican food, praying Persian prayers, watching Japanese shows and Indian movies, making Latvian artwork, reading Chinese books, dreaming French philosophy, playing American games, and listening to Mongolian music.

And those who are horrified by the idea of cultures growing in this way can feel free to watch their own traditions wither and die. Culture is a changing thing, and clinging to stasis will never work, especially in this case.

I substantially agree with you and in part because if we are all to live together on this one small planet, we will need to mingle cultures to some great extent -- perhaps even to the extent of "rationalizing" them in some sense. Unfortunately, a lot will be lost or diminished in any such a process, but the need for it might someday outweigh the disadvantages.

 

[Sanzbir]

But cultural appropriation is specifically when a dominant race or culture adopts elements from a minority race or culture

Lol, how is that a bad thing?? You're describing the mechanism by which the minority culture absorbs the majority!! It's how the Irish stayed Irish and absorbed Norse and French invaders until the invaders were simply Irish themselves.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

I mentioned this video already earlier but it's worth pointing out again because it was such a good deep dive and talked in a very healthy, balanced way about cultural appropriation.
Framing it as a neutral thing that will have different impacts depending on the circumstances (particularly when discussing colonialist expansionalism and it's effects on historical groups) surrounding the behavior. Although the video is more about why Moana was a good movie and why Pocahontas was not.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

I substantially agree with you and in part because if we are all to live together on this one small planet, we will need to mingle cultures to some great extent -- perhaps even to the extent of "rationalizing" them in some sense. Unfortunately, a lot will be lost or diminished in any such a process, but the need for it might someday outweigh the disadvantages.

But cultures have ALWAYS intermingled, crosspolinated, picked up and discarded elements when in contact with each other.

 

[YmirGF]

A beautiful young lady sports a lovely dress to wear to a milestone event in her life and that is a bad thing?

Personally speaking, when you are complaining about what someone chooses to wear to any given event is indicative that you really need to get a life.

 

[Sanzbir]

I substantially agree with you and in part because if we are all to live together on this one small planet, we will need to mingle cultures to some great extent -- perhaps even to the extent of "rationalizing" them in some sense. Unfortunately, a lot will be lost or diminished in any such a process, but the need for it might someday outweigh the disadvantages.

Culture will always be "lost" if you adopt a static view.

Even a completely insular culture will, as it grows and changes, have elements that are "lost".

If you view culture as a living, breathing thing, capable of change and innovation, "loss" will not happen in such a way. As long as "change", the inevitable process of the world, is not viewed negatively as "loss".

There are a lot of people who fear their culture may die out. And I see a lot of people in that category clinging to the old relics of their culture instead of trying to create new aspects of their culture.

 

[Sunstone]

What do you think it means?

I see it as appropriating elements of anopther culture in a demeaning or belittling fashion. I utterly reject the notion that merely borrowing elements from another culture is necessarily demeaning, belittling, or in any other way repugnant. To me, that notion is absurd in the purest sense of the word.

Last, I think the term "cultural appropriation" to be so misleading that it seems quite obvious little or no thought was put into coining it. I'm almost appalled by it.

 

[YmirGF]

I mentioned this video already earlier but it's worth pointing out again because it was such a good deep dive and talked in a very healthy, balanced way about cultural appropriation.
Framing it as a neutral thing that will have different impacts depending on the circumstances (particularly when discussing colonialist expansionalism and it's effects on historical groups) surrounding the behavior. Although the video is more about why Moana was a good movie and why Pocahontas was not.

Leaderarchy.... LOL.... Thanks for that, I almost spat coffee all over my monitor. What an incredibly stupid new word.

 

[columbus]

But cultural appropriation is specifically when a dominant race or culture adopts elements from a minority race or culture,

At one point in time Chinese people really were a persecuted minority in this country. But that hasn't been the case for a long time now.
Tom

 

[YmirGF]

I substantially agree with you and in part because if we are all to live together on this one small planet, we will need to mingle cultures to some great extent -- perhaps even to the extent of "rationalizing" them in some sense. Unfortunately, a lot will be lost or diminished in any such a process, but the need for it might someday outweigh the disadvantages.

Copying others is also seen as the highest form of flattery. It literally screams, "We really like this! You folks rock!"

 

[Sunstone]

But cultural appropriation is specifically when a dominant race or culture adopts elements from a minority race or culture...

Such may be an accepted definition or qualification of "cultural appropriation" but it is certainly not one I myself would entertain nor recommend. It reduces cultural appropriation to the absurdity of mere meaningless and juvenile power games. It's rubbish.

 

[Sunstone]

Culture will always be "lost" if you adopt a static view.

Even a completely insular culture will, as it grows and changes, have elements that are "lost".

If you view culture as a living, breathing thing, capable of change and innovation, "loss" will not happen in such a way. As long as "change", the inevitable process of the world, is not viewed negatively as "loss".

There are a lot of people who fear their culture may die out. And I see a lot of people in that category clinging to the old relics of their culture instead of trying to create new aspects of their culture.

I am more than a little aware that historically most cultures have tended to retain most or all of their key features over centuries or even millennia. with comparatively rare change up until just a few hundred years ago. The pace of change in "traditional" cultures was often glacial. We forget that nowadays when cultures might change significantly in a mere decade or two.

 

[YmirGF]

But cultural appropriation is specifically when a dominant race or culture adopts elements from a minority race or culture, so how is a minority adopting the clothing habits of a majority culture (if jeans and t-shirts can be said to have a specific or historical significance within any specific culture, that is) an instance of the same thing?

Personally, I see this kind of thinking somewhat dangerous and toxic. Where does it end? Who decides what is what? It's merely opening the door to legitimizing a grievance based victim mentality that should be avoided like the plague.

 

[Sunstone]

Personally, I see this kind of thinking somewhat dangerous and toxic. Where does it end? Who decides what is what? It's merely opening the door to legitimizing a grievance based victim mentality that should be avoided like the plague.

On what other but arbitrary grounds does one make the claim that cultural appropriation must involve such a power dynamic? Would it not be possible for a minority culture to appropriate in a belittling and demeaning fashion some aspect of a dominant culture? Again, on what but arbitrary grounds can one say that is not cultural appropriation too?

 

[Stevicus]

I mentioned this video already earlier but it's worth pointing out again because it was such a good deep dive and talked in a very healthy, balanced way about cultural appropriation.
Framing it as a neutral thing that will have different impacts depending on the circumstances (particularly when discussing colonialist expansionalism and it's effects on historical groups) surrounding the behavior. Although the video is more about why Moana was a good movie and why Pocahontas was not.

She should take a look at some of the cartoons my generation grew up with. The 90s era movies and cartoons wouldn't seem so bad by comparison.

 

[icehorse]

tacky and thoughtless at best ...

ambiguous. clarify?

 

[tempogain]

Meanwhile in China, people like it

People in China weigh in on controversy over U.S. teen’s divisive prom dress

 

[Sunstone]

But cultures have ALWAYS intermingled, crosspolinated, picked up and discarded elements when in contact with each other.

Exactly! If anything would be new, it might be the need to rationalize cultures in the future.

 

[YmirGF]

On what other but arbitrary grounds does one make the claim that cultural appropriation must involve such a power dynamic? Would it not be possible for a minority culture to appropriate in a belittling and demeaning fashion some aspect of a dominant culture? Again, on what but arbitrary grounds can one say that is not cultural appropriation too?

I'm still reeling from the word "leaderarchy" given in the video supplied by @ADigitalArtist

I'm not sure how making up inane words helps a given argument. It merely obscures things by masking a banality as something theoretically supposed to be thought provoking. I was laughing too hard to care much more about what the young lady was saying. For me, at least, it utterly destroyed her message.