Muslims ONLY: The last Prophet was not the last of MESSENGERS

[.lava]

hi i am sending this speech specially for Muslims who believe Mohammad(PBUH) was the last messenger of Allah. he was the last of Nabis (hatem'ul Enbiya) seal of Prophets but he was not the last of messengers. today there are messengers of Allah in every nation. but because of this misunderstanding Muslims deny them, insult them and even call them insane. i am not willing to discuss over this as i believe this speech is very clear and it explains the concept with verses of Qur'an. thank you for your time.



There is a confusing concept around. They say:
“Our Prophet Muhammed (PBUH) is the last prophet and the last Messenger.” But the Holy Qur’an does not say so. Allah Almighty says: “Muhammed is not the father of any men among you. He is the Messenger of Allah and the last of the prophets.” Allah does not say, “He is the last of the messengers,” but says: “The last of the prophets.”
Ignorance has descended upon people, especially the people who consider themselves as knowledgeable. They do not know the realities of the Qur’an, and they row in a boat that is tied to a pier.
If the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH) is the last Messenger, then who is the Messenger in Furkan Surah 30?

25 / AL-FURQÂN - 30: Ve kâler resûlu yâ Rabbi inne kavmît tehazû hâzel Qur’ane mehcûrâ(mehcûren).
And the Messenger said: "O my Lord! My people (tribe) deserted this Qur'an.”


Now who among these people can say: “The Messenger mentioned here is the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH)?” In the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa’s (PBUH) time, his people did not leave the Qur’ân but depended on the whole of the Qur’an. Al-i Imran Surah 119 says the sahabe came to believe in the whole of the Qur’an.

3 / AL- `IMRAN - 119: Hâ entum ulâi tuhıbbûnehum ve lâ yuhıbbûnekum ve tû’minûne bil kitâbî kullih(kullihi), ve izâ lekûkum kâlû âmennâ, ve izâ halev addû aleykumul enâmile minel gayz(gayz&#305, kul mûtû bi gayzıkum, innellâhe alîmun bizâtis sudûr(sudûri).
O you who are Amenu (who wish to reach Allah in this life)! You are such people that you love them although they do not love you, and you believe in the whole of the Book. When they meet you, they say, "We believe", but when they are alone, they bite off the very tips of their fingers at you in their rage. Say: "Perish in your rage; Allah knows well all the secrets of the heart."


Allah Almighty says in this verse that the sahabe responded to evil with goodness and says that the sahabe believed in the whole of the Book, the Qur’ân. I wonder if anyone can say that the sahabe or anyone else left the Qur’ân in the era of the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH)? If it were so, Allah Almighty would address the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa as “you.” But He says, “Messenger.” A Messenger that came hundreds of years after the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa says: “My people left the Qur’ân.” Now we ask, can anyone dare to say that this Messenger is the Prophet Muhammed (PBUH)?


We will now look at Duhan Surah 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, and 15.

44 / AD-DUKHÂN - 10:Fertekıb yevme te’tîs semâu bi duhânin mubîn(mubîninThen watch for the day that the sky will bring forth a kind of smoke (or mist) plainly visible.
44 / AD-DUKHÂN - 11: Yagşân nâs(nâse), hâzâ azâbun elîm(elîmun).
It is such a smoke that it will surrender the people. This is a Grievous Chastisement.

44 / AD-DUKHÂN - 12: Rabbenekşif annel azâbe innâ mu’minûn(mu’minûne).
They will say: ‘Our Lord, remove this torment from us for we are MUMIN."

44 / AD-DUKHÂN - 13: Ennâ lehumuz zikrâ ve kad câehum resûlun mubîn(mubînun).
They do not derive a lesson (reminder). Verily, there has come to them a Messenger evidently.

44 / AD-DUKHÂN - 14: Summe tevellev anhu ve kâlû muallemun mecnûn(mecnûnun).
Then, they turned away, and said, "He is a trained insane person."

44 / AD-DUKHÂN - 15:İnnâ kâşifûl azâbi kalîlen innekum âidûn(âidûne).We will remove the torment for some time, but you will fall into blasphemy again.

Thus, Allah Almighty shows a day in the future to the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH). One of the signs foretelling the approach of Doomsday will come into being. The event of the enveloping of skies with smoke, the Duhan event, is the period we live in. Ignorance covers the world parallel to the ignorance of these people.
The dissent is a view of the world in which more than 90% of people are out of religion. What Allah Almighty called Duhan in Duhan Surah 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, and 15 is the darkness of ignorance, a completely dark and smoky dissent. It is the same in Islam, in Christianity, in Judaism, in any way of belief in any religion. More than 90% of people in any religion have forgotten the only religion of the universe, which in Arabic is Islam, the Hanif religion in the Prophet Abraham’s (AS) era, the religion of submitting to Allah. This religion is hidayet (salvation) religion. It contains the submission of the spirit, physical body, soul and free will to Allah. It is the religion that all the messengers and prophets from the first human and first prophet Adam (AS) to the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH) experienced. At the moment, in all nations, there are Allah’s messengers, and they experience the same religion. They experience the only religion of the universe with the ones who depended on them. It is Islamic religion in its Arabic name. They experience Islamic religion, which some people cannot experience, although they think they do.

So is there anybody who can answer me among the ones who listen to me? If a Messenger says, “Oh Rabb! My people left the Qur’an.” Can this Messenger be the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH)? No one can say that the Qur’an was forgotten, left in the era of the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa. The Qur’an was experienced best in that era. The fundamental concept of the Qur’an has seven phases.

1st phase: Wishing to reach Allah.
2nd phase: Reaching the irshad post and depending on him.
3rd phase: Making the spirit reach Allah and submitting it to Allah.
4th phase: Submitting the physical body to Allah.
5th phase: Submitting the soul to Allah.
6th phase: Reaching irshad.
7th phase: Submitting the will to Allah as well.





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[.lava]

In the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa’s era, all of the sahabe experienced these seven phases, and they made four submissions come true. They submitted their spirits, physical bodies, souls and wills. They all experienced the Qur’an. None of them left the Qur’an. To leave it, one would accept it first and then give up. In the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa’s (PBUH) era, the sahabe accepted the Holy Qur’an. They experienced it, and they did not leave it. The münafıks (sowers of discord) did not accept the Kur’an, so how could they leave it?
Pay attention to our words. Wrong things are taught to you, and you try to defy the truth with what you learned. You cannot object to the Qur’an. The Qur’an breaks your lies. A messenger says: “My people forgot the Qur’an, They left the Qur’an.” Which one of you can claim that this messenger is the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH)? So you have to accept that. The Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH) is not the last messenger. In the Holy Qur’an, you cannot find any sign that He is the last messenger, but it is definite that he is the Last Prophet. Your knowledege about the concepts of messenger and prophet is against the Qur’an. The main rules of the Akait are against the Qur’an.


Now we look at the 10, 11, 12, 13, 14 and 15th verses of Duhan Surah. We already looked at Duhan 10: “Watch for the day the sky will bring forth a kind of very dense smoke,” says Allah Almighty. The time that smoke covered the sky is after the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH); it is one of the signs foretelling the approach of Doomsday. When people duhan, they expect a day when black smoke envelops the sky. Such a day already came into being. After the Iraqi occupation in Kuwait, Iraqi soldiers burned the oil wells while they were forced from Kuwait, and smoke covered the sky. But Duhan Surah 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, and 15 don’t mention such a smoke. This is a smoke of ignorance, a dissent, a dissent that enveloped the whole world. Allah Almighty says that He sent the Sharia Books. Only three of them, which are celestial, lasted to our time, the Torah, the Bible and the Qur’an. There are names in the Holy Qur’an. All the persons to whom He sent the Sharia Books are called prophet, nebi, in the Qur’an.


But the main rule of Akait is: “Nebis are not prophets. Nebis are prophets whom have not been given a Book. Nebis are prophets to whom they have not given a Book.” Is that not so? One of the main rules of Akait is this, “Nebis are prophets to whom they haven’t given a Book.” Wrong! In Al-i Imran Surah 81, Allah Almighty says:

3 / AL- `IMRAN – 81: Ve iz ehazallâhu mîsâkan nebîyyîne lemâ âteytukum min kitâbîn ve hikmetin summe câekum resûlun musaddikun limâ meakum le tu’minunne bihî ve le tensurunneh(tensurunnehu), kâle e akrertum ve ehaztum alâ zâlikum ısrî, kâlû akrarnâ, kâle feşhedû ve ene meakum mineş şâhidîn(şâhidîne).
(Remember) It was when Allah took the covenant of the prophets, saying: "Verily I give you a Book and Divine Wisdom. When a Messenger comes to you, confirming what is with you (the Books that Allah sent you), you believe in him and render him help." Allah said: "Do you agree, and take this My Covenant as binding on you?" They said: "We agree." He said: "Then bear witness, and I am with you among the witnesses."


What has Allah Almighty given to the Nebis? The Book. Allah Almighty says in the Holy Qur’an that He gave the Book to the Nebis. But Akait says: “Nebis are prophets whom were not given a Book. They are the prophets that act with the Books of Messengers.” My brothers, come to your senses. We are talking about Allah’s Qur’an, and you are teaching people a religion. The religion that you teach doesn’t teach the Holy Qur’an. If you don’t take the Holy Qur’an into consideration, what is the basis in your lectures? Will you judge the Holy Qur’an with other books? The Holy Qur’an judges you any time. You make a mistake, and you are angry with the ones who say this. You slander us. Is this not a shame? Are you not ashamed of lying? Let’s take a look at the Holy Qur’an if you are right or wrong.







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[.lava]

One of the four main principles of Akait is: “Nebis are prophets whom were not given a Book.” Is this right or wrong? You teach this in the schools of theology, and this is wrong. Al-i Imran Surah 81 explains this clearly: “Oh Nebis! We gave you a Book and wisdom,” says Allah Almighty. You violate one of the four main principles. You say: “All of the nebis are messengers.” This is true. You are right. All nebis are absolutely at the same time messengers. But then you say: “All messengers are nebis.” No, all of the messengers are not nebis. How many times did we prove this to you with many different verses? You cannot cover the sun with clay. You cannot hide the truth. You have to accept the truth. We are talking you about the Qur’an. You cannot change the Qur’an. The Qur’an will not change because you are mistaken. You will change. You have to change. You have to conform to the Qur’an’s truth. You cannot judge the Holy Qur’an. But the Qur’an judges you. So the first principle is 100% right. Really, all the nebis are at the same time messengers.


We will look at the second principle. It is the same with what we said before. You say: “Nebis are the prophets whom were not given the Book, and they arrive at a decision with the Books of Messengers.” Just the opposite, nebis are the real Prophets whom were given the Book. Some of the messengers are prophets; some of them are saints. The Qur’an tells about this truth, and you have to learn it. So two are wrong.


Let’s come to the third one. You say: “All of messengers are nebis.” Wrong, from seven different points. All of messengers are not nebis. You, who make such big mistakes! Are you still not ashamed? We have a very hard time to correct your Akait. Why are you afraid? If what you say goes against the Qur’an, you have to correct this mistake.


No one can change the Qur’an. Nobody could change even a letter for fourteen centuries. The Qur’an saves its original judgment. All the mistakes you made will absolutely be corrected in the future days. So what happened? Three of the four main principles of Akait are unsound. And you are teaching these as science. Are you not shameful? Why are you angry with us because we say just the opposite of what you say? What is the reason for your anger? Because we tell Allah’s truths? Which one of you can raise an objection against our words? We give you examples from the Qur’an. Let’s come to the end and correct the four principles of Akait first.

1. All of nebis are messengers. 100% correct.
2. We have to correct, “All of messengers are not nebis.” All messengers are not nebis. Some of the messengers are nebis. Some of them are not nebis. Namely, they are not prophets. So the second principle has to be changed to match the Qur’an. As long as you do not change it, you are responsible for wrongly teaching people the rules of the Qur’an.
3. You say: “Nebis are prophets whom were not given a Book.” Wrong. Just the opposite, nebis are the prophets whom were given a Book.
4. You say: “All messengers are nebis.” Wrong. Some of them are nebis; some of them are messengers.

So look at this carefully. How will you survive a science that has been built on mistakes? What is the meaning of your insistence, although we warned you a lot of times?
You say: “Messengers are the prophets whom were given the book.” Nebis are prophets who were given the Book. All of the messengers are not prophets.
Let’s go step by step with the 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, and 15th verses of Duhan Surah. Allah Almighty says in Duhan 10: “Oh Beloved, watch for the day the sky will bring forth a kind of very dense smoke.” You know that this is one of the signs foretelling the approach of Doomsday.

44 / AD-DUKHÂN - 11: Yagşân nâs(nâse), hâzâ azâbun elîm(elîmun).
It is such a smoke that it will surrender the people. This is a Grievous Chastisement.

Certainly you understand what I mean, a torment that will envelop everybody. Unfortunately, more than 90% of people have forgotten the only religion of the universe. Islam is not a new religion.
It’s the only religion of the universe. There has never been a different religion. It’s the Prophet Abraham’s (A.S.) religion. It is the Prophet David’s (AS) religion. It’s the Prophet Noah’s religion. It’s the Prophet Adam’s (AS) religion. It’s the Prophet Moses’ (AS) religion. It’s the Prophet Jesus’ (AS) religion, and finally it’s the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa’s (PBUH) religion. It’s the only religion of the universe that has not changed. Islam is the Arabic name; it is hanif in the Prophet Abraham’s (AS) language. There has been only one religion. There have never been two. In Şura Surah 13, Allah Almighty says:

42 / ASH – SHÛRA - 13: Şerea lekum mined dîni mâ vassâ bihî nûhan vellezî evhaynâ ileyke ve mâ vassaynâ bihî ibrâhîme ve mûsâ ve îsâ, en ekîmûd dîne ve lâ teteferrekû fîh(fîhi), kebure alel muşrikîne mâ ted’ûhum ileyh(ileyhi), Allâhu yectebî ileyhi men yeşâu ve yehdî ileyhi men yunîb(yunîbu).
Saying, “Establish religion and make no divisions in it,” He (Allah) has ordained the same religion for you as that which We ordained for Noah - that which We have revealed to you - and that which We ordained for Abraham, Moses, and Jesus. The thing (invitation to Allah and to have faith in Allah) to which you invited was hard for those MUSHRIK (those who attribute a partner to Allah). Allah chooses to Himself those whom He pleases and guides (takes) unto Himself those who turn to Him.


Here the foundation of the only shariah, reaching the spirit to Allah before death, is emphasized once more. It’s the shariah that will be experienced by only 10% of the people, which is why dissent enveloped the others. For this reason, Allah Almighty says: “A grievous torment, that will envelop all people.” These people are always more than 90% of all people. And the 12th verse:

44 / AD-DUKHÂN - 12: Rabbenekşif annel azâbe innâ mu’minûn(mu’minûne).
They will say: ‘Our Lord, remove this torment from us for we are MUMIN."

But they are not mumins. You will say: “It is enough to believe in Allah for someone to be a mumin.” Do you not? You think so. Believing in Allah is not enough for him. No one can be a mumin unless he wishes to reach Allah. For this reason, Allah Almighty says: “They will say we are mumins.” But they are not. This is just the state of the world today.








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[.lava]

The Qur’an is the only holy Book that was not changed. As it was sent 1400 years ago, all 606 pages are in the same order, in the same standards, with not even a letter changed, until today. In its design, a mumin is the one among the believers who wishes to reach Allah. It is impossible for the ones to be mumin who do not wish to reach Allah. In our other lectures you will see this, if it is true or not, with the verses of the Qur’an. Search if you wish.


We gave lectures about “being mumin.” You will see there that the Qur’an is not like you thought. You are not talking about the Qur’an. You are talking about your books, emâniyye. In the Holy Qur’an, Allah Almighty says that those who write emaniyye do not know about the Book. They do not know about the Book. They put forth the books they wrote into consideration. Those books are taught today in universities in every part of the world. We reach a conclusion: A smoke that will envelop people, namely a discord of being mumin. Seven phases of the only religion of the universe, Islam, were forgotten. These people think that they will be saved with the five principles of Islam.


People have a demand, “Remove this torment from us.” Everybody who does not wish to reach Allah is in this torment. Allah does not remove this torment unless they wish to reach Allah. They cannot be rid of blasphemy. Allah Almighty says: “Something that envelops everyone.” Namely, something that envelops a very great portion of people. Duhan Surah the 13th verse says:

44 / AD-DUKHÂN - 12: Rabbenekşif annel azâbe innâ mu’minûn(mu’minûne).
They will say: ‘Our Lord, remove this torment from us for we are MUMIN."

“They do not listen what we say. They do not wish to reach us,” says Allah Almighty. A messenger clearly came to them. We have question for you. Is there anyone among you who can claim that the messenger is the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH) when Duhan, one of the signs foretelling the approach of Doomsday came to the scene? Please answer us! Who is the messenger in Duhan Surah, the 13th verse? The prophet Muhammed Mustafa? Something that will happen fourteen centuries after Him, a messenger that existed fourteen centuries after. You can claim everything.


Here the word messenger is mentioned. The messenger here is the messenger that came to the scene at the point where duhan enveloped the whole world and people forgot Allah’s religion. None of you can claim that the messenger in Duhan Surah 13 is the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH), just like the messenger is not the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH) in Al-i Imran Surah 81. You say: “No, he is the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH).” Who is Allah speaking to in Al-i Imran Surah 81? To nebis.

3 / AL- `IMRAN – 81: Ve iz ehazallâhu mîsâkan Nebîyyîne lemâ âteytukum min kitâbin ve hikmetin summe câekum resûlun musaddikun limâ meakum le tu’minunne bihî ve le tensurunneh(tensurunnehu), kâle e akrertum ve ehaztum alâ zâlikum ısrî, kâlû akrarnâ, kâle feşhedû ve ene meakum mineş şâhidîn(şâhidîne).
(Remember) It was when Allah took the covenant of the prophets, saying: "Verily I give you a Book and Divine Wisdom. When a Messenger comes to you, confirming what is with you (the Books that Allah sent you), you believe in him and render him help." Allah said: "Do you agree, and take this My Covenant as binding on you?" They said: "We agree." He said: "Then bear witness, and I am with you among the witnesses."


Who are these nebis? The nebis from whom Allah takes the covenant. “Oh, Nebis! I gave you a Book and wisdom. A messenger will come after you. A messenger will come after you, after nebis. Do you promise to help and believe in him? Do you admit it?” The nebis say: “We admit it.” “So bear witness to each other, and I’m with you among the witnesses,” says Allah Almighty. And you say: “The messenger here is the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH).” No, he is not, because Allah Almighty says in Ahzab Surah 7:

33 / AL AHZAP - 7: Ve iz ehaznâ minen nebîyyîne mîsâkahum ve minke ve min nûhın ve ibrâhîme ve mûsâ ve îsebni meryeme ve ehaznâ minhum mîsâkan galîzâ(galîzan).
And remember We took from the prophets their covenant, as (We did) from you: from Noah, Abraham, Moses, and Jesus the son of Mary. We took from them a solemn covenant.


Can you still claim that the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH) is not among the nebis in Al-i Imran Surah 81? If he is among the nebis, look carefully at what Allah says: “He will come after you.” He is among the nebis and a messenger will come after him. Are you trying to change the rules of the Qur’an? Since when can you hide? So you have to remain silent when Al-i Imran Surah 81 and Ahzab Surah 7 come together. The Prophet Muhammed Mustafa is among the nebis in Al-i Imran Surah 81 from whom Allah took the covenant, and Allah tells about a messenger that will come after them. Is there anybody that can claim the opposite?






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[.lava]

Now we come to Duhan Surah 13. Allah Almighty mentions a messenger in the period near Doomsday. This is not the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH), but a period of time that he watches, a period of time that Allah made him see, an event that He showed him in the future. Allah Almighty shows him with his heart’s eye, and one of his messengers says to Him: “A messenger clearly came.” Have we finished? No, we come to the main point.

44 / AD-DUKHÂN - 14: Summe tevellev anhu ve kâlû muallemun mecnûn(mecnûnun).
Then, they turned away, and said, "He is a trained insane person."

You are those who broke off with him. And they said to him: “muallemun mecnûn”
Muallemun: Tutored
Mecnun: A man possessed


Remember the event on Channel 6. Four people claimed, in cooperation with one other, that someone was possessed. Moreover, they claimed that he was tutored by Satan. But although he insisted a lot, they could not dare to swear to it by placing their hands on the Qur’an. So why did not Allah Almighty make His messenger talk at that time? Because this verse of the Qur’an must come into being. And it happened. They said that he was inspired by Satan, tutored by Satan, and is possessed. Moreover, they would have put him in a madhouse if a public prosecuter on duty said, “Arrest him!” Then they did so, and then thirteen professors were contented that he is wise.
The sun cannot be covered with mud. Messengers lived in every nation and in every time, and this will continue until Doomsday. At the moment, there is not only one messenger; there are messengers living in every nation. The people around them, no matter to which religion they belong, the ones who depended on them experience this religion. They experience the only religion of the universe. They are the strong castle, which was tutored by Allah.
So we know the content now. So the nebis are prophets who were given the Book, not prophets who were not given the Book. A claim of Akait! All messengers are nebis. No. There is a lot of evidence. Allah Almighty says in Yusuf Surah 50:

12 / YÛSUF - 50: Ve kâlel meliku'tûnî bih(bihî), fe lemmâ câehur resûlu kâlerci' ilâ Rabbike fes'elhu mâ bâlun nisvetillâtî katta'ne eydiyehunn(eydiyehunne), inne rabbî bi keydihinne alîm(alîmun).
So the king said: ‘Bring him to me.’ But the Resul (Messenger) came to him, and (Joseph) said: ‘Go back to your lord, and ask him why the ladies cut their hands.’ Verily, Allah is well aware of their snare.


The 50th verse of Yusuf Surah says: “When the messenger came to him.” The Holy Qur’an calls an ordinary courier of Pharaoh, who is not even a mumin, a messenger. In Neml Surah, Belkıs wants to send a courier to Prophet Solomon (AS) and says, “I will send him a messenger.” Neither Belkıs nor the ones around her nor the messenger she will send are mumins. And if we are talking about the Prophet Solomon (AS), he is already a nebi: a messenger. Is an ordinary messenger of Belkıs that takes gifts to the Prophet Solomon (AS) a prophet of Allah Almighty? Is there anybody among you who can claim this?

In the Qur’an there are two types of messengers. The first one is the ordinary messenger who was not charged with a duty by Allah. But the Qur’an calls them messengers. You remembered. All the messengers were nebis! Do not try to find a fault. Consult your conscience. Are we telling the truth?
Those who think themselves knowledgeable! I’m talking to you. Are you not responsible to Allah? Are you not responsible because of your slander on us? We continue. So at the first phase there are ordinary couriers, the men of this or that person. They are called messengers. So are all messengers nebis?

Allah Almighty mentions jinn messengers in the Holy Qur’an. But He never mentions jinn nebis. Can you consider it likely that there is a prophet among the jinns?
Allah Almighty mentions angel messengers in the Holy Qur'an. Gabriel (AS) is an angel and a messenger. But he has never been a nebî. He is not a nebî. Is there anybody among you who can claim that Gabriel (AS) is a prophet? Or anybody among you who can claim that an angel can be in a prophet’s identity? Courier messengers, angel messengers, jinn messengers. Are these enough? No.
There is no interruption between the messengers. In Muminun Surah 44, in Bakara Surah 87, and in Hadid Surah 27 Allah Almighty says that He sent His messenger to all nations without interruption.

23 / AL-MU`MINUN - 44:Summe erselnâ rusulenâ tetrâ, kullemâ câe ummeten resûluhâ kezzebûhu fe etba'nâ ba'dahum ba'dan ve cealnâhum ehâdîs(ehâdîse), fe bu'den li kavmin lâ yu'minûn(yu'minûne).
Then, We sent our messengers in succession. Every tribe to which their messenger came rejected him. So We terminated them and made them a legend. Let the tribe which is not MUMIN (among the believers of Allah who wishes to reach Him) be away!

2 / AL-BAQARAH – 87: Ve le kad âteynâ mûsal kitâbe ve kaffeynâ min ba'dihî bir rusuli ve âteynâ îsabne meryemel beyyinâti ve eyyednâhu bi ûhil kudus(kudusi), e fe kullemâ câekum rasûlun bimâ lâ tehvâ enfusukumus tekbertum, fe ferîkan kezzebtum ve ferikan taktulûn(taktulûne).
Verily We gave Moses the Book and followed him up with a succession of messengers, and We gave Jesus the son of Mary Clear (Signs) and strengthened him with the Holy Spirit. Whenever there came to you a messenger with what (an order) your souls (ego) do not like, you were puffed up with pride? Some you called impostors, and some you slayed!

57 / AL-HADID - 27: Summe kaffeynâ alâ âsârihim bi rusulinâ ve kaffeynâ bi îsebni meryeme ve âteynâhul incîle ve cealnâ fî kulûbillezînettebeûhu ra’feten ve rahmeh(rahmeten), ve rehbâniyyetenibtedeûhâ mâ ketebnâhâ aleyhim illebtigâe rıdvânillâhi femâ reavhâ hakka riayetihâ, fe âteynellezîne âmenû minhum ecrehum, ve kesîrun minhum fâsikûn(fâsikûne).
We followed them up with (others of) Our messengers in succession. We sent after them Jesus, the son of Mary, and gave him the Gospel. And We ordained in the hearts of those who depended on (followed) him Compassion and Mercy. But the monasticism, which they invented for themselves, We did not prescribe for them; but they sought for the Good Pleasure of Allah, but that they did not obey even as they should have done. So We bestow, on those among them who were AMENU (who wish to reach Allah in this life), their (due) reward, but many of them were rebellious (fâsikûn, those who have gone out of the Way of Allah after having entered it).







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[.lava]

There were 600 years between the prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH) and the Prophet Jesus (AS), the prophet before him. The prophet Moses came 2000 years before him. For 600 years there has not been a prophet. But messengers were in succession in all nations. So there is no interruption between the messengers who are not prophets. No nation is left without a messenger. “We do not torment unless We send a messenger,” says Allah Almighty. For this reason, there must always be a messenger in all nations. Because in every period people have to go either to heaven or hell. In Zumer Surah 71 Allah Almighty says:

39 / AZ – ZUMAR – 71: Vesîkallezîne keferû ilâ cehenneme zumerâ(zumeren), hattâ izâ câuhâ futihat ebvâbuhâ, ve kâle lehum hazenetuhâ e lem ye'tikum rusulun minkum yetlûne aleykum âyâti Rabbikum ve yunzirûnekum likâe yevmikum hâzâ, kâlû belâ ve lâkin hakkat kelimetul azâbi alel kâfirîn(kâfirîne).
The QAFIRS (the blasphemous ones) will be driven to Hell in groups till, when they reach it, the gates thereof will be opened. And its keepers will say: “Did not the Messengers come to you from among yourselves, reciting (reading and explaining) to you the Verses of your Lord, and warning you of the Meeting of this Day of yours?” They will say: “Yes, they did. But the Word of torment (Decree of Chastisement) has been justified against QAFIRS (the blasphemous ones).”

Namely, did not messengers come to you? It does not matter which nation you belong to. Everyone will face this, and they will either go to heaven or hell. Here is Araf Surah 179:

7 / AL- ARÂF – 179: Ve lekad zere'nâ li cehenneme kesîren minel cinni vel insi lehum kulûbun lâ yefkahûne bihâ ve lehum a'yunun lâ yubsırûne bihâ ve lehum âzânun lâ yesmeûne bihâ, ulâike kel en'âmi bel hum edallu, ulâike humul gâfilûn(gâfilûne).
Verily many are the Jinns and men we have made (created) for Hell. They have hearts wherewith they do not understand, eyes wherewith they do not see, and ears wherewith they do not hear. They are like cattle, no more misguided. They are heedless (of warning).


Most people and jinns will absolutely go to Hell. The Keepers of Hell say to them,
“Did not messengers come to you from among yourselves and said you will enter here? Did not they rehearse to you the verses of Allah? Did not they explain to you the verses of Allah? Did not they warn you that you will come here?” They said: “Yes, but the word torment has been proved true against the infidels.”
So people will be asked this question when they come to hell. It does not matter where and when they lived, and they will answer: “Yes, he came and told us.” Because they will enter hell, they will suffer torment. Allah Almighty says: “We do not torment unless we send messengers.” Here is Isra Surah 15:

17 / AL-ISR’ – 15: Menihtedâ fe innemâ yehtedî li nefsih(nefsihî), ve men dalle fe innemâ yadıllu aleyhâ, ve lâ teziru vâziretun vizre uhrâ, ve mâ kunnâ muazzibîne hattâ neb’ase resûlâ(resûlen).
Whoever reaches hidâyet (the true guidance leading to Allah, makes his spirit reach Allah) has attained Hidayet only for the benefit of his soul (ego). And whoever is in Misguidance (goes astray), then he goes astray at his own loss. No bearer of burdens can bear another’s burden (of those who do fulfill the warnings of the Warner). And We never punish (any person, any nation) until We have sent a Messenger (to give warning).

The place to go for those who have more sins than merits, mainly meaning for the ones who do not wish to reach Allah, is hell. Certainly, there is a messenger among them wherever and whenever they lived. But there is not a nebi in every era. The Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH) was the last nebi. He is the last point of nebis, but Allah does not say that the last point of messengers has come to an end.
So why are you insisting on your mistakes, because you were taught so? Is this not the truth here? Is not the truth in the Holy Qur’an’s verses? Why do you not examine the Qur’an; you just declare the Qur’an to be false.
Is this not a big sin in the presence of Allah? As we tell the truth, are you not slandering us by denying these? Where do we invite you? We invite you to the truth of Allah, and you deny them them now.

So look at the content carefully! There is an interruption between the nebis. No nebi came to the world after the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH). And his Sharia is the last sharia, and it will not change until Doomsday. After the Qur’an, no sharia book will come. But the messengers in all nations will be in charge until the end of the world. They will live and die. But they will come in succession. Here is the 44th verse of Muminun Surah.

23 / AL-MU`MINUN - 44: Summe erselnâ rusulenâ tetrâ, kullemâ câe ummeten resûluhâ kezzebûhu fe etba'nâ ba'dahum ba'dan ve cealnâhum ehâdîs(ehâdîse), fe bu'den li kavmin lâ yu'minûn(yu'minûne).
Then, We sent our messengers in succession. Every tribe to which their messenger came rejected him. So We terminated them and made them a legend. Let the tribe which is not MUMIN (among the believers of Allah who wishes to reach Him) be away!

Bakara Surah 87 says the same thing.

2 / AL-BAQARAH – 87: Ve le kad âteynâ mûsal kitâbe ve kaffeynâ min ba'dihî bir rusuli ve âteynâ îsabne meryemel beyyinâti ve eyyednâhu bi ûhil kudus(kudusi), e fe kullemâ câekum rasûlun bimâ lâ tehvâ enfusukumus tekbertum, fe ferîkan kezzebtum ve ferikan taktulûn(taktulûne).
Verily We gave Moses the Book and followed him up with a succession of messengers, and We gave Jesus the son of Mary Clear (Signs) and strengthened him with the Holy Spirit. Whenever there came to you a messenger with what (an order) your souls (ego) do not like, you were puffed up with pride? Some you called impostors, and some you slayed!

Allah Almighty addresses the Jews: “When a messenger comes to you with what you do not like, for he said something that is diffucult for your souls, some you declared to be false and some you slay.” So messengers come in succession. They come to all nations. In all nations, in all times, messengers live. Because if those messengers did not exist, Allah would not have tormented anybody. Nobody will be out of torment. Those whose balance of sins is heavy will go to hell. According to Muminun 103:

23 / AL-MU`MINUN - 103:Ve men haffet mevâzînuhu fe ulâikellezîne hasirû enfusehum fî cehenneme hâlidûn(hâlidûne).
But those whose balance (of merits) is light will be those with their souls (ego) in frustration. They will dwell in Hell forever.

And for those whose balance of good deeds is heavy, the place they will go is heaven, according to Mu’minun Surah 102.

23 / AL-MU`MINUN – 102: Fe men sekulet mevâzînuhu fe ulâike humul muflihûn(muflihûne).
Then as for him whose scales (of good deeds) are heavy: these are they who reach salvation (enter Paradise).

Heaven and hell take all people. No one will be outside these places. So please do not use your insubstantial claims to mislead people. Mehmet Akif Ersoy says: “Take the truth from the Qur’an and talk to people with the Qur’an.” We have to correct the mistakes you learned. We have to do this even if you are angry with us.
Why are you treating us as an enemy instead of coming together in a friendly manner? We are ready if you want to discuss these things with us. We can meet wherever you want. We can be together as much as you like. We can give lectures wherever you want. We are ready to be with you.
We just want you to have good intentions. Come wherever and whenever you want to. We can give you lectures for two to three hours. You ask; we will answer. Here you are. We already told you now what we will continue to tell. Any objections? Did you start a war against the Holy Qur’an? Don’t judge the Qur’an under the light of the books written by people; the Qur’an is the basis. All of the books taught you religion must comply with the Qur’an. Mustn’t they? Any objections?



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[.lava]

What does Allah Almighty say in Nahl Surah 36?

16 / AN-NAHL - 36: Ve le kad beasnâ fî kulli ummetin resûlen eni’budûllâhe vectenibût tâgût(tâgûte), fe minhum men hedallâhu ve minhum men hakkat aleyhid dalâleh(dalâletu), fe sîrû fîl ardı fanzurû keyfe kâne âkıbetul mukezzibîn(mukezzibîne).
For We assuredly sent (appointed) amongst every People (tribe) a messenger so they become servants and avoid the Satanic Way (TAGUT, man and jinn demons). Some of them (those who depended on a messenger) attained HIDAYAT (the true guidance leading to Allah) and some of them (those who did not depend on a messenger) were inevitably (established) in DALALET (misguidance). So travel through the earth, and see what was the end of those who denied (the Truth).


“We send (create) messengers in every nation, for they reach Allah, and eschew Satan, andsave themselves from human and jinn demons. Some of them reached hidayet, and being astray became inevitable for some of them,” says Allah Almighty.
They wished to reach Allah, and they reached hidayet. They didn’t wish, and they couldn’t reach hidayet. Now we ask you. Those who wrote against us, those who don’t know us but slander us! We are talking to you. You don’t know about wishing to reach Allah. Allah Almighty says that you go astray if you don’t wish, and He says that you will go to Hell in the 7th and 8th verses of Yunus Surah:

10 / YÛNUS - 7: İnnellezîne lâ yercûne likâenâ ve radû bil hayâtid dunyâ vatme’ennû bihâ vellezîne hum an âyâtinâ gâfilûn(gâfilûne).
Verily, they do not wish to reach Us (to make their spirits reach Allah in this life). They are pleased and satisfied with the life of the present, and they are those who are unaware of Our Verses.

Allah Almighty says: “Those who do not wish to reach (while they live) are unaware of Our Verses.”
We ask you a question. Do you wish to reach Allah? If not, you are unaware of Allah’s verses. It does not matter what your title is. You are unaware of Allah’s Verses.
Here is the 8th verse of Yunus Surah:

10 / YÛNUS - 8: Ulâike me'vâhumun nâru bimâ kânû yeksibûn(yeksibûne).
Their abode is the Fire (Hell), because of the (bad degrees) they earned.

This concludes my words. We are ready to give a lecture wherever and whenever you want to. Here you are.
Gentlemen! Come to your senses. To slander does not make anyone get something. Instead of loving each other on the way to Allah, you hate us. You hate us, although you do not know us. You think that you are the owners of knowledge. No, you are not! You are the ones who are not aware of Allah’s Verses. Allah Almighty says this clearly. You do not even know about a concept in your Holy Qur’an!
This is a warning to you. You slander us, and you are responsible to Allah. Whoever wants to know about us, performs hacet prayer, and asks Allah. Do not be astonished then by what you see. He is with us. I invited you to hidayet in the Presence of Allah. And I finish here.



IMAM ISKENDER ALI MIHR




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[MuslimGirl]

Assalamu Alaykum,

I couldn't read everything, i just read the title with a quick look on the first lines which is very clear for me cause i know that this is the belief of Ahmadis and other sects .. I'm not sure that this is what you mean but anyway, the answer to this huge mistake can be said in one sentence.

Do you even know whats the difference between a Messenger and a Prophet?
A Messenger is the prophet who comes with a new message, like a new book or something but a Prophet comes to conferm the previous message without a new scripture so the last Messenger doesn't really mean the last Prophet, but by logic, the last Prophet means the last Messenger, its so clear.

Allah (SWT) said that prophet Muhammad (PBUH) is the last prophet as a way of clarification and to be sure that no one will ever come after him, its something known in Arabic grammar which is not easy for me to explain in English but its known to all Arabs who know grammar, if you are an Arab, its "Al 3am wal 5as" and "Tawkid" and "Tawdee7" and many other grammatical and language rules.
Not anyone can explain the Quran, they have to know the language and grammar to understand the verses.

OMG what did you mean by this "If the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH) is the last Messenger, then who is the Messenger in Furkan Surah 30"???!!
This verse was about prophet Muhammad (PBUH) HIMSELF!!!

And also about "We send messengers in every nation" you know whats this? They are Moses, Jesus, Noah, Abraham, ...etc and all the 12400 Messenger and prophets.

Oh My God, please read the explanation of the Quran, don't explain it by yourself, you are explanining the verses in strange ways and no ONE scholar EVER, since 1400 years ago explained or understood them by this way .. There is something called "The science of Tafsir", explaining the Quran needs specific tools, to first now when, why, where and how the verses where revealed and study and real Arabic language and grammar and many other things which is written in hundreds of books so of course i can't summarize them here

Please don't write something except when you are sure from it cause this is really very dangerous, u will misguide yourself and others with you.

May Allah (SWT) guide you and guide us all.

Assalamu alaykum wa rahmat Allah wa barakatu.

 

[.lava]

Assalamu Alaykum,

I couldn't read everything, i just read the title with a quick look on the first lines which is very clear for me cause i know that this is the belief of Ahmadis and other sects .. I'm not sure that this is what you mean but anyway, the answer to this huge mistake can be said in one sentence.

Do you even know whats the difference between a Messenger and a Prophet?
A Messenger is the prophet who comes with a new message, like a new book or something but a Prophet comes to conferm the previous message without a new scripture so the last Messenger doesn't really mean the last Prophet, but by logic, the last Prophet means the last Messenger, its so clear.

Allah (SWT) said that prophet Muhammad (PBUH) is the last prophet as a way of clarification and to be sure that no one will ever come after him, its something known in Arabic grammar which is not easy for me to explain in English but its known to all Arabs who know grammar, if you are an Arab, its "Al 3am wal 5as" and "Tawkid" and "Tawdee7" and many other grammatical and language rules.
Not anyone can explain the Quran, they have to know the language and grammar to understand the verses.

OMG what did you mean by this "If the Prophet Muhammed Mustafa (PBUH) is the last Messenger, then who is the Messenger in Furkan Surah 30"???!!
This verse was about prophet Muhammad (PBUH) HIMSELF!!!

And also about "We send messengers in every nation" you know whats this? They are Moses, Jesus, Noah, Abraham, ...etc and all the 12400 Messenger and prophets.

Oh My God, please read the explanation of the Quran, don't explain it by yourself, you are explanining the verses in strange ways and no ONE scholar EVER, since 1400 years ago explained or understood them by this way .. There is something called "The science of Tafsir", explaining the Quran needs specific tools, to first now when, why, where and how the verses where revealed and study and real Arabic language and grammar and many other things which is written in hundreds of books so of course i can't summarize them here

Please don't write something except when you are sure from it cause this is really very dangerous, u will misguide yourself and others with you.

May Allah (SWT) guide you and guide us all.

Assalamu alaykum wa rahmat Allah wa barakatu.

Wa Alaykum Salamu, MuslimGirl;

thank you for your reply. you're the only Muslim who cared enough to say something. i appreciate that.

by messenger, i mean the word 'Rasol'. are you familiar with that word?


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[yousaf]

it seems to me your an ahmadi. all prophets are nabis but not all nabis are messengers rasool , if your a rasool your also a nabi

 

[TashaN]

Brother yousaf, lava is just a Muslim, like anyone of us. No need to brand each other bro.

Muslims have already enough problems to deal with. Just focus on the topic itself instead if you have got something to say.

For me, i disagree with his theory of having more messengers for a simple fact which MuslimGirl has pointed out for him.

By the way lava, Messenger means Rasol, and i guess MuslimGirl had that in mind when she was responding to you.

 

[.lava]

Do you even know whats the difference between a Messenger and a Prophet?
A Messenger is the prophet who comes with a new message, like a new book or something but a Prophet comes to conferm the previous message without a new scripture so the last Messenger doesn't really mean the last Prophet, but by logic, the last Prophet means the last Messenger, its so clear.

Rasol means messenger. Rasolallah means messenger of Allah. Rasols are not given books. Prophets are Nebis and they were given book. i know that most of the Muslims disagree with that but Qur'an says it. please read;

3 / AL- `IMRAN– 81: Ve iz ehazallâhu mîsâkan nebîyyîne lemâ âteytukum min kitâbîn ve hikmetin summe câekum resûlun musaddikun limâ meakum le tu’minunne bihî ve le tensurunneh(tensurunnehu), kâle e akrertum ve ehaztum alâ zâlikum ısrî, kâlû akrarnâ, kâle feşhedû ve ene meakum mineş şâhidîn(şâhidîne).
(Remember) It was when Allah took the covenant of the prophets, saying: "Verily I give you a Book and Divine Wisdom. When a Messenger comes to you, confirming what is with you (the Books that Allah sent you), you believe in him and render him help." Allah said: "Do you agree, and take this My Covenant as binding on you?" They said: "We agree." He said: "Then bear witness, and I am with you among the witnesses."

this verse tells us that Allah took covenant from Prophets/Nebis and Allah gave them books. Allah tells Mohamad (PBUH) "remember" which means he was among those Prophets when covenant was taken. he also promised Allah with other Prophets that he would help the Rasol/Messenger that would come.


.

 

[.lava]

it seems to me your an ahmadi. all prophets are nabis but not all nabis are messengers rasool , if your a rasool your also a nabi

dear friend, i am not belong to sections and i am not Ahmadi. yes, all Prophets are Nabis and messengers of Allah. but Rasol does not mean Nabi. in Qur'an there is one verse where pharaoh sends Moses (PBUH) a messenger and Allah names him Rasol as well. do you know that?


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[TashaN]

Rasol means messenger. Rasolallah means messenger of Allah. Rasols are not given books. Prophets are Nebis and they were given book. i know that most of the Muslims disagree with that but Qur'an says it. please read;

3 / AL- `IMRAN– 81: Ve iz ehazallâhu mîsâkan nebîyyîne lemâ âteytukum min kitâbîn ve hikmetin summe câekum resûlun musaddikun limâ meakum le tu’minunne bihî ve le tensurunneh(tensurunnehu), kâle e akrertum ve ehaztum alâ zâlikum ısrî, kâlû akrarnâ, kâle feşhedû ve ene meakum mineş şâhidîn(şâhidîne).
(Remember) It was when Allah took the covenant of the prophets, saying: "Verily I give you a Book and Divine Wisdom. When a Messenger comes to you, confirming what is with you (the Books that Allah sent you), you believe in him and render him help." Allah said: "Do you agree, and take this My Covenant as binding on you?" They said: "We agree." He said: "Then bear witness, and I am with you among the witnesses."

this verse tells us that Allah took covenant from Prophets/Nebis and Allah gave them books. Allah tells Mohamad (PBUH) "remember" which means he was among those Prophets when covenant was taken. he also promised Allah with other Prophets that he would help the Rasol/Messenger that would come.


.

I'll explain here according to the widely accepted defenition which states that Rasol is a Nabi in the first place, but Nabi doesn't have to b Rasol. So, Every Rasol is Nabi, but not every Nabi is Rasul.

1- The verse you have quoted, you only understood it without deep understanding. If you noticed, Allah said ..


Allah took the covenant of the prophets, saying ....


He said Prophets, which means that he was talking to all of them at once, even they said "We agree". What does this is telling you?

Allah is talking to ALL the Prophets, who are according to the widely accepted defenition by Muslims, can be Messengers as well. If he said Messengers, he would exclude prophets, and like that, prophets wouldn't have to follow the messenger mentioned in this verse who is Prophet Mohammed. ALL the Prophet promised Allah that they would follow Prophet Mohammed if they met him who have been sent to ALL the worlds, unlike the other messengers.

Moses for example was a Messenger, and by default, a Prophet, and if he met Prophet Mohammed, he would have no choice but to follow him. That's what the vers says.

2- For further proof, look at the verses *in context* and continue reading without picking verses from here and there.

Same Sura "AL - Imran", verse 84.

Say (O Muhammad): We believe in Allah and that which is revealed unto us and that which was revealed unto Abraham and Ishmael and Isaac and Jacob and the tribes, and that which was vouchsafed unto Moses and Jesus and the prophets from their Lord. We make no distinction between any of them, and unto Him we have surrendered. (Quran 3:84)

So you got now who was that Messenger whom ALL Prophets have to follow?

The verse you have presented "81" states that a Messenger would come to confirm ALL the previous scriptures and verse "84" is telling you who was that Messenger who would confirm ALL the scriptures before him and confirm it, and he is Mohammed.

3- You have to edit your thread because according to the verse you have presentd, it says Messenger (without "s") and the title of the thread says Messengers. I'll highlight that in green color in the verse you showed us.

4- Now, one might ask, when did Allah spoke to ALL Prophets and took their agreements to follow the Messenger of Allah?

The following verse might give you a hint ...

[172] When thy Lord drew forth from the Children of Adam from their loins, their descendants, and made them testify concerning themselves, (saying): "Am I not your Lord (Who cherishes and sustains you)?" They said: "Yea! we do testify!" (this), lest ye should say on the Day of Judgment: "Of this we were never mindful." (Quran 7:172)

We weren't even born when we said "Yea! we do testify!" and the same with the Prophets in the verse you have quoted.

So I hope that the verse became already clear to you.

For further studies, you might refer to this helpful link and it tells the difference between Nabi and Rasol:

Prophets of Islam - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Peace and blessing,
TashaN

 

[EiNsTeiN]

Thanks for the thread lava
I haven't read the entire article to be honest, but I have read many such articles before.

I just wanna point out a quick note, cuz I dont have time for a long post:S

When Quran speaks about Bany Israel, it tells us that they killed many Nabis and ignored them...so God sent Jesus after then.
Nabis of Bany israel are considered hundreds, and for sure not all the few hundreds nabis had books or new messages to bany israel.

Thats just a quick notice

 

[.lava]

I'll explain here according to the widely accepted defenition which states that Rasol is a Nabi in the first place, but Nabi doesn't have to b Rasol. So, Every Rasol is Nabi, but not every Nabi is Rasul.

1- The verse you have quoted, you only understood it without deep understanding. If you noticed, Allah said ..


Allah took the covenant of the prophets, saying ....


He said Prophets, which means that he was talking to all of them at once, even they said "We agree". What does this is telling you?

Allah is talking to ALL the Prophets, who are according to the widely accepted defenition by Muslims, can be Messengers as well. If he said Messengers, he would exclude prophets, and like that, prophets wouldn't have to follow the messenger mentioned in this verse who is Prophet Mohammed. ALL the Prophet promised Allah that they would follow Prophet Mohammed if they met him who have been sent to ALL the worlds, unlike the other messengers.

my precious friend, TashaN, you are right, Prophets/Nabis are messengers of Allah, naturally. But Rasols are not given books of sheria. only Prophets/Nabis were given books.

3 / AL- `IMRAN – 81: Ve iz ehazallâhu mîsâkan Nebîyyîne lemâ âteytukum min kitâbin ve hikmetin summe câekum resûlun musaddikun limâ meakum le tu’minunne bihî ve le tensurunneh(tensurunnehu), kâle e akrertum ve ehaztum alâ zâlikum ısrî, kâlû akrarnâ, kâle feşhedû ve ene meakum mineş şâhidîn(şâhidîne).
(Remember) It was when Allah took the covenant of the prophets, saying: "Verily I give you a Book and Divine Wisdom. When a Messenger comes to you, confirming what is with you (the Books that Allah sent you), you believe in him and render him help." Allah said: "Do you agree, and take this My Covenant as binding on you?" They said: "We agree." He said: "Then bear witness, and I am with you among the witnesses."

this Rasol that mentioned in Al-i Imran 81 does not have a book. verse clearly says that that Rasol who would come after all Prophets would only confirm holy books given to Prophets. who are those Prophets Al-i Imran 81 talks about?...here it is;

33 / AL AHZAP - 7: Ve iz ehaznâ minen nebîyyîne mîsâkahum ve minke ve min nûhın ve ibrâhîme ve mûsâ ve îsebni meryeme ve ehaznâ minhum mîsâkan galîzâ(galîzan).
And remember We took from the prophets their covenant, as (We did) from you: from Noah, Abraham, Moses, and Jesus the son of Mary. We took from them a solemn covenant.

as you see, the covenant that Allah took from includes the last of Prophets Mohammad (PBUH) why would Allah take covenant from Mohammad (PBUH) himself? Prophets including the last Prophet/Mohammad (PBUH) promised Allah to help one Rasol who would come after them. the one as we name him Mahdi (PBUH), Mahdi of end times. but this is not my argument here.

Moses for example was a Messenger, and by default, a Prophet, and if he met Prophet Mohammed, he would have no choice but to follow him. That's what the vers says.

so true. because Prophets are sent for entire humanity, not just only for tribe. therefor in all times, there's always been just one Prophet. if there was a second Prophet at the same time (as in Moases (PBUH) and his brother), the 2nd one always helped the main one. therefor Moses (PBUH) went mountain tur alone. he was the one at that time, not his brother. only after death of Moses(PBUH) hi,s brother was the one. so there could not be two Prophets who reveales from Allah at the same time. please check this verse that tells about Rasols (Not Prophets/Nabis)

23 / AL-MU`MINUN - 44:Summe erselnâ rusulenâ tetrâ, kullemâ câe ummeten resûluhâ kezzebûhu fe etba'nâ ba'dahum ba'dan ve cealnâhum ehâdîs(ehâdîse), fe bu'den li kavmin lâ yu'minûn(yu'minûne).
Then, We sent our messengers in succession. Every tribe to which their messenger came rejected him. So We terminated them and made them a legend. Let the tribe which is not MUMIN (among the believers of Allah who wishes to reach Him) be away!

first of all, verse says 'Rusulena' which means messengers, plural. it also says that messengers were sent in successions. if it was Rasols who were given Books then there could not be hundreds of years between books. because messengers were sent in successions. a Prophet is naturally messenger of Allah but Prophet is not sent in successions and he is not sent just for one tribe.

21:107 And We have not sent you but as a mercy to the worlds. Mohammad (PBUH) was sent as a mercy to the worlds. yes, he was of course messenger of Allah but he was not sent for his tribe only. he was Prophet. but Rasols, those who's not given Sheria books are sent to their own tribes. they do not have a new book they only confirm holy books that's given to Prophets.

2- For further proof, look at the verses *in context* and continue reading without picking verses from here and there.

Same Sura "AL - Imran", verse 84.

Say (O Muhammad): We believe in Allah and that which is revealed unto us and that which was revealed unto Abraham and Ishmael and Isaac and Jacob and the tribes, and that which was vouchsafed unto Moses and Jesus and the prophets from their Lord. We make no distinction between any of them, and unto Him we have surrendered. (Quran 3:84)

So you got now who was that Messenger whom ALL Prophets have to follow?

The verse you have presented "81" states that a Messenger would come to confirm ALL the previous scriptures and verse "84" is telling you who was that Messenger who would confirm ALL the scriptures before him and confirm it, and he is Mohammed.

as i tried to explain above, Mohammad (PBUH) did not come to confirm earlier books, he was given a book.

3- You have to edit your thread because according to the verse you have presentd, it says Messenger (without "s") and the title of the thread says Messengers. I'll highlight that in green color in the verse you showed us.

4- Now, one might ask, when did Allah spoke to ALL Prophets and took their agreements to follow the Messenger of Allah?

The following verse might give you a hint ...

[172] When thy Lord drew forth from the Children of Adam from their loins, their descendants, and made them testify concerning themselves, (saying): "Am I not your Lord (Who cherishes and sustains you)?" They said: "Yea! we do testify!" (this), lest ye should say on the Day of Judgment: "Of this we were never mindful." (Quran 7:172)

We weren't even born when we said "Yea! we do testify!" and the same with the Prophets in the verse you have quoted.

So I hope that the verse became already clear to you.

Peace and blessing,
TashaN

yes, that covenant was taken before we were born. my point here this, if Allah took covenant from Prophets to help Mohammad (PBUH) then why did Mohammad (PBUH) had to promise Allah as well?


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[tariqkhwaja]

Assalamualaikum.

So we have three groups now it would seem. Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) being the last Prophet. Him being the last Messenger. Both. And neither (which is my opinion).

The simple solution to this problem from my perspective is to simply prove what I believe. That is, Prophets and Messengers are the same. I could also disprove you by showing how Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) is not the last Prophet (assuming Messenger is not equal to Prophet). Which should I try? And maybe a new thread? It is your call .lava.

 

[.lava]

Assalamualaikum.

So we have three groups now it would seem. Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) being the last Prophet. Him being the last Messenger. Both. And neither (which is my opinion).

The simple solution to this problem from my perspective is to simply prove what I believe. That is, Prophets and Messengers are the same. I could also disprove you by showing how Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) is not the last Prophet (assuming Messenger is not equal to Prophet). Which should I try? And maybe a new thread? It is your call .lava.

hi i am fine with it, please go ahead.


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[tariqkhwaja]

Fine with what? New thread? Prophet = Messenger? Prophet not over? I said its your call.

 

[.lava]

Fine with what? New thread? Prophet = Messenger? Prophet not over? I said its your call.

hmm no..Mohammad was the last Prophet but he was not the last of messengers. this is what i believe. if you like to disprove this or other opinions i believe this is the right place to do so. i'd like to hear why you believe he was not last Prophet. Qur'an very clearly says he was.

so, yes, i am fine with hearing your thoughts under this subject if it is fine with you too.


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