My first post

[Come2thelight]

@Link Why do you think Iblis doesn't believe in this? Can a human being believe this and still sin?

 

[England my lionheart]

In actuality, sometimes people don't have much of a choice. There are many MANY inequities and injustices in the economic system. People living on the street because they can't find shelter have problems .. many of them .. not to mention the random acts of violence perpetrated on them as well as on people who do not live on the street.

i get that,homelessness’s is a huge problem and which needs addressing by all countries.

 

[England my lionheart]

Let's take Hinduism for example. A religion where the practice of multiple gods is widely accepted. Yet the Bhagavad Gita (one of their most sacred texts) we can find a core monotheistic message. For example,

Chapter 7:16-25 states;

O best amongst the Bharatas, four kinds of pious people engage in my devotion—the distressed, the seekers after knowledge, the seekers of worldly possessions, and those who are situated in knowledge.

Amongst these, I consider them to be the highest, who worship me with knowledge and are steadfastly and exclusively devoted to me. I am very dear to them and they are dear to me.

Indeed, all those who are devoted to me are indeed noble. But those in knowledge, who are of a steadfast mind, whose intellect is merged in me, and who have made me alone as their supreme goal, I consider as my very self.

After many births of spiritual practice, one who is endowed with knowledge surrenders unto Me, knowing Me to be all that is. Such a great soul is indeed very rare.

Those whose knowledge has been carried away by material desires surrender to the celestial gods. Following their own nature, they worship the devatās, practicing rituals meant to propitiate these celestial personalities.

Whatever celestial form a devotee seeks to worship with faith, I steady the faith of such a devotee in that form.
Endowed with faith, the devotee worships a particular celestial god and obtains the objects of desire. But in reality, I alone arrange these benefits.

But the fruit gained by these people of little understanding is perishable. Those who worship the celestial gods go to the celestial abodes, while My devotees come to Me.

The less intelligent think that I, the Supreme Lord Shree Krishna, was formless earlier and have now assumed this personality. They do not understand the imperishable exalted nature of my personal form.

I am not manifest to everyone, being veiled by my divine Yogmaya energy. Hence, those without knowledge do not know that I am without birth and changeless.

Monotheism. Clear as day

That’s One,nice try though,no prophet and no monotheism for europe though.

 

[Link]

@Link Why do you think Iblis doesn't believe in this? Can a human being believe this and still sin?

First because hadiths say it. Second, to me, it's not rational to know God exists and defy his orders. You have to delude yourself otherwise. And for him to be sure he will go to hell and do it, doesn't make sense. Iblis is so cunning, he has tricked himself out of faith in God's signs and is every stubborn to them. To that effect, he has created a whole delusional world centered around him and his forces defeating heaven and has even disbelieved in God.

He is arrogant like Pharaoh is. Arrogance is not rational, but you have to trick yourself to stay in it, like Pharaoh did.

I don't believe a human can truly understand "Allah is filled (samad)" and do major sins. It's only doubt of it that causes people to sin. Or if they do sin, it's out ignorance of their darkness and will quickly repent. This is because you know you can't imagine God and that all things you see are from God and manifest him and are found in him in perfect unity. If you can't even look anywhere but all signs point to God and you are certain of God's existence by his sheer size and sheer greatness, then major sins become impossible or if they fall out of ignorance, they don't continue.

Of course, sins happen, when we doubt God only. It's something else, we tell ourselves we are certain of God and if we are certain.

Of course, the way to know Allah (swt) and who he is and that he is One and filled, is through his name.

This is why the Surah Ikhlaas begins like all Surahs except one, with "By the name of God...say...", meaning we know this by the name of God and the word of God brought to life. Iblis disconnecting from his name, doesn't have a connection to God anymore.

 

[Audie]

Yes I'm in search of those that display it

How do you plan to recognize it

 

[muhammad_isa]

Surah Ikhlaas, anyone who fully believes in that, to me, will be guided. It's those who doubt it or disbelieve in that, that won't make it.

It's not enough to believe. One has to have good intention, as well.

 

[Audie]

@Link disbelieving in Allah is one thing and deceiving himself to think that he is right is another thing.

Try taking off the " dis" and see where that takes you.

 

[Link]

It's not enough to believe. One has to have good intention, as well.

The belief in Allah (swt) is the intention. If you truly believe in Surah Ikhlaas, naturally, your actions will be good. If you don't, whether actions are "good" outwardly or not, they don't amount to anything.

Sins can happen, but not for a perpetual nature. One will leave sins if they believe in Surah Ikhlaas. This is God's words "whoever believes in God, he guides his heart".

 

[Come2thelight]

That’s One,nice try though,no prophet and no monotheism for europe though.

You seem to be missing the point. Why is there a monotheistic call in a so-called polytheistic religion?

 

[Come2thelight]

Try taking off the " dis" and see where that takes you.

I don't follow

 

[Audie]

I don't follow

You referred to disbelief in " allah" as
self deception.
Ever notice the opposite?

If one religion is right all the others are wrong,
and they all think they are the One.

Looks from here like a whole lot of
people engaged in self deception.

 

[muhammad_isa]

The belief in Allah (swt) is the intention.

No, it isn't. That's what many Christians say. Believe in Jesus [as G-d], and you will be saved.

Allah SWT says in the Qur'an "Those who believe and do good works"

..and our deeds are judged by their intentions. It is not enough just to believe, we need to act on our belief.

 

[Link]

No, it isn't. That's what many Christians say. Believe in Jesus [as G-d], and you will be saved.

Allah SWT says in the Qur'an "Those who believe and do good works"

..and our deeds are judged by their intentions. It is not enough just to believe, we need to act on our belief.

Faith and good deeds go hand to hand. If you sin, your faith is in danger. If you do good deeds, it increases and raises the faith.

Some verses mention (most) good deeds with faith, some verses omit it. This is because they are linked and you do good deeds to give faith life, and faith is the intention behind the good deeds. They amount to being love to God and connecting to him through his signs.

 

[icehorse]

What according to you IS a path to peace and love?

I assume it is some kind of man-made ideology.

Well from my perspective ALL religion is man-made, so there's that

But to answer your question, I think that if we REALLY lived by the golden rule, that would be an awesome start, and a huge improvement over what most religions demonstrate in practice.

 

[icehorse]

@icehorse

The majority of the time when you see the word disbeliever, this is translated from the word Kafir. Kafir is not simply a disbeliever, but rather one that knows the truth and works to suppress it.

And how would that be determined? What "truth" is the Kafir trying to suppress? Take me for example. I don't believe we were created by a supernatural being who watches over us and occasionally sends an obscure messenger or message. Would that qualify me as a "Kafir"?

 

[Redemptionsong]

Who were the authors of the four gospels? According to your own scholars, they are anonymous. How can you hold the bible to be reliable when we can't even decide who wrote it? Your scholars also agree that these authors weren't first-hand witnesses. So again, how can we trust anything that is written within these gospels?

Feel free to check the following link and see all the four books and see that their authors aren't known. This is a Christian source. If you don't want a Christian site, you can go and see it at Wikipedia.

Early Christian Writings: New Testament, Apocrypha, Gnostics, Church Fathers




Where did you get that?



No, it is through God's grace we enter paradise.

The real test of scriptural integrity lies in the words of scripture. But, as Dr Scroggie says, 'There is no reason to doubt that these Records came from the men whose names they bear, MATTHEW, the taxgatherer; MARK, the son of Mary [Acts 12:12]; LUKE, 'the beloved physician'; and JOHN, the fisherman. Concerning the authorship of the Fourth Gospel much criticism has raged, but Bishop Westcott's evidence for the Johannine authorship is unanswerable.'

John Mark is described by Papias, 120 CE, as 'the interpreter of Peter'.

So, what we have in the Gospels is the record of eyewitnesses. This probably included Mary, the mother of Jesus, and Jesus' own siblings. James, author of the epistle of James, was one such brother.

Luke, in his introduction to his Gospel says, 'Forasmuch as many have taken in hand to set forth in order a declaration of those things which are most surely believed among us,
Even as they delivered them unto us, which from the beginning were eyewitnesses, and ministers of the word;
It seemed good to me also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first, to write unto thee in order, most excellent Theophilus,
That thou mightest know the certainty of those things, wherein thou hast been instructed.'

IMO, you need go no further than the Bible itself for the evidence of its authenticity. The words speak to the seeker of truth. Sceptics will forever argue and try to destroy scripture, but God keeps his word secure. That's why Jesus was able to say, 'scripture cannot be broken', for truth is circular, and unbreakable.

This gathering of evidence from eyewitnesses must be compared to the Qur'an, which relies upon the honesty of one man (a man who questioned whether he might be possessed, following the Night of Power).

For Christians, the evidence of God's grace is the Holy Spirit. How does a Muslim know that he stands in God's grace when he rejects the Saviour who died for his sins?

 

[Redemptionsong]

Who were the authors of the four gospels? According to your own scholars, they are anonymous. How can you hold the bible to be reliable when we can't even decide who wrote it? Your scholars also agree that these authors weren't first-hand witnesses. So again, how can we trust anything that is written within these gospels?

Feel free to check the following link and see all the four books and see that their authors aren't known. This is a Christian source. If you don't want a Christian site, you can go and see it at Wikipedia.

Early Christian Writings: New Testament, Apocrypha, Gnostics, Church Fathers




Where did you get that?



No, it is through God's grace we enter paradise.

Was Muhammad a sinner?

 

[Audie]

Well from my perspective ALL religion is man-made, so there's that

But to answer your question, I think that if we REALLY lived by the golden rule, that would be an awesome start, and a huge improvement over what most religions demonstrate in practice.

Oh, now, Im sure the guys feel it would be
fine for them to go around in burkhas.

 

[Come2thelight]

And for him to be sure he will go to hell and do it, doesn't make sense

What was he getting respite from when he pleaded to Allah?

Or if they do sin, it's out ignorance of their darkness and will quickly repent.

That's the whole point bro. Adam and Iblis both sinned, but only one repented while the other remained arrogant. So much so that he deceived himself as you are saying.

 

[Come2thelight]

Was Muhammad a sinner?

No we don't believe so