My God Why have you forsaken me

[LegionOnomaMoi]

Where's your common sense?

I would ask the same. I would have though common sense would make anyone realize my comment about the underlying aramaic of "forsaken" was a joke.

 

[waitasec]

I would ask the same. I would have though common sense would make anyone realize my comment about the underlying aramaic of "forsaken" was a joke.

apparently the sarcastic meter was not fully functioning...

 

[Thief]

Having to quote myself...this thread...

Testimony is expected to be different from different viewpoints.

I don't expect the gospels to be exact copies of each other.
It is unreasonable to expect they would be.

If they were exactly the same...only one testimony would be offered.

 

[Thief]

I would ask the same. I would have though common sense would make anyone realize my comment about the underlying aramaic of "forsaken" was a joke.

Harsh joke while Someone hangs upon a cross.
Do you think the Carpenter kidding around?
Did the angels stand back and say nothing?

I suspect, they did say nothing.

Can we expect to be treated any better when our last hour arrives?

 

[waitasec]

oh brother...

 

[Daviso452]

Harsh joke while Someone hangs upon a cross.
Do you think the Carpenter kidding around?
Did the angels stand back and say nothing?

I suspect, they did say nothing.

Can we expect to be treated any better when our last hour arrives?

You say that in the present tense; are people still being crucified?

I don't doubt he believed what he said, I just don't think he was right.

No, because as far as we know, angels do not exist. I'm not saying they don't exist, just not within our current knowledge of reality. Plus, we have no reason to believe such knowledge even exists.

I suspect the same. It's hard for nothing to say something

From your beliefs, I think so. If the person had repented for all their sins. Did I use that word right?

 

[Thief]

You say that in the present tense; are people still being crucified?

I don't doubt he believed what he said, I just don't think he was right.

No, because as far as we know, angels do not exist. I'm not saying they don't exist, just not within our current knowledge of reality. Plus, we have no reason to believe such knowledge even exists.

I suspect the same. It's hard for nothing to say something

From your beliefs, I think so. If the person had repented for all their sins. Did I use that word right?

I wrote it correctly.

I do assume a spiritual life and continue in that way.
Dismissing a portion of my belief doesn't make your discussion correct.

So..as per topic...
'Why have you forsaken me?'...was spoken as the angels held their peace.

 

[Student of X]

Failure to achieve the rebirth of the one' s spirit from a dead state keeps the gift of salvation from being excercised yet while in the flesh.

I agree. But if I may submit, it seems to mean that salvation is a mystical experience. It means Jesus was a mystic.

That is a tricky thing, because mystical experiences are universal. That means practitioners of other religions, mystics, experience the same thing but call it something else. Salvation is a universal and ancient trans-personal experience that dramatically changes a person.

After a mystic undergoes a profound mystical experience of transformation, there comes a stage called the dark night of the soul. Jesus, as a human, had to undergo that stage too. All mystics do. Jesus did so on the Cross and in such a powerful way that it echoed throughout the ages, is echoing, and will echo.

Christians have to answer the echo, become mystics, and follow a path that resonates with that echo, according to their measure. In other words, pick up their Cross and experience the dark night themselves.

 

[Thief]

I agree. But if I may submit, it seems to mean that salvation is a mystical experience. It means Jesus was a mystic.

That is a tricky thing, because mystical experiences are universal. That means practitioners of other religions, mystics, experience the same thing but call it something else. Salvation is a universal and ancient trans-personal experience that dramatically changes a person.

After a mystic undergoes a profound mystical experience of transformation, there comes a stage called the dark night of the soul. Jesus, as a human, had to undergo that stage too. All mystics do. Jesus did so on the Cross and in such a powerful way that it echoed throughout the ages, is echoing, and will echo.

Christians have to answer the echo, become mystics, and follow a path that resonates with that echo, according to their measure. In other words, pick up their Cross and experience the dark night themselves.

I hope you stick around.

 

[look3467]

I agree. But if I may submit, it seems to mean that salvation is a mystical experience. It means Jesus was a mystic.

That is a tricky thing, because mystical experiences are universal. That means practitioners of other religions, mystics, experience the same thing but call it something else. Salvation is a universal and ancient trans-personal experience that dramatically changes a person.

After a mystic undergoes a profound mystical experience of transformation, there comes a stage called the dark night of the soul. Jesus, as a human, had to undergo that stage too. All mystics do. Jesus did so on the Cross and in such a powerful way that it echoed throughout the ages, is echoing, and will echo.

Christians have to answer the echo, become mystics, and follow a path that resonates with that echo, according to their measure. In other words, pick up their Cross and experience the dark night themselves.

My understanding of the rebirth experience, though a spirital action, is manifasted physically as a change in heart and attitude.

And yes, God is limited only by our own minds as to the experience we have when He comes into affecting our transformation, and what changes take place, verses the previous ways of thinking.

That is why I learned not to box God into a box of my own religious upbringing, limiting salvation to a few rather than to the whole human race.

I would like to add that darkness, meaning a lack of knowledge, will begin to disapate with the help of the Holy Spirit in dwelling, as new light begins its revelations and throught the trials and trbulations.

Blessings, AJ

 

[Thief]

My understanding of the rebirth experience, though a spirital action, is manifasted physically as a change in heart and attitude.

And yes, God is limited only by our own minds as to the experience we have when He comes into affecting our transformation, and what changes take place, verses the previous ways of thinking.

That is why I learned not to box God into a box of my own religious upbringing, limiting salvation to a few rather than to the whole human race.

I would like to add that darkness, meaning a lack of knowledge, will begin to disapate with the help of the Holy Spirit in dwelling, as new light begins its revelations and throught the trials and trbulations.

Blessings, AJ

On the flip side of that coin....
Is God trying to 'box' mankind into His way of thinking?
After all, it's His heaven.
To enter in, would it not be prudent to say as They say?
do as They do?

And how do perform as such of the mind and heart are not so trained?

 

[Student of X]

My understanding of the rebirth experience, though a spirital action, is manifasted physically as a change in heart and attitude.

Every spiritual action has an equal and opposite spiritual reaction. God can't pour light into the world without pouring darkness. He can't send his Son into the world without also sending the anti-Son. He can't send truth without also sending delusion. He can't send yin without sending yang. Everything becomes its opposite, sooner or later. Sooner or later, yang becomes so yang that it changes into yin, and vice versa. The rebirth experience becomes 'the dark night of the soul' experience which becomes a rebirth again, then dark night again, and again, and again...until the oscillations become so fast and furious that every extreme blurs into one. Everything in your life is shaken apart by the oscillations and changes or falls away. Then there is nothing but God.

 

[look3467]

On the flip side of that coin....
Is God trying to 'box' mankind into His way of thinking?
After all, it's His heaven.
To enter in, would it not be prudent to say as They say?
do as They do?

And how do perform as such of the mind and heart are not so trained?

God wanted us to be made in his image by giving us the ability to reason, weigh the circumstances, and make judgments.

God therefore has given complete freedom to do so without penalty, due to His giving of His only begotton Son as a ransom for all of our souls.

There is no box God places us in, but desires we come to Him willingly, not forced, but of our own freewill.

Therefore, we all come to Him in our own way because He touches the heart regardless of the outward vessel.

Thats the way I understand it.

Blessings, AJ

 

[look3467]

Every spiritual action has an equal and opposite spiritual reaction. God can't pour light into the world without pouring darkness. He can't send his Son into the world without also sending the anti-Son. He can't send truth without also sending delusion. He can't send yin without sending yang. Everything becomes its opposite, sooner or later. Sooner or later, yang becomes so yang that it changes into yin, and vice versa. The rebirth experience becomes 'the dark night of the soul' experience which becomes a rebirth again, then dark night again, and again, and again...until the oscillations become so fast and furious that every extreme blurs into one. Everything in your life is shaken apart by the oscillations and changes or falls away. Then there is nothing but God.

Frist of all, darkness was/is alteady here. A lack of information pertaining to who snd what God is, is darkness. The revelation of light, Godly information, dispels the darkness.

Once one comes into the light and understands it,one no longer resides in darkness.

If, by repetition you mean going back into darkness, means only that one was not able to comprehend the truth which, only keeps us trying.

Blessings, AJ

 

[Thief]

God wanted us to be made in his image by giving us the ability to reason, weigh the circumstances, and make judgments.

God therefore has given complete freedom to do so without penalty, due to His giving of His only begotton Son as a ransom for all of our souls.

There is no box God places us in, but desires we come to Him willingly, not forced, but of our own freewill.

Therefore, we all come to Him in our own way because He touches the heart regardless of the outward vessel.

Thats the way I understand it.

Blessings, AJ

The 'box' is the item you are describing while denying it is a 'box'.
A code of behavior...of any kind...is a box.

 

[Student of X]

Frist of all, darkness was/is alteady here. A lack of information pertaining to who snd what God is, is darkness. The revelation of light, Godly information, dispels the darkness.

Once one comes into the light and understands it,one no longer resides in darkness.

If, by repetition you mean going back into darkness, means only that one was not able to comprehend the truth which, only keeps us trying.

Blessings, AJ

Thanks. When I say 'dark night of the soul' I'm referring to a stage of mystical development, assuming that 'rebirth' is also a stage of mystical development equivalent to ego-death. Without death, there can't be rebirth.

Most Christians don't seem to be undergoing ego-death nowadays. But they did back in Jesus day, or so it seems.

 

[look3467]

Thanks. When I say 'dark night of the soul' I'm referring to a stage of mystical development, assuming that 'rebirth' is also a stage of mystical development equivalent to ego-death. Without death, there can't be rebirth.

Most Christians don't seem to be undergoing ego-death nowadays. But they did back in Jesus day, or so it seems.

Yes, we Are not to much different in our thoughts. "The old man must die" I believe your are referencing. I believe there are no degrees of rebirth. One is either born or not. Now, the degree of letting the old man die and raising of the new man is a work of action.
That what is referred to as working out one' s salvation.

Blessings, AJ