muhammad_isa
Veteran Member
I'm sorry .. that all seems like "Mumbo-Jumbo" to me
I'm a mathematician & logician, not a superstition..
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My God Why have you forsaken me
- Thread starter idav
- Start date
I'm sorry .. that all seems like "Mumbo-Jumbo" to me
I'm a mathematician & logician, not a superstition..
Thief
Rogue Theologian
By all others I refer to non-Christians.
Salvation by Jesus only?
And there won't be any bowing...there's no crown on His head.
(brother and fellow servant...He said so.)
And are we not digressing from the topic?
Tom Terrific
Member
Theosis is a catholic concept and catholicism isn't exactly calvinisitic or at least doesn't have to be.
I'm sorry .. that all seems like "Mumbo-Jumbo" to me
I'm a mathematician & logician, not a superstition..
It would be hard for an intellectual, I say that with respect, to see the simplicity of the plan of God.
Two Adams if you will.
The first is the creation of the flesh as a god with independent intelligence apart/separated from God. it's own entity.
Knowing that in creating mankind as a God, the consequences of it would mean separation, death of the relationship between man and God.
Thus the fall.
That was the first Adam = creation of the body flesh with a spirit.
The second Adam is a new creation made of the first Adam, as in body of flesh, but as the full head authority of the Godhead.
Col 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
The intent and purpose of the second Adam is to introduce, a new creation of what already exists that became flawed in the making, in which the spiritual end of us all, meaning death, would be reversed.
Rom 8:20 For the creature (Mankind)was made subject to vanity, (First Adam)not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same(Second Adam) in hope,
That, Rom 8:21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered (As promised)from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
That is it!!!
Everything else in between is the struggle of mankind to work it's way into God's favor via being good, by sacrifices or in anything imaginable in the minds of mankind, given the fact that for a very long time in the history of mankind knowledge of who God was was vacant.
Therefore, every conceivable method of god worship was instituted by mankind given that knowledge of the spiritual was vacant from the ears and hearts of mankind.
All that was given consideration and taken into account by the the emergence of the second Adam.
As God in the flesh, and as a second Adam type, Jesus rescinded/destroyed death and hell, so termed but really a prison, by offering Himself as the sacrificial lamp.
One for all!
Heb 2:9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
Not just a few, but for every man!
Having said all that, now it is up to you to continue on your present view, as is your God given gift, and capitalize on the greatest gift every given to mankind. Freedom!
Freedom from eternal annihilation due to our creation as gods.
See, very simple.
Blessings, AJ
Little understanding of the true nature of what you just asked.
God with an upper case G, for in Him was the full authority of God.
Lower case g, is us, no authority except to make up our own minds period.
Accused of making Himself equal with God was in the design, just as Judas the betrayer was.
All for a purpose of which many can not see, and all done for our benefit.
Blessings, AJ
Decision making is a choice, and the choice I made requires no work but rather deciding to accept God's work in Jesus as my own making me into a new creation such as was the design for all of us.
2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
Repentance simply means a turn from our former ways of looking at God and see His mercy upon us.
Blessings, AJ
muhammad_isa
Veteran Member
Yes .. there is OF COURSE a difference between the worship of God (Jehovah, Allah), and the worship of 'false gods' (idols)
It's not difficult for human-beings to conclude that there is a reason for their existence, that there MUST be a higher intelligent being/entity.
The Bible makes a lot of sense to me .. Almighty God created the universe .. He wishes us to worship Him alone.
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But then, some 'elite Roman court' decides that it's heresy to believe that Jesus is not "the son of God" etc. etc.
It doesn't make sense! .. God wanting to appear "in the flesh", and die for us and so on .. it would also be very confusing .. who should you worship, Jesus or God? :no:
Absolutely! The worship of God is in spirit only, while worship of "gods" are man made, fleshly, tangible and dead as a stone.
They don't see, hear or answer.
Now, there is also self worship meaning me, I want, I desire for that is all vanity.
That is a God given ability to choose as gods.
That's right because all of us have the initial spirit of life given to Adam which not only gave us existence but also gave us a conscience.
Nobody has revealed to you that way save the spirit of God!
Because mankind has the ability to choose, anything goes.
To get a handle on God's plan of creation one must first understand who we are.
We are made after the image of God, meaning as like gods.
Recall reading in Genesis the following verse after supposedly Adam and Eve had eaten of the tree of knowledge of good and evil: Gen 3:22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:
The story of the eating of the fruit of the tree, in my view is just a simple way of explaining in child like terms why there was the fall of man.
In truth, Adam became a living soul, as like God but with a fleshly body and subjected to a world of vanity for testing.
Had God not withheld the tree of life from Adam and Eve, there would be no trial, no experience of making choices.
Thus the tree of life is also a story line to explain that one day it would be given to us as our hope of salvation.
Hence, in Jesus, a type of Adam because of the flesh and with the spirit of God rather than that of Adam, lived a perfect life untouchable by the temptations of the vanity of this world.
Only God can save us, for we are the created and not the creator.
Hope you can see it.
Blessings, AJ
waitasec
Veteran Member
i was responding to:
wasn't he being accused for proclaiming to be god?
what was the false accusation?
and the 1st letter of my username is w, so?
but was the accusation false, which was my original question...
we can recognize the benefits a bee brings to our existence, even smaller, a quark, if god cannot be recognized on the same level well then who's to say what the purpose is?
Originally Posted by waitasec
wasn't he being accused for proclaiming to be god?
Proclaiming to be God, no. But accused of it, Yes!
You do know the design where Jesus was to be rejected?
Psa 118:22 The stone which the builders refused is become the head stone of the corner.
Mat 21:42 Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?
Mar 8:31 And he began to teach them, that the Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders, and of the chief priests, and scribes, and be killed, and after three days rise again.
On what grounds could they be justified in killing Jesus? Blasphemy?
Blessings, AJ
waitasec
Veteran Member
you didn't answer the question though....was it a false accusation?
according to mans rule yes and one wonders why god would be subjected to mans rule
you didn't answer the question though....was it a false accusation? No!
for he was God in human form but for God's purpose, Yes! he had to be falsely accused as that is what needed to be in order for Jesus to go to the cross.
according to mans rule yes and one wonders why god would be subjected to mans rule.
Jesus was not only totally submissive to the Father but to mankind's rule as well.
Here's a verse to munch on: Deu 28:13 And the LORD shall make thee the head, and not the tail; and thou shalt be above only, and thou shalt not be beneath; if that thou hearken unto the commandments of the LORD thy God, which I command thee this day, to observe and to do them:
If Jesus was the head/above why would the headship be offered to Him rather than being the tail?
Jesus came in as the tail/under the rule of man and at His resurrection elevated above as the head of all creation.
Not being able to see that is not having enough understandings of God's works.
blessings, AJ
for he was God in human form but for God's purpose, Yes! he had to be falsely accused as that is what needed to be in order for Jesus to go to the cross.
according to mans rule yes and one wonders why god would be subjected to mans rule.
Jesus was not only totally submissive to the Father but to mankind's rule as well.
Here's a verse to munch on: Deu 28:13 And the LORD shall make thee the head, and not the tail; and thou shalt be above only, and thou shalt not be beneath; if that thou hearken unto the commandments of the LORD thy God, which I command thee this day, to observe and to do them:
If Jesus was the head/above why would the headship be offered to Him rather than being the tail?
Jesus came in as the tail/under the rule of man and at His resurrection elevated above as the head of all creation.
Not being able to see that is not having enough understandings of God's works.
blessings, AJ
Thief
Rogue Theologian
As you were asking of me..... allow me to respond.
The other participants are posting for the sake of salvation rants.
The accusation was ....'king of the Jews'....
The note was posted upon the cross.
It was indeed a false accusation.
During His ministry He resisted any discussion that He would be king.
What His followers desired of Him was the rise of the Jewish nation over all others.....to set in place a kingdom upon this earth.
What the pharisees desired was His silence....which He did not give.
Rome didn't care of religious prophecy...the coming Messiah.
Rome was concerned of insurrection.
When the notice was posted, the pharisees objected.
If Rome would kill anyone who is ...'king of the Jews'....
then the prophecy the Jews desired would never be fulfilled.
Pilate responded....'I have wrote what I have wrote.'
waitasec
Veteran Member
your irritation of differing opinions is noted
matthew 27:11 would contradict this
Meanwhile Jesus stood before the governor, and the governor asked him, "Are you the king of the Jews?" "Yes, it is as you say," Jesus replied.
apparently in light of matthew he desired it too
since the jesus movement was converting jews to a cult it's understandable why the pharisees were put in a bad light.
i find that to be a detail that is over looked when approaching this new cult from hindsight
since the jesus movement was converting jews to a cult it's understandable why the pharisees were put in a bad light.
ok...
Thief
Rogue Theologian
So are you still asking of the accusation was false?
waitasec
Veteran Member
Thief
Rogue Theologian
It was false.
He never wanted a crown on His head.
He was not ...'king of the Jews'...as posted on His cross.
waitasec
Veteran Member
Thief
Rogue Theologian
Your copy must read completely different than mine.
'...I say unto you, before Abraham I was...'
Appears unrelated to this immediate digression...or this topic.