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My personal encounter with Jesus

ArtieE

Well-Known Member
"Attorney: Woman thought God told her to kill sons"
" Laney believed that God had told her the world was going to end and "she had to get her house in order," which included killing her children."
http://edition.cnn.com/2004/LAW/03/29/children.slain/index.html


"Thug shouted ‘God told me to do it’ as he plunged scissors into Asian stranger’s neck ‘in revenge for ISIS beheadings’
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...eck-revenge-ISIS-beheadings-WON-T-jailed.html

"Mom: God Told Me To Kill My Baby"
"I
n the days before the baby's death, Tabitha told investigators, Jennifer and Christopher were "completely normal and doting parents" to their only child.

But something happened at 2 a.m. Tuesday:Awake in the deepest of night, Jennifer and Christopher began a conversation about faith and how she believed God spoke to her."
http://articles.sun-sentinel.com/2001-08-17/news/0108170166_1_baby-s-death-baby-s-father-documents

Please take it seriously if people start talking about hearing God speak to them.

 

BenTheBeliever

Active Member
"Attorney: Woman thought God told her to kill sons"
" Laney believed that God had told her the world was going to end and "she had to get her house in order," which included killing her children."
http://edition.cnn.com/2004/LAW/03/29/children.slain/index.html


"Thug shouted ‘God told me to do it’ as he plunged scissors into Asian stranger’s neck ‘in revenge for ISIS beheadings’
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...eck-revenge-ISIS-beheadings-WON-T-jailed.html

"Mom: God Told Me To Kill My Baby"
"I
n the days before the baby's death, Tabitha told investigators, Jennifer and Christopher were "completely normal and doting parents" to their only child.

But something happened at 2 a.m. Tuesday:Awake in the deepest of night, Jennifer and Christopher began a conversation about faith and how she believed God spoke to her."
http://articles.sun-sentinel.com/2001-08-17/news/0108170166_1_baby-s-death-baby-s-father-documents

Please take it seriously if people start talking about hearing God speak to them.

There is a difference between God speaking to a person through the holy spirit and mental illness.
 

ArtieE

Well-Known Member
There is a difference between God speaking to a person through the holy spirit and mental illness.
General advice: If people start talking about hearing God speaking to them take the appropriate action and get them help or their next victim could be you.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
Here is some additional information.

"Selective brain damage modulates human spirituality"
http://phys.org/news/2010-02-brain-modulates-human-spirituality.html


"Case Report
Isolated Hyperreligiosity in a Patient with Temporal Lobe Epilepsy"

"Hyperreligiosity may be an ictal, an interictal, or a postictal phenomenology. Ictal religiosity is a type of ecstatic seizure, such as feelings of joy or pleasure. Different examples of ictal religious experiences include intense emotions of God’s presence, hallucinations of God’s voice"

"In a study of 234 patients [5], 1.3 percent had ictal religious experiences, usually associated with right temporal lobe origin. Experiences included a sense of presence of God and auditory or visual hallucinations of God"

"In summary, hyperreligiosity is a known epileptic manifestation that may be an ictal, interictal, or postictal phenomenon, requiring appropriate diagnosis and treatment to prevent further neurologic injury."
http://www.hindawi.com/journals/crinm/2015/235856/

This is not a comment on the validity of religious experiences just read the articles and decide for yourselves what to do if you come across somebody who shows these symptoms.

I go by my and every other person's experience with struggling with Epilepsy, their similiar religious experie ces any other person without Epilepsy, and knowledge that EEGs do not pick up religious experiences. This is also a study not factual knowledge of people like myself (unless I am a needle in a hay stack in relation to the study).

The study and posal connects epilepsy with religious experiences. These below are facts confirmed by doctors,
patients experiences, any medical reference "and" study associating seizudes with neurological disorders and some wih psychological disorders.

1. Epilepsy is a collection of multple seizures individuals have. If a person has only one seizure from the temporal lobe, it is not Epilepsy. The study should say "seizures" as it says maybe related (not Is) to religious experience.

2. There are two temporal lobes. Respectively, some have the same symptoms some different. Religious experiences are studied to come from the right temporal lobe. It is also "said" that RTL seizures (not Epilepsy) causes NDE. This too is a study....

3. The Fact is that to be a seizure (not Epilepsy), it has to be a irregularity in the neuron patterns in the brain. Symptoms can range from

a. Psychological: depression, crying, anxiety, and flush feeling, hollucination

b. Physical: motor convulsions (contractions in the limbs/seizures), altered awareness, unconsciousness, staring spells, shaking, pins and needles, contortions in the jaw, screaming, smelling odors not there, tasting something weird.

The patient is observed in the EMU (Epilepsy Monitoring Unit) to confirm these collections if these symptoms are seizures (not Epilepsy) and where they come from.

Q: If it is not a seizure, it cannot be Epilepsy. In your interpretation of your study, does it say religious experiences are symptoms of seizures or Epilepsy.

If seizures, the assumption is understandable. If Epilepsy, it is technicay incorrect. A collection of seizures (Epilepsy) can no more cause religious experience than one seizure (not Epilepsy).

4. To be diagnosed with Epilepsy ( I will focus on one seizure), these symptoms need to be present ruling out psychosis and other mental illnesses involving ones physical health. MS which patients some have seizures but it is not considered Epilepsy. (Q: Would they/MS patients have religious experiences according to youe interpretation of the study?

5. Religious experiences are not (and not related to) hullucinations (Hll). I have had Hll. Any psychiatrist will tell you that Hll alters ones consciousness to see things that are not there: this Medically seen by symptoms Not religious experiences (never seen that in their DSM book)

If I saw god, this is not a religious experience because religious experiences people are aware of who or what they see, Hll are not. Religious know the difference between spiritual and material experience, Hll may mix the two, religious usually have an already written interpretation and story and history about their religion before taking it up, Hll are independent of religious experiences as defined today. People have had hll within multiple medical disorders (not just Epilepsy) for years on end.

The religious arent having psychosis and hll. The DSM does not quote any psychological nor clinical related psychological symtoms lile Hll wih seizures (not Epilepsy).

6. Epilepsy is has to be diagnosed by a correlation between EEG results (sometimes results arent there), CATs, and MRI and EMU visits. Seizure symptomz seen in any of these methods does not show religious experiences.

How can you see that in any test? Hence why its a study. It cant be a fact. The holy spirit in me was not a fact but an assumption that my shaking is like the shaking of the apostles and believers during the pentacost.

We need to understand the nature of seizures but they are continuing to find new facts about it. All of these facts are not just studies. For example years ago they made studies heartb surgery is possible probably based on the workings of the heart and healing abilities. Now they know it is a fzct it is true. Its not a study.

I have TLB seizures and I never had a religious experience until 20 or so years later as an adult. Symptoms of seizures do not linger twenty years and still be considered one seizure. If there are no symptoms (religious experience not included) it is not a seizure hence not Epilepsy.

Now I have religjous experience. If it were seizures, Id have it long time ago. Since its not caused by seizures but by physiological and pychological experiences that brings one at peace and onenes, it is not from Epilepsy.

Hopyfully this goes through. You need to go beyond studies and support your argument with testimony and factz.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
That and @ArtieE show where in the DSM and medical books (not studies) that the symptoms of Epilepsy are religious experiences.

Coming from the religious end. Support the neurological (since seizures are neurological) symptoms and presence in an EEG, MRI, or CAT that would suggest religious experience and specifically god (which RE is not just about god). Support where christians today have psychological illness (which as Specific symptoms) or neurological illness (specific symptoms) NOT related to religion.

If religious experiences are symptoms and they do not have seizures, they shouldnt have RE symptom. Since they do and there is no (unless you can show me facts) psychollogical and neurological SPECIFIC symptoms that suggess illness, those studis only be studies.

In other words, if RE are symptoms of seizures (not Epilepy), they would be aparrent as a medical concern (like unconscioussness), they would hinder everyday function, it would cause gradual damsge to the brain. No religious I know mistake their RE with symptoms of something medical. Even Omish will say "yes this is a seizure but we choose to let god heal the patient."

Okay. I need to get ready for some errans.
 
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BenTheBeliever

Active Member
Read post number 21 again. Yes, obviously I am the one who needs help and not those people in post 21 who hear God speaking to them and hurt and murder others. :)
You don't get it! you are insulting us who do believe in God when you say if we hear God we need help.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
Hearing god is not neurological. Its not picked up on an EEG, MRI, nor CAT. Its not a physical symptom that impairs the body or challenges the mind. It has nothing to do with seizures; hence, Epilepsy.

Here are facts about epilepsy and causes:http://www.epilepsy.com
 

Aiviu

Active Member
"Attorney: Woman thought God told her to kill sons"
" Laney believed that God had told her the world was going to end and "she had to get her house in order," which included killing her children."
http://edition.cnn.com/2004/LAW/03/29/children.slain/index.html


"Thug shouted ‘God told me to do it’ as he plunged scissors into Asian stranger’s neck ‘in revenge for ISIS beheadings’
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...eck-revenge-ISIS-beheadings-WON-T-jailed.html

"Mom: God Told Me To Kill My Baby"
"I
n the days before the baby's death, Tabitha told investigators, Jennifer and Christopher were "completely normal and doting parents" to their only child.

But something happened at 2 a.m. Tuesday:Awake in the deepest of night, Jennifer and Christopher began a conversation about faith and how she believed God spoke to her."
http://articles.sun-sentinel.com/2001-08-17/news/0108170166_1_baby-s-death-baby-s-father-documents

Please take it seriously if people start talking about hearing God speak to them.

You know that a positive inspiriation is far from a superstitional behaviour? What you've posted is merely an excuse for some of them who acted towards selfish desires to be free or to be with God. As if that what hinders them are the others but not the self.

Its basic knowledge to know that God gives and God takes. If one is fulfilled with Gods presence doesn't mean he/she must remove others persons life. Gods will in us creates love and acts in good. The ego has to be removed. Its a misunderstanding that to end the self prison of life can be done by the self when he take a life which stands in their way.
 

ArtieE

Well-Known Member
You don't get it! you are insulting us who do believe in God when you say if we hear God we need help.
Say you come in contact with somebody who say they hear God talking to them but don't elaborate and you do nothing and offer no help but say "good for you". Say later you hear that they have hurt or killed somebody because they think God told them to. You could have prevented that. How would you live with yourself?
 

BenTheBeliever

Active Member
Say you come in contact with somebody who say they hear God talking to them but don't elaborate and you do nothing and offer no help but say "good for you". Say later you hear that they have hurt or killed somebody because they think God told them to. You could have prevented that. How would you live with yourself?
I am not going to judge some as crazy cause they hear from God. As a born again I hear good speaking to me though the holy spirit and his word. Any believer will tell you the same thing. Just cause you chose not to believe does not mean all believers on Christ are crazy.
 

ArtieE

Well-Known Member
I am not going to judge some as crazy cause they hear from God.
You don't judge them as crazy. You take them to people who are qualified to determine whether they are or can be a danger to themselves or others. If you don't you are partially responsible for every atrocity they might commit in the future.

Don't think I didn't notice that you avoided commenting on my post directly or even answer my question. Answer post 32!
 
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BenTheBeliever

Active Member
You don't judge them as crazy. You take them to people who are qualified to determine whether they are or can be a danger to themselves or others. If you don't you are partially responsible for every atrocity they might commit in the future.


I think we are going to have to agree to disagree here. You seem to ignore the fact that every believe in Christ hears the holy spirit talking to them. so in your logic I must be crazy for believing in God. There is no point in even debating people like yourself.
 

ArtieE

Well-Known Member
I think we are going to have to agree to disagree here. You seem to ignore the fact that every believe in Christ hears the holy spirit talking to them.
Please write down exactly what "the holy spirit" says and post it here. I have never heard it speak so it would be very interesting to know exactly what it is saying. Is it speaking to you in English and to others in their native languages?
 

BenTheBeliever

Active Member
Please write down exactly what "the holy spirit" says and post it here. I have never heard it speak so it would be very interesting to know exactly what it is saying. Is it speaking to you in English and to others in their native languages?


The Holy Spirit sounds like our own voice. It's like our own inner voice guiding us. You know it's the holy spirit when you feel it speaking to your heart about subjects or issues you normally don't think or talk about. I know for me if I am really up set with people for example I will feel it telling me I need to forgive and I need to love thy enemies. The holy spirit walks with every believer in their daily life. He is your partner in your journey
 

Demonslayer

Well-Known Member
So because people have health issues you can't be happy for them? Life is not always meant to be perfect. Stuff happens. Life happens

I can't be happy for someone if they have undiagnosed mental illness, no.

Being spiritual, religious, etc., is one thing. Most of my friends identify as Catholic or Christian, and many of my family members...particularly my mother...are very devout. They are happy in their faith and more power to them, my feelings about it aside.

That's an entirely different situation than those who report hearing voices, having literal visions...some people claim stories like they flew off into some world where Jesus was talking to them, etc. These things are signs...very sorry to insult anyone...of mental illness. So it's not that I'm making fun of these people that are suicidal, depressed, bi-polar, etc. On the contrary, I believe they deserve proper attention and not lip service. It's that I think it's medically irresponsible for their friends and family to say "oh that's nice that you talked to God last night" when something very serious is likely wrong.

Because if the "voice" today says :"thou shalt help the old lady across the street" who's to say tomorrow the voice won't say "jump off that bridge" or "drown your children?" And don't laugh, this kind of thing happens all the time.
 

Koldo

Outstanding Member
The Holy Spirit sounds like our own voice. It's like our own inner voice guiding us. You know it's the holy spirit when you feel it speaking to your heart about subjects or issues you normally don't think or talk about. I know for me if I am really up set with people for example I will feel it telling me I need to forgive and I need to love thy enemies. The holy spirit walks with every believer in their daily life. He is your partner in your journey

That's a thing called 'conscience'.
 

ArtieE

Well-Known Member
The Holy Spirit sounds like our own voice. It's like our own inner voice guiding us.
That is because it is your "inner voice", your own conscience and subconscious, guiding you.
You know it's the holy spirit when you feel it speaking to your heart about subjects or issues you normally don't think or talk about.
Those subjects and issues are still in your subconscious mind and appear in your conscious mind whenever appropriate.
I know for me if I am really up set with people for example I will feel it telling me I need to forgive and I need to love thy enemies.
Works the same way with me. It's just my subconscious and conscience reminding me of the appropriate behavior for continued survival and well being for a social organism living in a community.
 
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