My question to Dem Voters: do you like banking and financial élites?

[Altfish]

It's not.
Ok...you can mention the elections...but there are already countless threads about that.
I would like this particular topic to be addressed.

Surprise, surprise ... financial institution calls for looser regulations. Remind me, last time the regulations were relaxed, we got sub-prime mortgages and the 2008 crash.

So let's do it all again.

 

[Estro Felino]

Surprise, surprise ... financial institution calls for looser regulations. Remind me, last time the regulations were relaxed, we got sub-prime mortgages and the 2008 crash.

So let's do it all again.

Evidently they think that greed is ok.
It's not that monstrous self-destructive, vicious circle we wicked socialists talk about.

 

[Estro Felino]

Talks about the central bank are often above my pay grade, however... Milei opposes Argentina having a central bank and I think this would turn into a massive problem. Given Milei's proposal to use USD as the standard currency, it would turn Argentina into a country with an economy that can be completely screwed by the USA...

He doesn't make any sense.
A Argentinian Central Bank is bad, very bad...but the US Central Bank that prints dollars is ok.


But...then...I see that we are talking about him...well...
ok.

 

[Samael_Khan]

I don't really see that any major political party or faction is really for socialism in any significant way. Although they're not exactly laissez-faire anarcho-capitalists either. Most factions appear to support a mixed economy, with varying degrees of public and private ownership. They also seem to differ on tax rates and to what degree government regulation is useful or warranted in the private sector.

They both ostensibly want to regulate the private sector and even people's private lives, yet in different areas, depending on their cultural beliefs and moral values. They're never really that consistent with their own stated principles, instead choosing to live within a morass of different shades of gray and expecting everyone to recognize those various shades.

Agreed. But what I find strange on this thread is that it is being implied that Republicans are a better party to choose for socialists. Neither party is socialist, as America is pretty right leaning in general politically, but it makes no sense for a socialist to choose Republicand over Democrats.

 

[Estro Felino]

Agreed. But what I find strange on this thread is that it is being implied that Republicans are a better party to choose for socialists. Neither party is socialist, as America is pretty right leaning in general politically, but it makes no sense for a socialist to choose Republicand over Democrats.

The Republican Party has ben taken over by the MAGA movement.
That also include external supporters like many many people who left the Democratic Party and supported Trump.

One question (and this time I need you to answer).

The Italian Communist Party leader Rizzo was asked: if you had to choose between Trump and Harris, whom would you choose?
He replied: Trump. No doubt.

Communist Party leader.

 

[Revoltingest]

Talks about the central bank are often above my pay grade, however... Milei opposes Argentina having a central bank and I think this would turn into a massive problem. Given Milei's proposal to use USD as the standard currency, it would turn Argentina into a country with an economy that can be completely screwed by the USA...

Replacing Argentina's central bank with USA's central bank.
This might signal something other than having a problem
with central banks.

 

[Samael_Khan]

The Republican Party has ben taken over by the MAGA movement.
That also include external supporters like many many people who left the Democratic Party and supported Trump.

One question (and this time I need you to answer).

The Italian Communist Party leader Rizzo was asked: if you had to choose between Trump and Harris, whom would you choose?
He replied: Trump. No doubt.

Communist Party leader.

MAGA supports Trump so they are against socialism. So it makes no sense why a socialist would support them...

Unless..

You are Rizzo, a communist who admires the Soviet Union and North Korea, has supported Venezeuela and Syria despite their human rights abuses. So it makes sense that he would support Trump, because he is authoritarian, a nationalist and doesn't care about human rights abuses. I mean if you want to associate socialism with someone like that then go ahead.

 

[Stevicus]

Agreed. But what I find strange on this thread is that it is being implied that Republicans are a better party to choose for socialists. Neither party is socialist, as America is pretty right leaning in general politically, but it makes no sense for a socialist to choose Republicand over Democrats.

I suppose one might argue that "worse is better," in a manner of speaking. Perhaps Trump's brand of capitalism will turn out to be so odious that it will turn the public off capitalism for good.

 

[Estro Felino]

MAGA supports Trump so they are against socialism. So it makes no sense why a socialist would support them...

The MAGA movement is very diverse.

You are Rizzo,

You mean...like in Grease?

a communist who admires the Soviet Union and North Korea, has supported Venezeuela and Syria despite their human rights abuses. So it makes sense that he would support Trump, because he is authoritarian, a nationalist and doesn't care about human rights abuses. I mean if you want to associate socialism with someone like that then go ahead.

It's a matter of perspectives.
I don't side with dictatorships. I love democracies.
Venezuela is another story... they just want to be free from the banking dictatorship of the IFM.

 

[Samael_Khan]

The MAGA movement is very diverse.

You mean...like in Grease?

It's a matter of perspectives.
I don't side with dictatorships. I love democracies.
Venezuela is another story... they just want to be free from the banking dictatorship of the IFM.

I have never heard of or seen MAGA members who love socialism. What socialist policies does MAGA even care about? And also note what socialist policies they are against.

Grease

Well Rizzo loves dictatorships it seems. And is dictatorship even a socialism trait? I know it is a state capitalist trait, like with Societ Russia which disguised itself as socialism. In that country, the state was comparible to the banking elites.

Why are you against banking elites specifically? Are you against corporate elites too and politician elites? Because in my mind it is people with too much power and want to live in relative feudal states that are the problem. In my country, the wealth is still owned by majority the former oppressive class and even though we are branded "the rainbow nation" our economy, government and society still favour and are bought off by the elites of old.

 

[Samael_Khan]

I suppose one might argue that "worse is better," in a manner of speaking. Perhaps Trump's brand of capitalism will turn out to be so odious that it will turn the public off capitalism for good.

This makes sense. What has been shown in the past few years is that extremes breed opposite extremes. That is why politics gets more and more polarising. Extreme capitalism might cause an economic revolution. Already the extremes are showing the true intentions of the tribes because they become more and more blatant in their agendas as time moves on.

 

[Estro Felino]

I have never heard of or seen MAGA members who love socialism. What socialist policies does MAGA even care about? And also note what socialist policies they are against.

The term is very misinterpreted.
Maybe they think Socialism is Stalinism.
No, it's not. That is Communism.

Well Rizzo loves dictatorships it seems. And is dictatorship even a socialism trait? I know it is a state capitalist trait, like with Societ Russia which disguised itself as socialism. In that country, the state was comparible to the banking elites.

Socialism is incompatible with dictatorship because being social towards other means being tolerant.
Rizzo has now co-founded a party called "Sovereign People's Democracy". That doesn't sound that dictatorial.

Why are you against banking elites specifically?

Because the FED belongs to the American people and if the FED was state-owned, the American problems would all vanish in an instant.
There would be zero homelessness, there would be free healthcare, affordable university, and so on.

Are you against corporate elites too and politician elites?

No.

Because in my mind it is people with too much power and want to live in relative feudal states that are the problem.

Exactly.

In my country, the wealth is still owned by majority the former oppressive class and even though we are branded "the rainbow nation" our government and society still favour the elites.

I am a socialist meaning that I cannot bear the fact that in the USA all the pieces of property are owned by few people.
That is, every American citizen has the right to a piece of property, and has the right to obtain it with their own work, but aided by the State.

 

[Estro Felino]

She explains it in the best way possible.

 

[Samael_Khan]

The term is very misinterpreted.
Maybe they think Socialism is Stalinism.
No, it's not. That is Communism.

Socialism is incompatible with dictatorship because being social towards other means being tolerant.
Rizzo has now co-founded a party called "Sovereign People's Democracy". That doesn't sound that dictatorial.


Because the FED belongs to the American people and if the FED was state-owned, the American problems would all vanish in an instant.
There would be zero homelessness, there would be free healthcare, affordable university, and so on.

No.

Exactly.

I am a socialist meaning that I cannot bear the fact that in the USA all the pieces of property are owned by few people.
That is, every American citizen has the right to a piece of property, and has the right to obtain it with their own work, but aided by the State.

Yes they do confuse socialism with communism. Also they don't like the population getting free anything because they consider it stealing. So they are against the principles of socialism too.

I agree that socialism doesn't support dictatorship. Rizzo supports dictatorships thats a contradiction on his part.

I dont think that the FED being state owned would solve the problems you mentioned. Because the state could just take the role of banking elites. Or if elites own the politicians they own the government which would mean they would still own the banks.

It makes no sense to me why you are not against the corporate or political elites as they are the same as the banking elites. They all have too much power. High ranking corporations have proven to support a whole lot of atrocities, politicians have done the same and they would rather have a feudal state with wage slaves rather than have the people own the means of production.

I agree with your last point. Here in South Africa we have the same issue. The white elites own most of the land and wealth. People of colour believe everybody must own land because land equals wealth. And everything in it is yours. But the wealthy will never want that to happen because it requires giving up what they have, because they dont care about the majority.

 

[Estro Felino]

I dont think that the FED being state owned would solve the problems you mentioned. Because the state could just take the role of banking elites. Or if elites own the politicians they own the government which would mean they would still own the banks.

It makes no sense to me why you are not against the corporate or political elites as they are the same as the banking elites. They all have too much power. High ranking corporations have proven to support a whole lot of atrocities, politicians have done the same and they would rather have a feudal state with wage slaves rather than have the people own the means of production.

The state is forced by the people to spend the public money on public services, including pensions.

The banksters can spend that on less edifying activities...like prostitution.

I agree with your last point. Here in South Africa we have the same issue. The white elites own most of the land and wealth. People of colour believe everybody must own land because land equals wealth. And everything in it is yours. But the wealthy will never want that to happen because it requires giving up what they have, because they dont care about the majority.

South Africa was colonized by Europeans who took all the lands.
It's founded upon economic injustice.
It's one of the reason why I am a socialist. Resources exist so everyone can benefit from them.
Not a restricted group of "chosen people"...and race doesn't really matter. The élites can be any color.

 

[Stevicus]

This makes sense. What has been shown in the past few years is that extremes breed opposite extremes. That is why politics gets more and more polarising. Extreme capitalism might cause an economic revolution. Already the extremes are showing the true intentions of the tribes because they become more and more blatant in their agendas as time moves on.

My sense is that most people aren't really so ideologically motivated, but if they think they're being treated unfairly or dishonestly, then they might react negatively just the same. People tend to judge according to results that they see at street level.

That's where some of the disconnect comes from, as people living in Beverly Hills and Park Avenue are trying to convince the public that the US economy "has never been better," yet when people look around, they might see crumbling roads, boarded-up storefronts, homeless people on the street, higher prices, declines in the quality of education, healthcare, and housing (while the prices still go up), etc. We've seen supply chain problems, shortages, deteriorating infrastructure, long lines, overly congested roads.

It hasn't reached catastrophic levels yet, but the handwriting is on the wall and our leaders need to pay attention. If they don't, then the consequences will be on them.

 

[Viker]

The Republican Party has ben taken over by the MAGA movement.
That also include external supporters like many many people who left the Democratic Party and supported Trump.

One question (and this time I need you to answer).

The Italian Communist Party leader Rizzo was asked: if you had to choose between Trump and Harris, whom would you choose?
He replied: Trump. No doubt.

Communist Party leader.

It's hilarious that an RF "socialist" and an Italian "communist" would pick a laissez-faire capitalist over an establishment liberal (they're not too far from each other on the economic scale). Proof that socialism and communism are likely dead or have probably left the planet.

 

[Samael_Khan]

The state is forced by the people to spend the public money on public services, including pensions.

The banksters can spend that on less edifying activities...like prostitution.

South Africa was colonized by Europeans who took all the lands.
It's founded upon economic injustice.
It's one of the reason why I am a socialist. Resources exist so everyone can benefit from them.
Not a restricted group of "chosen people"...and race doesn't really matter. The élites can be any color.

I support the ideal of your first paragraph but i don't think the people has the power to force anything short of staging a coup.

Agree mostly with your second paragraph. The power structure is what should be toppled. In my country it is mostly race based. In europe it isnt race based. Formerly it was based on the divine right of kings. In these examples either race or the Divine right of kings are ideological tools used to keep the masses down in the dirt. My view is that governments and corporations are also tools of subjugation. We basically live in feudal states. The only difference is that we can choose our master. We choose eliminate the master/slave structure.

 

[Estro Felino]

It's hilarious that an RF "socialist" and an Italian "communist" would pick a laissez-faire capitalist over an establishment liberal (they're not too far from each other on the economic scale). Proof that socialism and communism are likely dead or have probably left the planet.

To begin with, I am not a US citizen.
Had I been, I would have voted for Kennedy.

I would never vote for Harris because she has been supported by the Soros family.
That's enough.
Never.

 

[Revoltingest]

If interest rates keep falling, I might contact
my banking elites to refinance a line of credit.
A self amortizing loan would be cheaper.
BTW, my bankers are really elite. They serve
me well, & even invite me to social functions.
Go bankers!