My son has joined islam

[Tarheeler]

Very well, my redundant new friend.

I condemn the act, and do so further if they claim the act was in the name of WHATEVER religion. Moreso with people who use Christianity as a justification for ANYTHING wrong: from the multi-million dollar televangelists to the phony "faith-healers" who bilk the poor, old, and down-trodden, to those who commit horrendous acts of violence and claim it was in any way, shape, or form done in the name of God or Christianity.

So, to be succinct, YES.

And I do apologize that I did not answer sooner. You have to recognize that I have been pelted with questions and criticisms from many in this thread. I am trying to keep up with all the brotherly love.

Truthfully, those who feel bashed are also bashing, are they not? But I'm not crying about it.

That said, there are many here who have been helpful, courteous, and compassionate. This is true of people across the varied religious spectrum. I genuinely thank those people, and hope that certain others can take a cue.

You condemn the act, but how do you explain it? Do you beleive that their religion is the reason and motivation behind their actions?

And do you condemn the entire religion of Christianity because of those act as you have done with Islam?

 

[Breathe]

He's been very vague and covert about it. He didn;t tell his mother or me until after he was confirmed.

After he was confirmed? :sarcastic
What do you mean by "confirmed"?

His mother found a quran in his room, but he told her it was part of a school project.

If you forbid him from seeing family and reacted the way it appears you have done here, are you surprised?


I am not.


I woldn't want to tell my family things if I thought they would cut me off from them. I would rather keep it a secret if I feared rejection and isolation on behalf of my own religion. I would not let another person force me out of my own religion, and I would not expect that from my own blood.

I know you have his best interests at heart, but you're doing it wrong.

 

[The Khan]

He's been very vague and covert about it. He didn;t tell his mother or me until after he was confirmed. We only knew he was dating a muslim girl. Ironically, he had described her as a friend only to later say she has been his girlfriend for a few months. I suspected she was, as he was always talking about her. His girlfriends have always been accepted into my home. This was odd behavior.

She's not from a very orthodox family, I can assure you. There's no scope for fanaticism from her side. The reason is quite simple - conservative Islamic ruling is that dating is simply not allowed. If the couple wish to know each other, it is necessary that a male family member (such as father or brother) must accompany the girl at all times. It is also necessary that both families make it clear that marriage is the only intention.

I doubt they've made any such intentions (and probably won't), so there's no reason to be worried.

Good thing about Muslims girls is that most of them have very strong moral values. You should ask him to invite her to your home.

 

[fatima_bintu_islam]

ShredMesister:

I dont know if you have read my post and what you thought of it ( as I already asked to read it and put a link for it ), but anyway I wanted to ask you wether you believe that this time again he became a Muslim because of a girlfriend, or not this time?

May God help you with this case, Amen

 

[Luminous]

He's been very vague and covert about it. He didn;t tell his mother or me until after he was confirmed. We only knew he was dating a muslim girl. Ironically, he had described her as a friend only to later say she has been his girlfriend for a few months. I suspected she was, as he was always talking about her. His girlfriends have always been accepted into my home. This was odd behavior.

His mother found a quran in his room, but he told her it was part of a school project.

My son is a liar, a deceiver, and a con artist.

All the potential and smarts you could want. It's sad really. Almost as if he resents his gifts.

Or perhaps he feels he needs to use his gift against you...the way im seeing it, your son has less interest in the core values of Islam, and more in that muslim girl. I couldn't be too sure, but he likely acquires pride from his choices. I do not see how an Atheist can move so quickly through religious choices, but it is likely best to remind him that everyone has propaganda and that actions have consequences...I am still left foggy as to the situation, but i assume that was always his plan. I think you need to talk and listen to him more, try to reason.

 

[Dezzie]

I know my son well. He does things for a variety of reason. Among them:
Shock value
To impress a girl
To try to fit in/belong
To rebel
To survive

One hardly needs a religion for any of these reasons.

Hmmm... why do you think he does these things? Do you think he may have learned a thing or two from his parents? Many children look up to their parents whether you think so or not. Islam is not the problem here... the problem is your son and his well-being. He NEEDS (as what every one else keeps telling you) to go talk to someone about his problems. Islam has nothing to do with you sons acting out for attention. There is something else wrong with him. Maybe you don't know your son as well as you claim to. I am sorry but seriously. If you knew his SO well, you could look inside yourself to see why on Earth he may be acting out. Is he getting enough attention at home? Is he hanging out with the wrong crowd? Seems like you don't talk to your son like you should be as a parent. IMO

 

[Dezzie]

Oh and another thing... it seems to me like you are defending how you feel about Islam more so than how your son may have something mentally wrong with him. I have once to hear you speak highly, in ANY way about your own son. Instead of saying bad things about the religion, and all the bad things about your own kid, maybe you should start understanding why he is acting the way he does. You need to sit down with him and talk... if he doesn't listen to you, make him. Trap him in a room with you so goodness sakes... this is about his health here... you're his father... you're are not in any means helpless.

 

[no-body]

Start showing an interest in Islam yourself, offer to go with him to mosque I guarantee you he will drop it very quickly. It just sounds like he wants to **** you off and frankly from the way you are acting I can't blame him, you sound controlling. I went through the angst ridden outcast youth thing too and that's what it sounds like.

Also I agree if he needs mental health to offer it but you can't make someone get help if they don't want it. Unless he actually acts on his violent impulses all you can do is say what you have to say and let go.

 

[Luminous]

Oh and another thing... it seems to me like you are defending how you feel about Islam more so than how your son may have something mentally wrong with him. I have once to hear you speak highly, in ANY way about your own son. Instead of saying bad things about the religion, and all the bad things about your own kid, maybe you should start understanding why he is acting the way he does. You need to sit down with him and talk... if he doesn't listen to you, make him. Trap him in a room with you so goodness sakes... this is about his health here... you're his father... you're are not in any means helpless.

lets not be unfair here...he has said his son has "lots of [wasted] potential"...as if that wasn't another insult. you should perhaps invite your son to talk with us, though he will likely be less interested in us..and more interested in that muslim girl that tell him his potential is being used quite well.

 

[DavyCrocket2003]

Hey Shredderman. I really respect your decision to seek for advice. It shows you really are concerned about your son and make the best decisions you can as a father to help him. Good job. That is something to be admired.

Now, as to this decision of your son's to join Islam. I have not read this whole thread, and I am no expert, but I know some things. Islam is not an inherently violent or bad religion. There are a lot of things that people try to add to it that allow them to do what they want. If you get down to the purity of what Islam actually teaches, it is about peace. It is about living a good life. It is about sacrifice and love. If it were me, I would embrace your sons decision. I would encourage you to study the Quran and learn about what it really teaches. Do you believe in God? Because Muslims believe in God too. Christians and Muslims have so much in common. The differences are mostly superficial. I would encourage your son to seek all of the goodness within Islam. And it wouldn't hurt if you shared in his journey a little bit too. Good is good, regardless of the source.

Above all, be genuine. Don't do anything out of retaliation, anger, or fear. Do everything out of love and because you feel it is the best way to help your son. He'll be able to tell which it is, trust me. There is nothing more hypocritical than the parent who is mad because their child is challenging their control so they dole out punishment and claim "It's only because we love you." *right* Discovering the true motivations for our actions is a profound experience. Changing them is even more profound.

 

[Alceste]

But Jesus didn't kill these people, whereas Muhammad clearly did.

Are you contending that Jesus, like Mohammed, was only a man? If that is not what you believe, why do you hold a man to the same moral standard as your god?

I am aware, and have mentioned in this thread, that there are some incredibly bad things done by people who are Christians. I am not ignorant to this fact.

However, when I pressed my son as to his beliefs regarding terrorism and suicide bombings, beheadings, etc...when these actions were SPECIFICALLY done by people claiming they do it for religious reasons...his response is not unlike SOME of what i have read here: "Those aren't real muslims(although the perpetrators claim islam)." or "They're doing it wrong." That troubles me.

Why does that trouble you? Are you under the impression that Wahhabi extremism is considered pious and good in mainstream Muslim communities? Maybe your son is right and you are wrong. AFAIK, al Qaeda does not claim to be "doing it for religious reasons". Like the US, the religious fanatics among them sincerely believe what they are doing is righteous, but bin Laden's comments have always been explicit in identifying US foreign policy as the primary reason for his "holy" war.

 

[Alceste]

Not in my state.

Beheading innocent people while calling out Allah's name is downright revolting. I am pretty sure you agree, but please know that I am NOT talking about punishment for crime.

I'm talking about western journalists, among others. NOT criminals.

Maybe you didn't notice this, but the US invaded Iraq. It's a bit rich to be blaming Islam for the deaths of invading forces, or those perceived to be working with / for the occupying forces. Would you commit violence to defend your homeland against foreign occupation? Please note the American Christians have slaughtered far more Muslims in Afghanistan and Iraq than the other way around, and their methods have been more horrific and indiscriminate than beheadings. Ever heard of white phosphorus? At least with beheadings, you only kill your target. The depleted uranium contamination left in Iraq by civilian-slaughtering US munitions will be causing horrific birth defects for generations to come.

Is Christianity to blame for the US army's gang rape and murder of a 14 year old girl and her entire family? After all, some US soldiers have Bible verses inscribed on their gun butts.

I'm sorry but I can not let an AMERICAN, of all people, get away with criticizing some other culture for the endorsement and practice of violence. Think it through, man.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

Shredmeister you're not being fair about Muhammad. Muhammad came from an extremely barbaric society. His society was nothing but killing almost constantly for the honor of one's clan or tribe. Muhammad in comparison to that was a saint.

 

[YmirGF]

Muhammad in comparison to that was a saint.

Which isn't saying a lot.

 

[The Khan]

Why does that trouble you? Are you under the impression that Wahhabi extremism is considered pious and good in mainstream Muslim communities?

This might surprise you, but most Wahaabis are actually very peaceful individuals. They're just a little fanatic when it comes to theological disputes, such as saint veneration.

My great-grandfather was a well known Wahaabi scholar. XD

Al-Qaeda has only 1,500 members from all across the Arab world. Saudi Arabia has over 30 million people. Other groups described as 'terrorist' such as Hezbollah, Hamas, LeT, Huji, etc, are not Wahaabi in their ideology. It's only Al-Qaeda (and some Taliban groups nominally).

 

[Shredmeister]

After he was confirmed? :sarcastic
What do you mean by "confirmed"?


If you forbid him from seeing family and reacted the way it appears you have done here, are you surprised?


I am not.


I woldn't want to tell my family things if I thought they would cut me off from them. I would rather keep it a secret if I feared rejection and isolation on behalf of my own religion. I would not let another person force me out of my own religion, and I would not expect that from my own blood.

I know you have his best interests at heart, but you're doing it wrong.

Umm.....he was never cut off from the family until AFTER this. Thus, he had no reason to hide any of this. There is a great possibility that i would be less infuriated had he discussed it with me form the beginning.

See, my son is of the mindset that he would rather ask forgiveness than permission.

Having never once prior to this development said a negative word about islam to him, he had no reason to keep this from me, unless he felt somehow guilty or ashamed. In fact, I was among many who decried the bush administration for its own acts of terrorism against a nation that was doing NOTHING to us.

The pattern with this young man is one of doing things without telling anyone until it becomes a done deal.

More than anything, the deceit involved angers me.

I woldn't want to tell my family things if I thought they would cut me off from them.

This has never happened before, so he would have no reason to suspect this.

And let me say that the imam would likely be given pause if he new the nature of things my son has done. He may want no involvement with my son. A rational person would not.

 

[Shredmeister]

Maybe you didn't notice this, but the US invaded Iraq. It's a bit rich to be blaming Islam for the deaths of invading forces, or those perceived to be working with / for the occupying forces. Would you commit violence to defend your homeland against foreign occupation? Please note the American Christians have slaughtered far more Muslims in Afghanistan and Iraq than the other way around, and their methods have been more horrific and indiscriminate than beheadings. Ever heard of white phosphorus? At least with beheadings, you only kill your target. The depleted uranium contamination left in Iraq by civilian-slaughtering US munitions will be causing horrific birth defects for generations to come.

Is Christianity to blame for the US army's gang rape and murder of a 14 year old girl and her entire family? After all, some US soldiers have Bible verses inscribed on their gun butts.

I'm sorry but I can not let an AMERICAN, of all people, get away with criticizing some other culture for the endorsement and practice of violence. Think it through, man.

Show me one syllable stating I endorse violence. ONE???? Ah yes....none to be found.

I am also anti-war, so you're preaching to the choir. Bush jr had it in for Saddam for personal reasons and we all know that. I never supported that invasion, and boldly argued with those misled by bush that we would never find wmd, yet bush would invade regardless. They argued with me. Clearly, they were wrong. Many here seem to have me pegged as some sort of right-wing radical, which is far from true. I am opposed to any type of extremists, be it religiously or even something as innocuous as taste in music.

 

[Alceste]

Show me one syllable stating I endorse violence. ONE???? Ah yes....none to be found.

I am also anti-war, so you're preaching to the choir. Bush jr had it in for Saddam for personal reasons and we all know that. I never supported that invasion, and boldly argued with those misled by bush that we would never find wmd, yet bush would invade regardless. They argued with me. Clearly, they were wrong. Many here seem to have me pegged as some sort of right-wing radical, which is far from true. I am opposed to any type of extremists, be it religiously or even something as innocuous as taste in music.

Then we have something in common. The point I was trying to make is that you will better see the relationship between mainstream Islam and the type al Qaeda subscribe to if you first consider the differences between GW "God said go invade Iraq" Bush's version of Christianity and your own. Is it possible that the Muslims here who insist their practice of Islam is peaceful are not liars, and there are as wide a range of approaches as there are in Christianity?

 

[Alceste]

This might surprise you, but most Wahaabis are actually very peaceful individuals. They're just a little fanatic when it comes to theological disputes, such as saint veneration.

My great-grandfather was a well known Wahaabi scholar. XD
Al-Qaeda has only 1,500 members from all across the Arab world. Saudi Arabia has over 30 million people. Other groups described as 'terrorist' such as Hezbollah, Hamas, LeT, Huji, etc, are not Wahaabi in their ideology. It's only Al-Qaeda (and some Taliban groups nominally).

Thanks for the info. I think of Hezbollah and Hamas as political parties rather than being specifically associated with Islam. Suffice it to say, it is impossible for me as a woman not to associate the Taliban's "nominal" religion with extreme violence. In your view, are they doing it wrong?

 

[UniversalScholar]

Congratulations. Best religion in the world IMO. If you follow the morals of it, and not the pages.