Nice Guy Syndrome and Misandry

[-Peacemaker-]

As I said it effects different people differently (and I believe I am relatively engaging, I speak eloquently at least) I would suggest that perhaps in your pastor's case the degree of impact on his recognition of emotional and social queues is perhaps not as marked as mine (obviously this is an assumption without much evidence other than the fact that he has a wife - how attractive she is being immaterial)

Depends on the situation but generally just more difficult although that requires significant previous knowledge of the individual in order to build up knowledge of their emotional queues; so basically, if I know the person well I am better able to pick it; but even with my family members I am not very good at this.

Did you ever try online dating? I figure that would play to your communication strengths.

 

[InformedIgnorance]

I am seldom called rude or snobbish (I am very effective at my emulation) I am however sometimes called 'a bit distant'.

With relation to reduced ability to read emotional queues this is quite a problem for someone who attempts to be a 'nice guy' because to do so one must needs err on the side of caution - avoiding behaviours that might potentially cause a range of scenarios you are not really sure whether or not they cause other people displeasure and so forth and your capacity to obtain feedback about people's emotional response to your actions are diminished.

^_-

edit:

Did you ever try online dating? I figure that would play to your communication strengths.

I suppose I could do so - however that would be a misrepresentation of myself; in the same way that I do not fudge my CV or Resume (not even in the slightest which is common) I would not consider such a misrepresentation to be acceptable according to my ethical standards.

second edit:

Can you learn some? I would imagine it won't be the same at all, but could it at least help to learn some in a more objective way?

I mean, while others do so subconsciously, could you google up the body language things and try to remember them and recognize them?

I have done that before and found myself even more confused than before... such as attempting to discern the difference in eye shifts driven by emotional triggers and those simply because the person is attempting to do the 'intermittent eye-contact' thing (I myself have been taught the need to look away from people's eyes sometimes because it can unnerve people - particularly from an individual of my size... that took a long time to learn and I do mess up sometimes) or is looking at their surroundings in order to evaluate events and so forth. So tiring :/

 

[Chisti]

Can you learn some? I would imagine it won't be the same at all, but could it at least help to learn some in a more objective way?

I mean, while others do so subconsciously, could you google up the body language things and try to remember them and recognize them?

It won't be that simple, most of it is intuitive rather than mechanical. But even otherwise, it feels awkward simply being in a social situation. The arbitrary rules and social etiquette - saying hello, smiling, nodding etc. - sort of frustrate you.

 

[Me Myself]

It won't be that simple, most of it is intuitive rather than mechanical. But even otherwise, it feels awkward simply being in a social situation. The arbitrary rules and social etiquette - saying hello, smiling, nodding etc. - sort of frustrate you.

Heh, I feel I understand a lot. I know I am not Auspie (well,... nah, I am not) but I tend to be very awkward in social situations too.

It's different with friends... but in so many scenarios I just feel socially deficient. I guess there must be some subconsious doing of mine which I have yet to recognize, but it tends to be hard for me to get along. Most of the times I just say the very worst thing in the very worst time

I don't even realize I shouldn't have said X until I said it. Before syaing it it sounded perfectly okay in my head. But yeah, I do tend to recognize when I ****** up in people's faces afterwards :ninja:

 

[-Peacemaker-]

edit:
I suppose I could do so - however that would be a misrepresentation of myself; in the same way that I do not fudge my CV or Resume (not even in the slightest which is common) I would not consider such a misrepresentation to be acceptable according to my ethical standards.

I would think that if anything, such communication would allow a girl to see more clearly into your heart without any unintended body language getting in the way. There are certainly girls that wouldn't be scared off by the syndrome especially if you tell them in advance not to read too deeply into some of your behavior. I know this because I've dealt with several people who suffered from "disabilities", some of which were very serious, that were still able to find a match.

 

[InformedIgnorance]

It won't be that simple, most of it is intuitive rather than mechanical. But even otherwise, it feels awkward simply being in a social situation. The arbitrary rules and social etiquette - saying hello, smiling, nodding etc. - sort of frustrate you.

*Nods* Some can be picked up to varying extents by some people with aspergers - for example I seldom say hello or smile, but i often nod or do a rather diminutive wave... doing so has been quite effective for me and it seems natural to most people (indeed it has become such a common behavioural pattern I do so largely without thinking about it now)... other times... simply pretending you didn't notice the person is easier x.x

edit:

I would think that if anything, such communication would allow a girl to see more clearly into your heart without any unintended body language getting in the way. There are certainly girls that wouldn't be scared off by the syndrome especially if you tell them in advance not to read too deeply into some of your behavior. I know this because I've dealt with several people who suffered from "disabilities", some of which were very serious, that were still able to find a match.

And I can indeed see the validity of this, however it does not resolve the issue of misrepresentation, in that I am presenting myself as an individual with fewer readily identifiable flaws (I was about to say NO flaws then had to change it lol) where those flaws do indeed exist and are significantly important within a relationship.

 

[-Peacemaker-]

*
edit:
And I can indeed see the validity of this, however it does not resolve the issue of misrepresentation, in that I am presenting myself as an individual with fewer readily identifiable flaws (I was about to say NO flaws then had to change it lol) where those flaws do indeed exist and are significantly important within a relationship.

I'll say this much. I think we sometimes assume that a lady will see our "flaws" the same way that we do. In doing so we actually judge her heart as if we were able to see inside of it. Besides, we're rarely our own best critic.

 

[InformedIgnorance]

I'll say this much. I think we sometimes assume that a lady will see our "flaws" the same way that we do. In doing so we actually judge her heart as if we were able to see inside of it. Besides, we're rarely our own best critic.

I am far more critical of myself than of others (and similarly, more critical than the average person is of others) - however only with regards to criteria substantive to the issue.

But these things inch forward ever so slightly - for example I have only recently concluded (I am nearing 30 now) that thinking that I have a better chance with an 'average looking' (I do so hate to use such expressions) woman compared to an 'extremely attractive' woman is actually extremely rude. Not just to the 'average looking' woman which I have known for a VERY long time (because it is an attitude that indicates something as insignificant as appearance indicates one's 'worth') but also to the 'extremely attractive' woman (because it is an assertion that they are likely to have more superficial criteria by which to evaluate prospective partners).

I realised such a perspective is actually slightly based on both misogyny and misandry strangely enough - bringing us back to the topic at hand

 

[Me Myself]

It's not necesarily rude. It could even be accurate were you live or something.

to say you have more chances with doesn't mean that every super atractive is X or avarage atractive is Y. It only means that they tend to be.

 

[Mathematician]

Women go for bad dudes and men go for crazy females. Such is life.

 

[InformedIgnorance]

@MM - I know, but just because something is a valid generalisation, does not mean the assumption is relevant to the particular individual and it is potentially offensive - therefore it is rude.

 

[Hope]

Women don't want a nice metro guy - they prefer something more rugged and masculine.

Money is a key motivator as well, so sadly, personality trails in a distant third.

Just a fact of life.

Why all this idealistic talk of 'it's the personality that matters' - pure nonsense.

With all due respect, you are mistaken. At least about the money and personality parts. I could care less about money, and even if a guy is gorgeous, rugged, and masculine, if he has a lousy personality and character, I wouldn't want him. I learned the hard way that having a handsome face and buff bod mean nothing if the guy is a jerk. The most beautiful man I ever met was poor and average-looking, but he possessed a heart of gold, and that, to me, made all the difference.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

I hate it when one of my joke threads get all serious.

What is wrong with you people?

Ok. When it comes to guys I don't like jerks or "nice guys" I like guys like Thor. Yes Thor! Thor is strong but yet vulnerable, he is sweet but can get nasty when threaten. Thor isn't too bright intellectually but when it comes to saying the right things he is a pure poet. And Thor even though he is a god doesn't mind humbling himself to his lady, in fact he likes his lady to be strong minded and a challenge.

 

[nnmartin]

well the OP sounded like a feminist rant to me....

but Thor, yes that just about sums it up.

He is a dominant Alpha male.

 

[InformedIgnorance]

Well traditionally he was... then they added more 'touchy feely stuff' aka emotional aspects into the mix to make him more palatable for modernity.

 

[nnmartin]

what I can't understand is why people don't just openly admit these things.

Why can't women just say - I hate weedy nice guys, I prefer a macho, male sexist pig that will protect me from all the other macho, male sexist pigs?

that would be far easier to deal with.

I can admit my view easy enough.

I like a woman who is feminine, good in bed, reasonably intelligent and not prim or proper.

how about that?

also I must add: I hate these self-righteous NGO types that plague the town I am living in - usually middle class, white liberal girls that secretly desire Caveman orgy!

 

[Shermana]

what I can't understand is why people don't just openly admit these things.

Why can't women just say - I hate weedy nice guys, I prefer a macho, male sexist pig that will protect me from all the other macho, male sexist pigs?

that would be far easier to deal with.

I can admit my view easy enough.

I like a woman who is feminine, good in bed, reasonably intelligent and not prim or proper.

how about that?

also I must add: I hate these self-righteous NGO types that plague the town I am living in - usually middle class, white liberal girls that secretly desire Caveman orgy!

Hint: Stop whining and become the caveman....

I recommend growing a beard. The ladies say they don't like it at first, don't listen. It works.

 

[Sunstone]

what I can't understand is why people don't just openly admit these things.

Admit these things? Excellent idea! I would like to admit that among the stupid things I've heard of in this world, surely one of the most stupid is to think that you can speak for the whole human race, or even for just half the human race. Now, that's stupid!

I feel so much better having just now admitted that. Thanks so much for the inspiration!

 

[nnmartin]

no problem , that is fine by me.

we should also do away with all euphemisms and political correctness - just say it like it is, this would surely benefit everyone in the long term.

 

[Sunstone]

Women go for bad dudes and men go for crazy females. Such is life.

People sometimes make unwise choices. Such is life.