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Now Belgium bans burqa in public places

JMorris

Democratic Socialist
Why should your view about what a woman wears carry more weight than hers?

why would my view of swastikas or kkk hoods carry anymore weight than skinheads or klan members? probably the fact that i find the articles of clothing repulsive. and silly me, i tend to think that to be the only rational position to take on extremist costumes.
 

sandandfoam

Veteran Member
why would my view of swastikas or kkk hoods carry anymore weight than skinheads or klan members? probably the fact that i find the articles of clothing repulsive. and silly me, i tend to think that to be the only rational position to take on extremist costumes.
With respect, you haven't answered my question.
Why should your view about what a woman wears carry more weight than hers?
 

Tanuki

Taking a hiatus
why would my view of swastikas or kkk hoods carry anymore weight than skinheads or klan members? probably the fact that i find the articles of clothing repulsive. and silly me, i tend to think that to be the only rational position to take on extremist costumes.

Sorry but how is a burqa extremist? It's a Pakistani/Afghani piece of cultural clothing! It's like saying we Scotsmen are extremist when we wear a kilt, or that an Emirati is extremist when wearing a kandoura!
 

JMorris

Democratic Socialist
With respect, you haven't answered my question.
Why should your view about what a woman wears carry more weight than hers?

i did answer it. i find the niqab & burqa to be repulsive signs of extremism, and i also find that to be the only rational position to hold.
 

sandandfoam

Veteran Member
i did answer it. i find the niqab & burqa to be repulsive signs of extremism, and i also find that to be the only rational position to hold.
LOL That's not an answer :)
The question was why are your views superior, and you say because they're mine and I'm rational.
 

Abu Rashid

Active Member
Smoke,

Well, good. Then barring the burqa doesn't interfere with anybody's religious freedom.

That's correct! No more than banning covering of breasts would interfere with Christian women's religious freedom.

It in fact interferes with their basic human rights to their privacy and protection of their own bodies.... but nevermind that.
 

Abu Rashid

Active Member
JMorris,

i did answer it. i find the niqab & burqa to be repulsive signs of extremism, and i also find that to be the only rational position to hold.

It's not very accurate to define extremism according to how much of their body a woman covers. Using such outward signs to judge such things is a mistake. I'm sure there's plenty of women who wear niqab who are quite "moderate" in their beliefs, whilst I'm sure there's plenty of women who only wear hijab who'd be quite "extreme" in their beliefs. Such outward signs do not determine a person's beliefs or level of adherence to their religion, except in the minds of simpletons.
 

JMorris

Democratic Socialist
LOL That's not an answer :)
The question was why are your views superior, and you say because they're mine and I'm rational.

i think my view is superior because its rational. i dont believe its rational because its my view. rather, it is my view because its the only rational one i see.
 

*Anne*

Bliss Ninny
Hm. I have to say, I don't like to see burqas. They disturb me. However, I don't like to see guys with Neo-Nazi tattoos. They disturb me too, but I can't make them cover up.

I can see the argument for identification. But that would be the only reason I would move to restrict this particular form of dress. Does anyone know if a person can march around 24/7 in a ski-mask here in the US? Has anyone tried it? I wonder if the cops would pull you over.
 

sandandfoam

Veteran Member
Hm. I have to say, I don't like to see burqas. They disturb me. However, I don't like to see guys with Neo-Nazi tattoos. They disturb me too, but I can't make them cover up.

This categorisation of perceived symbols of Islam with Nazism bothers me.
The demonisation of Islam and the creation of mythological Islamic bogeymen is disturbing.
 

*Anne*

Bliss Ninny
This categorisation of perceived symbols of Islam with Nazism bothers me.
The demonisation of Islam and the creation of mythological Islamic bogeymen is disturbing.

I picked neo-Nazi tattoos as an example of something that disturbs me, yet the person has every right to display such a tattoo. It was the first thing that popped into my head.

I don't equate Muslims with Nazis.
 
i think my view is superior because its rational. i dont believe its rational because its my view. rather, it is my view because its the only rational one i see.

JMorris, I think your view is rational and fair. All extremists should be treated similarly - we shouldn\'t allow one form of extremism and ban others. The burka is a symbol of Islamic extremism, and the patriarchy, misogyny/gender-classism, and reactionary ideas associated with theocracy.

We live in a society which is democratic, secular, and multicultural. Islam however is a paternalistic-authoritarian-religious ideology which is monocultural in nature. Only one culture is allowed - Islam. Which is why Islam is more or less fundamentally intolerant. And that intolerance is what is so extreme about the burka.

You see, a problem arises when people use their freedoms to assault the freedoms of others. An individual\'s freedom only gos so far as the tip of other people\'s noses. Once they cross the line into offending others, their freedom ends and the other person\'s freedom begins. When this happens, the system becomes sabotaged and freedom becomes extinct. All freedom lovers cannot and should not stand for this. We must rally ourselves against the forces of bigotry and together defeat intolerance. Tolerance is not meant for those who do not mean to be tolerant. I don\'t mean to deviate from my ideology, but I am not an extremist and I realize there are exceptions to the rule.

Some people will say that I am combatting the hate of freedom with the inhibition of freedom. I will answer their accusations now by the means of a question - Would you rather have The People, that is, the State, be a force of benevolence and tolerance, a neutral arbiter that punishes those that interfer with the rights of others, or one of extortion, self-indulgence, and hate for the soul which lives simply trying to do what is right in the world?

The People, when in a state to be desired, must regulate it\'s population to prevent the bigotry, intolerance and hate from distrubing the placid lakes of society.
 

sandandfoam

Veteran Member
Islam however is a paternalistic-authoritarian-religious ideology which is monocultural in nature. Only one culture is allowed - Islam. Which is why Islam is more or less fundamentally intolerant. And that intolerance is what is so extreme about the burka.

That's just nonsense. The Qur'an says that there is diversity in the world because that's the way God willed it.
 

Tanuki

Taking a hiatus
The burka is a symbol of Islamic extremism, and the patriarchy, misogyny/gender-classism, and reactionary ideas associated with theocracy.

As I have stated before, the burqa isn't Islamic it's cultural! And whilst the Taliban did enforce its usage, it was around long before they ever showed up on the scene.
 
As I have stated before, the burqa isn\'t Islamic it\'s cultural! And whilst the Taliban did enforce its usage, it was around long before they ever showed up on the scene.

If it\'s not a religious thing then how are people infringing on Islamist religious rights (as they claim) by banning it?
 
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