Now Belgium bans burqa in public places

[Sahar]

That's ridiculous and wrong. There are almost no jobs where a headscarf can't be worn appropriately, safely, and attractively. However, the niqab and the burqa are another matter, IMO.

Attractively
LOL
Personally, I am not in favor of niqab at all but at the same time I believe the Muslim woman should be absolutely free to cover her face or not, this right should not be taken from her. I actually don't disagree that Muslims in many cases enjoy much more freedom there than their original countries and I believe many have high expectation of the Western freedom. I sometimes ask myself why a Muslim woman with niqab would want to live in a Western country but it seems the answer is that they have more freedom than many other Islamic countries. Of course, banning the niqab and hijab in some places is disappointing and this leads to question the Western claims of freedom.
And btw, I expect any society to impose some restrictions in accordance to their views and values. But the real objection is the Western claims about freedoms and liberties (of course in addition to the injustice that Muslim women face, I don't want to see the Muslim woman there have such difficulties or to see her right to dress in the way she wants and think that it brings her closer to her God being taken from her).

 

[Aquitaine]

To my knowledge this is only a ban on the Niqab face veil (or "Burka") and not the Hijab. If wearing the Niqab/Burka face veil is so important to being a Muslim, then does that mean that wearing the Hijab makes you less close to God? Where in the Koran or Hadiths does it say that a Woman's face (with the exception of the eyes in most cases) should be covered?

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

To my knowledge this is only a ban on the Niqab face veil (or "Burka") and not the Hijab. If wearing the Niqab/Burka face veil is so important to being a Muslim, then does that mean that wearing the Hijab makes you less close to God? Where in the Koran or Hadiths does it say that a Woman's face (with the exception of the eyes in most cases) should be covered?

That is for Muslim women to determine, not for you to police.

 

[Sahar]

There is nothing in the Qur'an to say the face should be covered so i don't see the problem with the ban

Your opinion on what the Qur'an/Islam say on this as a non Muslim is absolutely irrelevant. The Question of whether niqab is Islamic or not is irrelevant because there are Muslims, lay Muslims and scholars who think it's Islamically required. The issue of niqab is controversial between the scholars so it's not even right for a Muslim who thinks niqab is not required to exclude the other opinion. Both opinions exist and we should recognize other Muslims right to embrace the different opinion.

 

[Sajdah]

Out of curiosity where in the Quran or Sahih Hadiths does it state that Muslim Women must wear the Niqab/Burka face veil?

Islam is not all about obligations, there are many things we practice everyday and they are not obligations... There are extra or optional things we do.....By saying that doesn't give Niqab less importance than Hijab, because Niqab for women who wear it is just like Hijab for those who wear it. So taking that right away from them means taking their right to practice what suits them more...

 

[Sahar]

That is for Muslim women to determine, not for you to police.

Exactly, Jay.

 

[Sahar]

Islam is not all about obligations, there are many things we practice everyday and they are not obligations... There are extra or optional things we do....

Yes. Some women who wear the niqab believe it's an Islamic obligations while there are others who believe it's a good additional deed to the obligatory one. Just like we have five obligatory prayers but many Muslims perform extra prayers optionally to get closer to Allah, the same for fasting, charity...etc.

 

[England my lionheart]

Your opinion on what the Qur'an/Islam say on this as a non Muslim is absolutely irrelevant. The Question of whether niqab is Islamic or not is irrelevant because there are Muslims, lay Muslims and scholars who think it's Islamically required. The issue of niqab is controversial between the scholars so it's not even right for a Muslim who thinks niqab is not required to exclude the other opinion. Both opinions exist and we should recognize other Muslims right to embrace the different opinion.

I agree,my opinion would be irrelevant in Saudi for example but in a secular country it isn't and its not my problem that so clled Scholars cannot agree on the wearing of niqab which is nothing new as they cannot agree on much as it is.

 

[Sahar]

I agree,my opinion would be irrelevant in Saudi for example but in a secular country it isn't and its not my problem that so clled Scholars cannot agree on the wearing of niqab which is nothing new as they cannot agree on much as it is.

Well, you are the one who mentioned the Qur'an as a basis for whether the ban is okay with you or not.
In a secular country what should concern you is the right of others to practice their religions freely and wear whatever they want freely, right?

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I agree,my opinion would be irrelevant in Saudi for example but in a secular country it isn't ...

It should be. Read Alexis Tocqueville's Democracy in America where he speaks of the role or democratic rights in curbing the tyranny of the majority.

 

[Aquitaine]

That is for Muslim women to determine, not for you to police.

Well if I entered certain areas with a ski-mask on, it would be a matter for the Police.

 

[MissAlice]

I think it's wrong. It's another form of oppression and hypocritical coming from a society that calls itself secular.

People should be free to chose what they should or shouldn't wear even when it related to their own belief systems. Not all women who wear burqas in the west are being made to.

 

[Aquitaine]

Islam is not all about obligations, there are many things we practice everyday and they are not obligations... There are extra or optional things we do.....By saying that doesn't give Niqab less importance than Hijab, because Niqab for women who wear it is just like Hijab for those who wear it. So taking that right away from them means taking their right to practice what suits them more...

So it's a matter of Muslims defining their own sense of what is an "obligation" to their Faith, to some degree? i.e Hijab for some, Niqab for others? Thus a universal ban on the Niqab would affect only certain types of Muslims who see it is an obligation, but not the others who don't see it as one?

 

[Sajdah]

Yes. Some women who wear the niqab believe it's an Islamic obligations while there are others who believe it's a good additional deed to the obligatory one. Just like we have five obligatory prayers but many Muslims perform extra prayers optionally to get closer to Allah, the same for fasting, charity...etc.

Exactly! niqab is not just a cultural thing as some want to view it...

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Well if I entered certain areas with a ski-mask on, it would be a matter for the Police.

A decade ago the comparison would have struck people as stupid to the point of being absurd. Present day Islamophobia makes it no less moronic, simply more dishonest.

 

[England my lionheart]

Well, you are the one who mentioned the Qur'an as a basis for whether the ban is okay with you or not.
In a secular country what should concern you is the right of others to practice their religions freely and wear whatever they want freely, right?

Absolutely agree,just as long as it does'nt present a security risk,besides if i were to move to another Country and culture i would'nt expect that Culture to adapt to mine,in fact i would not move to another Country that was the opposite of my religion in the first place.

 

[Aquitaine]

A decade ago the comparison would have struck people as stupid to the point of being absurd. Present day Islamophobia makes it no less moronic, simply more dishonest.

Why is the comparison absurd?

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Why is the comparison absurd?

Good grief ...

 

[Sajdah]

So it's a matter of Muslims defining their own sense of what is an "obligation" to their Faith, to some degree? i.e Hijab for some, Niqab for others? Thus a universal ban on the Niqab would affect only certain types of Muslims who see it is an obligation, but not the others who don't see it as one?

The universal ban would affect all Muslims, because what was banned is something related to Islam.....

 

[Sahar]

Absolutely agree,just as long as it does'nt present a security risk,besides if i were to move to another Country and culture i would'nt expect that Culture to adapt to mine,in fact i would not move to another Country that was the opposite of my religion in the first place.

If you want to impose a monocultural society then absolutely it can't be called a free society. Freedom becomes significant when the society encounters what is different and diverse.