Once Again The United States Supreme Court Blows It

[Saint Frankenstein]

It is one of several time-honored traditions in this country, taking precedence in our nation's founding documents, and as such should be left alone. Period.

No, it's not. It's from 1956 as the motto. E pluribus unum is from 1789, so you should care more about that traditional motto being changed to placate religious nutters in the '50s. Regardless, the founders of this country were revolutionaries, not slaves to tradition.

 

[metis]

With Trump as our leader, he and we as a country certainly ain't acting like "In God We Trust".

We have a leader that scriptures tells us to be wary of and not follow, and we have a large minority who blindly believe in this man who commits adultery, uses prostitutes, lies an average of 10 time per day when he speaks publicly, doesn't pay people for work done, sides with brutal tyrants while dissing our allies, brags about his penis size and how he can grope and forcibly kiss women, etc.

Last time I heard, those ain't Christian nor observant Jewish values. His pandering, especially on the issues of abortion and Israel, is nauseating since he never took those positions prior to trying to get Republicans to vote for him during the primaries.

 

[Father Heathen]

Does it really personally cause you any physical, emotional or psychological harm to have that phrase on a coin?

The government's integrity is harmed when it fails to abide the principles that it was founded upon.

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

If America wants to exclude atheists, that's fine, but it shouldn't expect any more respect or loyalty from the atheists living there than it shows them. Why should an atheist pledge allegiance to a country so disrespectful to him or her?

 

[Father Heathen]

With Trump as our leader, he and we as a country certainly ain't acting like "In God We Trust".

We have a leader that scriptures tells us to be wary of and not follow, and we have a large minority who blindly believe in this man who commits adultery, uses prostitutes, lies an average of 10 time per day when he speaks publicly, doesn't pay people for work done, sides with brutal tyrants while dissing our allies, brags about his penis size and how he can grope and forcibly kiss women, etc.

Last time I heard, those ain't Christian nor observant Jewish values. His pandering, especially on the issues of abortion and Israel, is nauseating since he never took those positions prior to trying to get Republicans to vote for him during the primaries.

Conservative Christians revere Christ, yet revile everything he actually stood for. Quite strange.

 

[Stanyon]

At the end of the day it all spends the same, god or no god. I find it interesting someone would obsess that much over something so small.

 

[The Reverend Bob]

If American Christians want to have a phrase that literally comes out of the Islamic Quran on their currency in the spirit of ecumenicism I see no harm. The phrase "In Allah (God) we trust" is right in there.

 

[The Reverend Bob]

The government's integrity is harmed when it fails to abide the principles that it was founded upon.

We have Trump as President, yet you are worried about the government losing integrity over something stamped on a coin? Integrity went goodbye over something more than just a coin. Like Jesus said when he was shown a coin with a similar inscription "Render unto Caesar, what is Caesar's", this is a non-issue.

 

[metis]

Conservative Christians revere Christ, yet revile everything he actually stood for. Quite strange.

I think "everything" is too strong a word, but there's no doubt in my mind that you are basically right. They're seemingly too much into right-wing politics and too little into Jesus' teachings on the "law of love".

Too many, imo, use the abortion as some sort of litmus test and "wedge issue", whereas abortion is never mentioned in the scriptures and was not viewed as "murder" within halachah (Jewish Law). And then they take positions that are quite anti-child in other areas, with one characterization of evil being separating families at the border and putting kids into cages in order to "send a message" as Trump has repeatedly stated.

And they say they're Pro-Life and yet endorse capital punishment, [I am Pro-Life, btw, but I don't believe I have the moral right to dictate what a woman must do with that which is inside her], and are often too willing to go to war at the drop of a hat, such as with "shock & awe" against a country that didn't attack us.

So, sorry that I can't argue against your position.

 

[Kenny]

Cool beans, but that establishment clause though.

A modern interpretation--but not original intent. Never interpreted that way unto the 1960's or so.

 

[Sundance]

No, it's not. It's from 1956 as the motto. E pluribus unum is from 1789, so you should care more about that traditional motto being changed to placate religious nutters in the '50s. Regardless, the founders of this country were revolutionaries, not slaves to tradition.

E pluribus unum hasn't been changed as the official motto of our nation, Frank. It still is. Regarding the precedence to referencing God within civil contexts, this goes back to (again) the FOUNDING DOCUMENT OF THIS NATION which contains a notable and explicit reference to a Creator. Speaking to the Founding Fathers, the vast majority of them were either Christians or Deists, individuals who believed in a God. Again, let us re-establish this: is any American citizen here being compelled or otherwise forced by their government to believe in a god or gods, or to adopt any particular religion? No.

 

[joe1776]

.

Aside from its 2008 ruling on the Second Amendment right to possess a firearm this is one of the Court's more egregious decisions.

"Earlier today, the Supreme Court rejected an appeal from a group of atheists trying to get “In God We Trust” off our money. (It’s case 18-1297 in case you’re curious.) This was the most recent case brought forth by atheist activist Michael Newdow, most famous for his unsuccessful battle over “Under God” in the Pledge of Allegiance.

Last August, the Eighth U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals ruled unanimously (3-0) against more than two dozen atheists, their children, and two groups named in the lawsuit. They said the phrase didn’t violate the First Amendment’s Establishment Clause and Free Exercise Clause, the Religious Freedom Restoration Act (RFRA), or the Equal Protection component of the Fifth Amendment.

The judges said that the motto was part of an established tradition in the U.S. going back to our founding and that the phrase wasn’t unfairly coercive. (One judge didn’t concur on some of the analysis, but the end result was the same.)

The Constitution does not prevent the Government from promoting and “celebrat[ing] our tradition of religious freedom,” even if the means of doing so — here, adding the national motto to U.S. money — was motivated “in part because of religious sentiment”… Placing “In God We Trust” on coins and currency is consistent with historical practices.
…
… we recognize that convenience may lead some Plaintiffs to carry cash, but nothing compels them to assert their trust in God. Certainly no “reasonable observer” would think that the Government is attempting to force citizens to express trust in God with every monetary transaction.​

source

.​

If tradition is accepted as a good reason not to make changes, then we let pass all stupidity and injustice if it has been around long enough.

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

We have Trump as President, yet you are worried about the government losing integrity over something stamped on a coin? Integrity went goodbye over something more than just a coin. Like Jesus said when he was shown a coin with a similar inscription "Render unto Caesar, what is Caesar's", this is a non-issue.

The problem being they're both symptoms of the same problem: American Christians' entitlement & desire to have their beliefs respected by Government at the expense of everyone else's.

We don't need to imagine too hard to envisage the uproar if someone in political office suggested changing the wording on coins to 'In Allah We Trust' - bearing in mind 'Allah' is the Arabic word for God.

 

[Skwim]

At the end of the day it all spends the same, god or no god. I find it interesting someone would obsess that much over something so small.

Then I assume you'd have no problem if our money said:

. ​

 

[The Reverend Bob]

The problem being they're both symptoms of the same problem: American Christians' entitlement & desire to have their beliefs respected by Government at the expense of everyone else's.

We don't need to imagine too hard to envisage the uproar if someone in political office suggested changing the wording on coins to 'In Allah We Trust' - bearing in mind 'Allah' is the Arabic word for God.

I suggest we change the motto to: "Render unto Caesar, that which is Caesar's", don't see a reason a Christian or anyone should or would object if we did that.

 

[The Reverend Bob]

Then I assume you'd have no problem if our money said:

View attachment 29868

. ​

I think you should pay more attention to as to what the left side of that bill is saying.

 

[Stanyon]

Then I assume you'd have no problem if our money said:

View attachment 29868.​

That would be funny but at the end of the day "in so and so we trust" or no "so and so we trust" doesn't matter one bit to me, the denominations and it's buying power does.
Hail Satan!

 

[Subduction Zone]

That's because they didn't poll rural America.

What makes you say that? You appear to be making the mistake of thinking that the land should be polled and not the people

 

[Kenny]

What makes you say that? You appear to be making the mistake of thinking that the land should be polled and not the people

Because polling liberal America doesn't give a good overall view - skewed

 

[Subduction Zone]

Because polling liberal America doesn't give a good overall view - skewed

What makes you think they polled only "liberal America"?