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Only One True Religion
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jewscout
Religious Zionist
Booko said:
it would seem that some have skipped that section
...lest thou lift up thine eyes unto heaven, and when thou seest the sun and the moon and the stars, even all the host of heaven, thou be drawn away and worship them, and serve them, which HaShem thy G-d hath allotted unto all the peoples under the whole heaven.
But you hath HaShem taken and brought forth out of the iron furnace, out of Egypt, to be unto Him a people of inheritance, as ye are this day.
(Deut. 4:20-21)
hanif
Member
1.Those who disbelieve, among the People of the Book and among the Polytheists, were not going to depart (from their ways) until there should come to them Clear Evidence,- 2.Messenger from Allah, rehearsing scriptures kept pure and holy3.Wherein are books right and straight4.Nor did the People of the Book make schisms, until after there came to them Clear Evidence.5.And they have been commanded no more than this: to worship Allah, offering Him sincere devotion, being true (in faith); to establish regular prayer; and to give Zakat; and that is the Religion Right and Straight. http://www.kuran.gen.tr/pop_verse_recommend.php?kid=14&sid=98&ayet_no=6http://www.mobiquran.com/http://www.kuran.gen.tr/pop_sura_arapca.php?kid=14&sid=98&ayet_no=6http://www.mobiquran.com/6.Those who disbelieve, among the People of the Book and among the Polytheists, will be in Hell-Fire, to dwell therein (for aye). They are the worst of creatures. BEYYINE
115.If anyone contends with the Messenger even after guidance has been plainly conveyed to him, and follows a path other than that becoming to men of Faith, We shall leave him in the path he has chosen, and land him in Hell,- what an evil refuge! WOMAN
115.If anyone contends with the Messenger even after guidance has been plainly conveyed to him, and follows a path other than that becoming to men of Faith, We shall leave him in the path he has chosen, and land him in Hell,- what an evil refuge! WOMAN
God must love man and woman as his children equally. That alone must be enough to discount any religion that treats its females as second class, ie Islam.
Or maybe its just all the muslims I know that treat there females as second class that are misrepresenting their religion?
As God has only 'inspired' man to write books for him , could it not be possible that all religions are merely forms of control by man to exploit man and actually drive him away from God in the process?
I know that people can throw in the bibles prophecy rate, which is undoubtably impressive. What s unimpresive though is how any psychic prediction is prophecy in the bible,yet evil masquerading as good in any other religion, belief system etc.
All religions seem to have aspects that sound convincing ANDunconvincing which could just be an indication of mans insatiable desire to feel he knows it all, when in truth all we know is that we dont know enough. (just take a look at the news to see a perfect example of how shallow the depth of mans knowledge truly is)
Or maybe its just all the muslims I know that treat there females as second class that are misrepresenting their religion?
As God has only 'inspired' man to write books for him , could it not be possible that all religions are merely forms of control by man to exploit man and actually drive him away from God in the process?
I know that people can throw in the bibles prophecy rate, which is undoubtably impressive. What s unimpresive though is how any psychic prediction is prophecy in the bible,yet evil masquerading as good in any other religion, belief system etc.
All religions seem to have aspects that sound convincing ANDunconvincing which could just be an indication of mans insatiable desire to feel he knows it all, when in truth all we know is that we dont know enough. (just take a look at the news to see a perfect example of how shallow the depth of mans knowledge truly is)
DakotaGypsy
Active Member
Am I to understand from this post that WOMAN is the refuge of evil?hanif said:
I don't know enough about Islam and I intended to learn by asking here, how else could I learn bar reading the whole scriptures of Islam which I have no intention of doing as I don't believe it to be the correct religion. (I don't believe there is a true religion)
I was hoping that some of the intellectuals from Islamic community could of learnt me a little rather than just chipping in with a weak quote like that.
The muslims I know DO treat there women as second class and I mean every muslim man I know.
Their women are treat as second class, they are kept at home out the way, have no expression of their opinions and don't really have social lives, thats hardly being treat as equal. Or in another sense, they are 2nd class to the muslim men THAT I KNOW.
Now I can only say what I know, maybe you can enlighten me on the how well the female is really thought of? Does she have all the rights that a muslim man has?
I'm all ears and do wish to learn, thats why I'm here.
I hardly think that christians have clean hands either, no way.. but alas, I'm not a christian and don't think they are right either.
Yet despite whatever the christians have done or not done since the early days isn't an excuse for any other religion or belief.
I'm not saying you are using that as an excuse but if you re read your comments you too may find they come across as implying an excuse.
One thing I can credit christians for in debate is they always try and put across what they believe to be right and always in a manner that would suggest they do REALLY believe their way is right and whats more, they still wish you to be ' saved ', despite the fact that you are disagreeing with their theory. You'd do well to learn some of that yourself and explain what you mean rather than throw out a quick and pointless answer.
Anyway......, I'd love to hear your philosophies on the equality of the female in the Islamic religion and I don't mean the Islam that those loonies in Afghanistan used to justify their bullying, merciless beating, rapings and murders of muslim women. I know enough about Islam to know that this wasn't actually the true Islam.
Thanks for your comments
I was hoping that some of the intellectuals from Islamic community could of learnt me a little rather than just chipping in with a weak quote like that.
The muslims I know DO treat there women as second class and I mean every muslim man I know.
Their women are treat as second class, they are kept at home out the way, have no expression of their opinions and don't really have social lives, thats hardly being treat as equal. Or in another sense, they are 2nd class to the muslim men THAT I KNOW.
Now I can only say what I know, maybe you can enlighten me on the how well the female is really thought of? Does she have all the rights that a muslim man has?
I'm all ears and do wish to learn, thats why I'm here.
I hardly think that christians have clean hands either, no way.. but alas, I'm not a christian and don't think they are right either.
Yet despite whatever the christians have done or not done since the early days isn't an excuse for any other religion or belief.
I'm not saying you are using that as an excuse but if you re read your comments you too may find they come across as implying an excuse.
One thing I can credit christians for in debate is they always try and put across what they believe to be right and always in a manner that would suggest they do REALLY believe their way is right and whats more, they still wish you to be ' saved ', despite the fact that you are disagreeing with their theory. You'd do well to learn some of that yourself and explain what you mean rather than throw out a quick and pointless answer.
Anyway......, I'd love to hear your philosophies on the equality of the female in the Islamic religion and I don't mean the Islam that those loonies in Afghanistan used to justify their bullying, merciless beating, rapings and murders of muslim women. I know enough about Islam to know that this wasn't actually the true Islam.
Thanks for your comments
Popeyesays
Well-Known Member
Tiano says:
"I was hoping that some of the intellectuals from Islamic community could of learnt me a little rather than just chipping in with a weak quote like that.
The muslims I know DO treat there women as second class and I mean every muslim man I know.
Their women are treat as second class, they are kept at home out the way, have no expression of their opinions and don't really have social lives, thats hardly being treat as equal. Or in another sense, they are 2nd class to the muslim men THAT I KNOW."
Probably my best Muslim friend in Oklahoma City is Dr. Shakir. He is a cardiologist, and worked in the same hospital as my wife for 15 years, took care of me when I came in with chest pains (that turned out to be a bleeding ulcer). He is an M.D.. His wife is also an M.D. and her specialty is anesthesiology. He doesn't treat her like a second class citizen, if nothing else, she would not stand for it. They have two sons who are practicing Muslims, and they have been raised to treat women properly.
Your p[roblem with Islam and the treatment of women is that you co not understand that most Muslim nations are violating the Qur'an with how they treat women. Women are equal to men in the sight of God, the Qur'an and the Hadith say so.
The cultures that break the laws of Islam are treating women exactly as they treated them BEFORE Muhammad revealed the Qur'an. Its cultural, not religious.
Regards,
Scott
"I was hoping that some of the intellectuals from Islamic community could of learnt me a little rather than just chipping in with a weak quote like that.
The muslims I know DO treat there women as second class and I mean every muslim man I know.
Their women are treat as second class, they are kept at home out the way, have no expression of their opinions and don't really have social lives, thats hardly being treat as equal. Or in another sense, they are 2nd class to the muslim men THAT I KNOW."
Probably my best Muslim friend in Oklahoma City is Dr. Shakir. He is a cardiologist, and worked in the same hospital as my wife for 15 years, took care of me when I came in with chest pains (that turned out to be a bleeding ulcer). He is an M.D.. His wife is also an M.D. and her specialty is anesthesiology. He doesn't treat her like a second class citizen, if nothing else, she would not stand for it. They have two sons who are practicing Muslims, and they have been raised to treat women properly.
Your p[roblem with Islam and the treatment of women is that you co not understand that most Muslim nations are violating the Qur'an with how they treat women. Women are equal to men in the sight of God, the Qur'an and the Hadith say so.
The cultures that break the laws of Islam are treating women exactly as they treated them BEFORE Muhammad revealed the Qur'an. Its cultural, not religious.
Regards,
Scott
BruceDLimber
Well-Known Member
tiano said:
But so long as you remain thus closed-minded and refuse to investigate and learn (including by reading), you are highly unlikely ever to rise above such ignorance.
Sorry to have to be so blunt, but this is hardly a trivial concern!
Willful ignorance is NEVER a virtue!
So I urge you to rethink this attitude and endeavor to do all you can to learn, preferably from multiple sources!
Peace,
Bruce
hanif
Member
TIANO YOU CAN LEARN ISLAM FROM KORAN.BECAUSE THE OTHERS IS NOT TRUSTABLE.
WWW.KURAN.GEN.TR YOU CAN SELECT ENGLISH FROM THIS.
AND WOMAN IS NOT SECOND CLASS IN THE REAL ISLAM.
WWW.KURAN.GEN.TR YOU CAN SELECT ENGLISH FROM THIS.
AND WOMAN IS NOT SECOND CLASS IN THE REAL ISLAM.
NoahideHiker
Religious Headbanger
I think as far as a Jewish/christian perspective it does need to be begged that in the Jewish scriptures there is no one true religion save for the Jews for Judaism. Non-Jews are not commended to follow any religion much less one single religion.
Hanif, thank you for the link, I'll have a peep and sound it out. I don't think my assumptions were incorrect in the sense that, what I see as mistreatment of muslim females IS mistreatment. And, if someone hasn't the same rights as someone else, then they aren't treat equal, which is also be expressed as being treat as second class.
Now its also brought to my attention that although this is a case of mistreatment its a cultural and NOT religious reason. I was led to believe that muslim women didnt have the same rights in mosques either and as thats the holy place for muslims, I took a chunk of my belief that females were treat as second class from this 'knowledge' and the mistreatment of the females.
However I accept I've been misguided and will look into the link you've presented too.
I've certainly not a problem with Islam, I'm never going to take to the street in protest of it but its never come across as being for me and the points I raised in these posts were a major factor in how my opinion has been formed. (Misguidingly believing it to be religious and not cultural)
I went school with many muslim and became friends with many and still see some now, I'm not anti-muslim by any means.
Reading my post again though, I may of left it open to interpretation that my views are anti muslim so I do apologise if any insult has been taken by any followers of Islam.
Thanks again for the link.
(Take note Bruce !
)
Now its also brought to my attention that although this is a case of mistreatment its a cultural and NOT religious reason. I was led to believe that muslim women didnt have the same rights in mosques either and as thats the holy place for muslims, I took a chunk of my belief that females were treat as second class from this 'knowledge' and the mistreatment of the females.
However I accept I've been misguided and will look into the link you've presented too.
I've certainly not a problem with Islam, I'm never going to take to the street in protest of it but its never come across as being for me and the points I raised in these posts were a major factor in how my opinion has been formed. (Misguidingly believing it to be religious and not cultural)
I went school with many muslim and became friends with many and still see some now, I'm not anti-muslim by any means.
Reading my post again though, I may of left it open to interpretation that my views are anti muslim so I do apologise if any insult has been taken by any followers of Islam.
Thanks again for the link.
(Take note Bruce !
)Hanif,
I've only read upto the part were the men have learnt sorcery from the two angels that state they are surely but a trial and I have to admit its been more of an intriguing read than I had originally expected.
I've saved the page so I will take another look in the near future and delve a little deeper. Its not what I expected though I'm not exactly sure what indeed I did expect and its not really to dissimilar from elements of the bible I've heard in the past either if my minds serves me correctly.
It'll be interesting to read further into it and I hope to eventually get round to reading the bible soon too.
Thanks for the link again
I've only read upto the part were the men have learnt sorcery from the two angels that state they are surely but a trial and I have to admit its been more of an intriguing read than I had originally expected.
I've saved the page so I will take another look in the near future and delve a little deeper. Its not what I expected though I'm not exactly sure what indeed I did expect and its not really to dissimilar from elements of the bible I've heard in the past either if my minds serves me correctly.
It'll be interesting to read further into it and I hope to eventually get round to reading the bible soon too.
Thanks for the link again
NoahideHiker
Religious Headbanger
hanif said:
As far as Judaism is concerned Jesus couldn't have been the prophesied Moshiach. Even by the looses terms. Quite the opposite they were commanded to follow only that which there fathers knew and were taught (Davrim 13 & 18). They were not taught to worship a messiah, they were not taught to pray to a messiah and modern christianity falls so far away from traditional Judaism it hardly looks like what they were taught.
Further the Tanach doesn't speak of a One True Religion for non Jews.
white_wolf
Member
We are of one Earth,
We are of one consciousness,
The human experience.
Through eyes like kaliedescopes,
We witness the divine according.
Our creations are beautiful,
But let's not focus only on the beautiful arrangement,
the divine light is here as one.
and no belief,
no fact, nor statement,
can ever divide it in two.
We are of one consciousness,
The human experience.
Through eyes like kaliedescopes,
We witness the divine according.
Our creations are beautiful,
But let's not focus only on the beautiful arrangement,
the divine light is here as one.
and no belief,
no fact, nor statement,
can ever divide it in two.