Our Gods are not symbolic!

[Me Myself]

I am sure there are several levels of truth in the images we use for the Gods. Some are symbolic, some more literal.

I see it as beyond my understanding, but on the bakti form, I love to focus on the attributes. I love to focus on the iconographies, on the several arms, on the ganghes river coming out of the hair, on the snakes around the neck. I love it.

I just assume they are true-er than I can understand and worship.

 

[Shantanu]

The greatest of all gods is the goddess Saraswati, who will never let you down with knowledge if you are a sincere truth seeker paying attention to truth. Similarly, if you sincerely believe that Ganesh will remove your obstacles in life, you should worship Ganesh. If in times of persecution, harassment and criminality you wish to fight back one can worship Shiva as Mahadev to attack the evil that one faces; or Durga as Shakti if one regards Durga as the goddess that annihilates asuras (rakshases).

And I know God exists by the name of Sri Krishna as the Creator and Preserver of the universe. God looks for sincerity of worship and devotion to goodness through drawing one’s inspiration from the spiritual world to guide one on the basis of faith. That is how Hindu polytheism works.

 

[Vinayaka]

I have no problem with people who view the Gods as symbolic. Problems only arise when they preach that that is the only and correct view, and do that too in a condescending manner. It's mostly a free world.

 

[Aupmanyav]

BTW, Vinayaka, how they call the 'bhagwa' color in Tamilnadu"? Safron is not 'bhagwa', it is 'kesar'. Neither it is the color of 'Red Ochre' (the color of the shroud of a Buddhist monk) which is darker (though Red Ochre could also be of 'bhagwa' color, a little lighter). What is the best term in English for it? Buff?

 

[Vinayaka]

Usually just saffron. I've heard ochre too. Both in relation to the sannyasin's garb, but in reality, I've seen it vary. So who knows, and I see no reason why it would matter much. It is fairly tough material, and lasts well.

 

[Aupmanyav]

I think the color was selected because on a wandering monk, it would not seem dirty quickly. Secondly, the 'sanyasin' could color a robe easily whenever he comes accross a patch of 'geru'. The color is also called as 'gerua'. A woman grinding the 'red ochre' for 'geru'. It is economical and is used in many ways - coloring pottery or walls of a hut.

 

[Vinayaka]

Certainly one cannot just go to a basic fabric store, and buy some coloured cloth by some memory guess, and get the right stuff. Just as vibhuthi and other sacred substances have their magic secrets, so too does this cloth. I'm not privy to that information.

 

[Kirran]

Far easier to be a sadhu, and go naked. After all, why the sacred cloth when the world we move through is sacred?

 

[Kalibhakta]

My goddess is no mere symbol, nor is her husband. Lord Shiva and Mother Kali are as real as the cleaning rain and the blasting thunder in a summer rain, as real as the bone chilling cold and pure white blanket of snow, as real as the burning heat and liberating light of the puja fire, as real as the ashen smoke and terrible tongues of flame in the cremation grounds they so love, as real as the scorching Sun and soothing Moon. Every god and goddess a child of god worships is a form of the Lord of the Dance and the Devouring Mother, as avatars or yogins/gunas/dakinis and so on. They have both have a rich symbology , as rich as there are mortals in all planes of existence, but to call them symbols is a grave insult to bhaktis and to our Mother and Father.

 

[Vinayaka]

Far easier to be a sadhu, and go naked. After all, why the sacred cloth when the world we move through is sacred?

Tradition. Only a sannyasin can initiate another sannyasin. At the homa fire during that rite, all other possessions are burned, and the sannyasin has his robes, his begging bowl, and his staff. That's it. Most sadhus undergo this rite also, but yes there are some self-declared sadhus, just as there are self-declared 'enlightened' people. Some sadhus are treated by others as mere beggars, or worse. So who knows. One of the warnings is to never shake a sadhu's hand, as its a scam for robbery. He won't let go while his buddy picks your pocket. Such is life.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Far easier to be a sadhu, and go naked. After all, why the sacred cloth when the world we move through is sacred?

That is what Mahavira of Jains or the Naga Sadhus say. Why try to possess anything? Just go with 'danda' and 'kamandala'. 'Danda' is a staff, 'kamandala' is a dried gourd for taking water for drinking. Nature provides 'kanda' and 'moola'. 'Kanda' is fruits, 'moola' is roots. But then we have destroyed nature and have become many.

 

[Kirran]

Tradition. Only a sannyasin can initiate another sannyasin. At the homa fire during that rite, all other possessions are burned, and the sannyasin has his robes, his begging bowl, and his staff. That's it. Most sadhus undergo this rite also, but yes there are some self-declared sadhus, just as there are self-declared 'enlightened' people. Some sadhus are treated by others as mere beggars, or worse. So who knows. One of the warnings is to never shake a sadhu's hand, as its a scam for robbery. He won't let go while his buddy picks your pocket. Such is life.

It was more of a rhetorical musing than anything. Upon renunciation, I don't know yet if I'll be one of the naked ones I imagine I'll go through some form of initiation, but I could do this after becoming a self-declared sadhu first, much as I believe Muktiayananda of the Kailasha Parampara did.

The reputation of sadhus as beggars and thieves, while I'm sure far from being unfounded, is sad.

That is what Mahavira of Jains or the Naga Sadhus say. Why try to possess anything? Just go with 'danda' and 'kamandala'. 'Danda' is a staff, 'kamandala' is a dried gourd for taking water for drinking. Nature provides 'kanda' and 'moola'. 'Kanda' is fruits, 'moola' is roots. But then we have destroyed nature and have become many.

Tempted by the lifestyle yourself Aup-dada?

 

[Aupmanyav]

Tempted by the lifestyle yourself Aup-dada?

No. Not at all. I will put society before self. I am 'dharma-conscious'. I am not a radical. One's going naked will affect other people. A simple shroud will do. Forests can no more support such a life. So a wallet and money will be necessary. I won't beg (consider the time consumed, though it is good for 'ego management'). So, the money must come from my own resources, which I do have. Were it not for family, I may have done so. Summer in Himalayas, rainy season in desert, winter in Central or Coastal India. What one wants to achieve can be achieved in simple clothes. It can even be achieved while being with the family.

 

[Shantanu]

That is what Mahavira of Jains or the Naga Sadhus say. Why try to possess anything? Just go with 'danda' and 'kamandala'. 'Danda' is a staff, 'kamandala' is a dried gourd for taking water for drinking. Nature provides 'kanda' and 'moola'. 'Kanda' is fruits, 'moola' is roots. But then we have destroyed nature and have become many.

We need to be charitable towards sadhus and jainas to ensure they have the basic necessities just like we need to feed the birds that come to our garden or the cows and dogs in the streets because we have destroyed their natural habitats. They are all an inspiration to how to live harmoniously with Nature instead of the consumerist lifestyle that destroys Nature that we have learnt from somewhere aided and assisted by a tamasic nature.