Paganism - satanic or not?

[Antiochian]

I apologise if I am askinga bout something that has been already discussed on this forum; I am new to the forum and need some advice please.

My daughter, who as raised my me in a good and Christian like way in the christian faith, has converted to and married a Paganist. They openly admit believing in fairies, spells, magic, they have books about voodoo and magic in their rooms, they have a humal skull (hope not real!) in their room, everyday she places "ness ness" messages on her Blackberry BBM status, her husband has no problem in sleeping with other women and she accepts this, they both smoke and drink like mad.

My daughter has herself admitted that she has put spells on people, and what worries me is that they are not truthful in their daily living, but they lie.....

My daughter is the man's 3rd wife, and he is only 30 years old, with a small child with each of his previous wives. Now my daughter has a very close relationship with the previous wife, to the extent that the previous wife even sleeps over at their house..... a very, very bad situation as they all drink and smoke...

Yet, when I confront them, they tell me that, even though they are Pagans, they pray to God, they believe in Jesus Christ, and they read the Bible as we know it.

Please help me, as far as I am concerned, Paganism is affiliated to Satanism in some or other way - or am I barking up the wrong tree?

Thank you for affording me the opportunity to interact with you on this forum!

Paganism or Neopaganism is not satanic. The vast majority of Pagans do not believe in Satan, nor do they worship such a deity. The majority of Pagans are also peaceful, law-abiding citizens who are no worse than your average born again Christian.

Movies and Abrahamic religions have given us a bad rap--they took the Horned God, a nature deity, and turned him into the Devil. But just as most Christians are probably not murderous lunatics like Jim Jones, David Koresh, Warren Jeffs, etc. (all professed followers of God), most Witches, Wiccans, and other types of Pagans don't perform cattle mutilations for kicks, or murder people, or abuse children, all common misconceptions.

I dare you to find any mention of a Pagan suicide bomber in the news. You'll be looking for a long time. That's how 'satanic' and dangerous we are.

That being said, without knowing your family and not wanting to judge, their situation sounds screwed up, but just because they party or have sex with whomever doesn't mean all Pagans do.

 

[Gjallarhorn]

It is the real definition of a satanist.

...dependent on the belief that Satan is evil, or wholly evil.

 

[SCHIZO]

They might well be, but they don't sound like actual Satanists. Are you sure you aren't using the term metaphorically?

No. These Satanists all call themselves Satan. They are the worshippers of evil and the worshippers of Satan. Monsters are what they are. This form of Satanism is very real. They worship evil. Not like other forms of Satanism, these people are predators.

 

[A. T. Henderson]

No. These Satanists all call themselves Satan. They are the worshippers of evil and the worshippers of Satan. Monsters are what they are. This form of Satanism is very real. They worship evil. Not like other forms of Satanism, these people are predators.

I'm not convinced that these people exist outside of your mind.

 

[Me Myself]

I'm not convinced that these people exist outside of your mind.

In my experience one should never underestimate human stupidity. Thus I would believe that kind of satanist could very well exist.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

Please help me, as far as I am concerned, Paganism is affiliated to Satanism in some or other way - or am I barking up the wrong tree?

No, Satan has nothing at all to do with any forms of paganism. Satan is an aspect of the Abrahamic religions and that is where he stays. That doesn't mean there is no evil in paganism, just that it goes by other names. To be honest your daughter and her new family sound much more like Fuzzy Bunnies than actual Pagans. FBs are wannabies who play at being witches and warlocks but don't actually research and follow the religion of paganism. The fact that they are polyamorous could mean they are following a Celtic form of paganism or the man could just be leading them on so he can more than one wife. Neither the paganism nor the polyamory are themselves a problem, as long as the relationships are happy and loving.

 

[no-body]

This is what happens when you shove your beliefs down your kids throats and the brainwashing doesn't take.

 

[Proffie]

OK, then let me unpack further:

1. They have a small black dog named Lucifer;
2. They had a black cat, who mysteriously vanished. This cat was with me for 11 years, they wanted it, and after 2 months it was gone...
3. They have admitted to me that they engage in multiple partners sex orgies - no problem to them to have sex with more than one partner at the same time!
4. The previous wife is part of these orgies at times;
5. They don't just drink - they go overboard!! And he is 30 and she 24.....
6. They openly admit using books on witchcraft to cast bad spells, spells intended to harm people, for revenge purposes.
7. I have been told by both of them that if I cannot accept how they live their lives, then get out of their lives.....

?????

I rest my case; suffice to say that it most definitely is not a Chistian doctrine that they are following!

MY main concern is that my daughter wants to desperately fall pregnant.......that would be disastrous if one looks at how they are living at the moment.

 

[Proffie]

Is it a "very bad' situation that they all drink and smoke,
because you feel drinking and smoking is altogether bad?

Or is it a very bad situation because they are regularly getting so intoxicated
that they are a clear danger to themselves and any of the children
who may be around.

If you don't mind my saying so,
it seems to me that you are worried about the wrong things,
and as well,
you are connecting things
for which there can be no assumed causal relation.

ex, there are also many christians who drink and smoke,
and do so to excess.
But is christianity a direct cause?
Maybe yes, maybe no.
As well there are many pagans and yes... even... satanists...
who do not drink and smoke.
Is their abstainance a direct result of their 'religion'?
Maybe yes, maybe no.

sooooo.... best to pinpoint the actual problem/s.

Hint: Perhaps you've got a health issue.
Pretty sure you don't have a religious one.

OK, then let me unpack further:

1. They have a small black dog named Lucifer;
2. They had a black cat, who mysteriously vanished. This cat was with me for 11 years, they wanted it, and after 2 months it was gone...
3. They have admitted to me that they engage in multiple partners sex orgies - no problem to them to have sex with more than one partner at the same time!
4. The previous wife is part of these orgies at times;
5. They don't just drink - they go overboard!! And he is 30 and she 24.....
6. They openly admit using books on witchcraft to cast bad spells, spells intended to harm people, for revenge purposes.
7. I have been told by both of them that if I cannot accept how they live their lives, then get out of their lives.....

?????

I rest my case; suffice to say that it most definitely is not a Chistian doctrine that they are following!

MY main concern is that my daughter wants to desperately fall pregnant.......that would be disastrous if one looks at how they are living at the moment.

 

[blackout]

OK, then let me unpack further:

1. They have a small black dog named Lucifer;
2. They had a black cat, who mysteriously vanished. This cat was with me for 11 years, they wanted it, and after 2 months it was gone...
3. They have admitted to me that they engage in multiple partners sex orgies - no problem to them to have sex with more than one partner at the same time!
4. The previous wife is part of these orgies at times;
5. They don't just drink - they go overboard!! And he is 30 and she 24.....
6. They openly admit using books on witchcraft to cast bad spells, spells intended to harm people, for revenge purposes.
7. I have been told by both of them that if I cannot accept how they live their lives, then get out of their lives.....

?????

I rest my case; suffice to say that it most definitely is not a Chistian doctrine that they are following!

MY main concern is that my daughter wants to desperately fall pregnant.......that would be disastrous if one looks at how they are living at the moment.

1. So? Would you rather they named the dog Jesus?
2. And......?
3. Hopefully they use condoms,
and are selective about their additional partners.
4. So? Aparantely they get along.
At least they're not fighting.
5.They may be alchoholics.
Or maybe they just like to "party" on Friday nights.
I wouldn't know.
6. Are there many people who have wronged them
that they need to take revenge on?
Do they make enemies easily?
Perhaps they have insecurity or anger issues?
Or maybe someone really did screw them,
or 'ask for it' so to speak.
Do you think the curses actually work?
Or are you mainly concerned that they would feel they deserve retribution of some kind.
7. Adults basically have two or three choices.
A. Get along.
B. Don't get along.
C. Go their own ways.

I'm thinkin' A or C are best.
B can be extremely unpleasant.

Could she go 9 months without drinking
for the sake of her pregnancy?
That would be pretty important.
Do they have stable incomes?
Is she sure she has no STD's?
Some can transfer to the fetus.

These seem like reasonable concerns.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

OK, then let me unpack further:

1. They have a small black dog named Lucifer;
2. They had a black cat, who mysteriously vanished. This cat was with me for 11 years, they wanted it, and after 2 months it was gone...
3. They have admitted to me that they engage in multiple partners sex orgies - no problem to them to have sex with more than one partner at the same time!
4. The previous wife is part of these orgies at times;
5. They don't just drink - they go overboard!! And he is 30 and she 24.....
6. They openly admit using books on witchcraft to cast bad spells, spells intended to harm people, for revenge purposes.
7. I have been told by both of them that if I cannot accept how they live their lives, then get out of their lives.....

?????

I rest my case; suffice to say that it most definitely is not a Chistian doctrine that they are following!

MY main concern is that my daughter wants to desperately fall pregnant.......that would be disastrous if one looks at how they are living at the moment.

What exactly are you resting your case on? Sounds like they are rebeling against Christianity and going for the shock and awe aspect of witchcraft without actually following the religious aspects of it. Their actions are designed to upset you so don't let it. If you can't handle their lifestyle then separate yourself from them, let them live their lives and you live yours. Maybe some time apart will mellow both of you out.

 

[Breathe]

No, satanism is satanism and paganism is paganism.

This.

What exactly are you resting your case on? Sounds like they are rebeling against Christianity and going for the shock and awe aspect of witchcraft without actually following the religious aspects of it. Their actions are designed to upset you so don't let it. If you can't handle their lifestyle then separate yourself from them, let them live their lives and you live yours. Maybe some time apart will mellow both of you out.

And this.


Why didn't I see this thread earlier!

 

[Reverend Rick]

Geeze, where to begin....

Yes Satanists are Pagan, but not all Pagans are Satanists.

Many Christian's believe what is not of God must be of the Devil.

I have never seen a Christian/ Pagan debate go well, so it would be best to agree to disagree.

Paganism is a broad tent for many beliefs so it is unfair to try and label any Pagan with any paticular commonality.

 

[no-body]

What exactly are you resting your case on? Sounds like they are rebeling against Christianity and going for the shock and awe aspect of witchcraft without actually following the religious aspects of it. Their actions are designed to upset you so don't let it. If you can't handle their lifestyle then separate yourself from them, let them live their lives and you live yours. Maybe some time apart will mellow both of you out.

Yes, this.

When my sister rebelled and fell into "wicca" my mom did the same thing, it was like a pair of blinders on she blamed all the symptoms of the disease and couldn't see how it was her need to constantly thrust her ideas and beliefs at my sister that caused her to run towards those "evil" things as a way to act out in the first place.

This person wants validation that they aren't going to get here. It's a lot easier to blame it all on Satan than try to become a better more humane parent/human being. Maybe they should post in the Christian DIR.

 

[Draka]

if part of the religion is casting of spells and witchcraft, then that is a form of satanic occultist practices.

witchcraft is the same as sorcery

its satanic because it calls on the power of the demons in casting spells. demonic/satanic is the same thing...any religion that calls on the power of satan to accomplish its tasks is 'satanic'.... it not 'mother nature' pagans are worshiping.

Do you have any idea how blatantly wrong and insulting that is? Perhaps you should not comment upon that which you so obviously know nothing about.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

Yes Satanists are Pagan, but not all Pagans are Satanists.

Satanists are not pagan. Fundamentalist Christians believe following a pagan religion is falling into Satan's trap as all other religions are false and Satan inspired. However, true Satanists know they are not Pagans and true Pagans know they are not Satanists. Satan is an aspect of the Abrahamic religions only. I would even say that Satanism is one of the Abrahamic religions although Neo-Satanists today have separated themselves somewhat from their Abrahamic roots.

 

[Draka]

Geeze, where to begin....

Yes Satanists are Pagan, but not all Pagans are Satanists.

Many Christian's believe what is not of God must be of the Devil.

I have never seen a Christian/ Pagan debate go well, so it would be best to agree to disagree.

Paganism is a broad tent for many beliefs so it is unfair to try and label any Pagan with any paticular commonality.

Um, technically, if they are actually worshiping the Abrahamic entity of "Satan", then they are not Pagans, they are Abrahamics. For "Satan" falls under that mythology and pantheon and no other.

 

[Draka]

Satanists are not pagan. Fundamentalist Christians believe following a pagan religion is falling into Satan's trap as all other religions are false and Satan inspired. However, true Satanists know they are not Pagans and true Pagans know they are not Satanists. Satan is an aspect of the Abrahamic religions only. I would even say that Satanism is one of the Abrahamic religions although Neo-Satanists today have separated themselves somewhat from their Abrahamic roots.

Exactly. :yes::clap

 

[Reverend Rick]

Um, technically, if they are actually worshiping the Abrahamic entity of "Satan", then they are not Pagans, they are Abrahamics. For "Satan" falls under that mythology and pantheon and no other.

I know many Satanists who would disagree with you. I used to moderate a Pagan website and was once a Pagan myself.

They joined the forum and considered themselves Pagan.

So, how about Luciferian? Pagan or not?

 

[Reverend Rick]

Here is an example:

Shyanekh Offline
Religion: Dark Pagan/Demonolater
Title:Devil's Advocate