Paris terrorists not Practicing Muslims at all

[Gharib]

Better for him if he chose another writer.

I think he didn't have any evidence and when I asked for it he must have searched on Google for Non-Muslim historians about Islamic history without knowing what he was going to post.

 

[Glaurung]

You my friend don't seem to know anything about Islam or the history of that time period. Nada, nothing at all. And did I say that video was pathetic if that was your evidence.

Frankly, that means nothing coming from a person who thinks the spread of Islam was a result of peaceful dialogue with the odd unfortunate "defensive" war. You're just another mind hopelessly trapped in the self imposed chains of a self-serving religious narrative.

All you have is your absurd assertions. Which you demand be taken at face-value. You certainly don't have an agenda to sell.

 

[MARCELLO]

Ymir, although the video Tlaloc posted was pathetic, if you look at how the Islamic empire spread, which is the only correct thing in that video, it was towards the Empires that threatened Islam with war. They fought Persia (the land east of the Arabian peninsula), the fought the Romans (the land north and north west, ie south western Asia (Turkey) and southern Europe) and they fought the a few other empires in Africa with whom Muslims had fought before due to a messenger which our Prophet sent to them being murdered as a result the battle of Mutah happened.

So you mean Spain too? You are being funny.

 

[Gharib]

Frankly, that means nothing coming from a person who thinks the spread of Islam was a result of peaceful dialogue with the odd unfortunate "defensive" war. You're just another mind hopelessly trapped in the self imposed chains of a self-serving religious narrative.

All you have is your absurd assertions. Which you demand be taken at face-value. You certainly don't have an agenda to sell.

If that's all you had then forgive me for saying I am not impressed. For a guy who almost spilled his coffee by reading my 'absurd' statement, you sure didn't have anything to contribute other than show how little you know. Thanks, I guess.

 

[Gharib]

So you mean Spain too? You are being funny.

This is the Roman empire:

 

[Lyndon]

That's 600 years before Mohammad, wasn't the Roman Empire broken up by then??

 

[Gharib]

That's 600 years before Mohammad, wasn't the Roman Empire broken up by then??

Quite right, I didn't see the dates. Mesopotamia I think was under Persian rule by that time. And it would have had a little less land. I need to search a little more. Thanks for pointing it out.

 

[Shusha]

What do you think the chances are that if ISIS wins for itself a Caliphate, that they will claim that they were only fighting aggressors in self-defence and liberating people from the chains of the West?

 

[FearGod]

The region was occupied by the Byzantine empire east and west before the Islamic world had born.

 

[Gharib]

What do you think the chances are that if ISIS wins for itself a Caliphate, that they will claim that they were only fighting aggressors in self-defence and liberating people from the chains of the West?

You are aware that you're equating ISIS with Islam right?

What are the laws of ISIS for civilians and non-combatants and what are those of Islam?

 

[Gharib]

The region was occupied by the Byzantine empire east and west before the Islamic world had born.

Thanks for the picture. I can also see a little yellow on Spain. I think Spiny Norman questioned whether Spain was under their rule.

 

[FearGod]

What do you think the chances are that if ISIS wins for itself a Caliphate, that they will claim that they were only fighting aggressors in self-defence and liberating people from the chains of the West?

They won't win if they aren't, it's God plans and not humans plans,IOW if the ISIS reached Roma then
it'll be the right caliphate, the only thing that we know is that it'll start from Syria.

 

[FearGod]

Thanks for the picture. I can also see a little yellow on Spain. I think Spiny Norman questioned whether Spain was under their rule.

It seems that they promised to follow them every where in that era and they did.

 

[YmirGF]

He's already said enough with the following quotes from Wikipedia:

Lewis presents some of his conclusions about Islamic culture, Shari'a law, jihad, and the modern day phenomenon of terrorism in his text, Islam: The Religion and the People.[40]He writes of jihad as a distinct "religious obligation", but suggests that "it is a pity" that people engaging in terrorist activities are not more aware of their own religion:

Muslim fighters are commanded not to kill women, children, or the aged unless they attack first; not to torture or otherwise ill-treat prisoners; to give fair warning of the opening of hostilities or their resumption after a truce; and to honor agreements. ... At no time did the classical jurists offer any approval or legitimacy to what we nowadays call terrorism. Nor indeed is there any evidence of the use of terrorism as it is practiced nowadays."[41]

In Lewis' view, the "by now widespread terrorism practice of suicide bombing is a development of the 20th century" with "no antecedents in Islamic history, and no justification in terms of Islamic theology, law, or tradition."[42] He further comments that "the fanatical warrior offering his victims the choice of the Koran or the sword is not only untrue, it is impossible" and that "generally speaking, Muslim tolerance of unbelievers was far better than anything available in Christendom, until the rise of secularism in the 17th century."

Hehe. Then you will agree that Prof. Lewis is a most excellent source. Wonderful. You really might want to read what else he has had to say over the last 60 years. But brace yourself, in his often scathing analysis he will often heap praise on some Muslim leaders. He is under no illusion that Islam was spread with peace, love and beards.

 

[YmirGF]

Ymir, although the video Tlaloc posted was pathetic, if you look at how the Islamic empire spread, which is the only correct thing in that video, it was towards the Empires that threatened Islam with war. They fought Persia (the land east of the Arabian peninsula), the fought the Romans (the land north and north west, ie south western Asia (Turkey) and southern Europe) and they fought the a few other empires in Africa with whom Muslims had fought before due to a messenger which our Prophet sent to them being murdered as a result the battle of Mutah happened.

Don't blame the video on me. You'll have to try much harder than that, besides, you are the one claiming things were done defensively. The onus is on you to prove your claims.

 

[YmirGF]

I think he didn't have any evidence and when I asked for it he must have searched on Google for Non-Muslim historians about Islamic history without knowing what he was going to post.

Actually, you are in for a few surprises. I've read at least 10 of his books. He is really a marvel and if you actually begin to read what he has to say you might actually learn something instead of vapidly relying on Wikipedia to give you what you perceive as being a quick easy victory. Get back to me in a few months... if you are serious...

 

[FearGod]

Actually, you are in for a few surprises. I've read at least 10 of his books. He is really a marvel and if you actually begin to read what he has to say you might actually learn something instead of vapidly relying on Wikipedia to give you what you perceive as being a quick easy victory. Get back to me in a few months... if you are serious...

Tell us one of the things that he did say.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

What do you think the chances are that if ISIS wins for itself a Caliphate, that they will claim that they were only fighting aggressors in self-defence and liberating people from the chains of the West?

They do talk about fighting the "crusaders" quite a lot.

 

[Shusha]

You are aware that you're equating ISIS with Islam right?

What are the laws of ISIS for civilians and non-combatants and what are those of Islam?

I am recognizing that Islam is the source of the ideology of ISIS. This in no way implies that ISIS is the correct or only interpretation of the worldview and scriptures of Islam.
But I am also recognizing what you seem to have said, which is: it is permissible or morally acceptable, within normative Islam, to conduct a war in defense of Islam or to liberate people from oppressors.

 

[psychoslice]

They do talk about fighting the "crusaders" quite a lot.

I think that's exactly what they do teach, but all we hear is watered down crap.