Payment for the border wall

[fantome profane]

So what is the real purpose of a wall that will cost millions of dollars and will not stop a single person from crossing the border?

The wall will cost billions, not millions

 

[Mister Emu]

Dang, that's pretty blunt. American Exceptionalism at it's finest?

Blunt, but reality.

How would you justify forcing a foreign government to pay for our security infrastructure anyway?

When they aid in the process of violating our laws they have an obligation to be met.

Sure they do.

Sure they do, they've said "no" on multiple occasions now.

They don't though. We can put a wall tax on remittances or a wall tariff until it's paid for; they have no say. Furthermore, they aren't in a situation to get into economic retaliation.

 

[fantome profane]

They don't though. We can put a wall tax on remittances or a wall tariff until it's paid for; they have no say. Furthermore, they aren't in a situation to get into economic retaliation.

Can you explain to me the legal theory under which the government can just claim these remittances?

 

[esmith]

How exactly is this proposed wall going to stop a group of people using tunnels?

Predator drones flying along the border

 

[McBell]

Predator drones flying along the border

Drones or moles?

 

[Quetzal]

Drones or moles?

You and @esmith are both wrong! War Gophers!

 

[fantome profane]

Predator drones flying along the border

Billions to build the wall, billions to maintain the wall, billions to defend the wall.

Fantastic, it is not like the U.S. is in debt or anything.

 

[Mister Emu]

Drones or moles?

 

[esmith]

You and @esmith are both wrong! War Gophers!

Nah gotta be war badgers

Accompanied by the chemical warfare unit

 

[columbus]

When they aid in the process of violating our laws they have an obligation to be met.

Why?
It's USA citizens causing the problems. We hire illegal immigrants and buy drugs from Mexican people. How does that put any onus on Mexico?
Why don't we start prosecuting USA employers who hire them instead of punishing poor folks that we entice here with jobs?
Tom

 

[Shadow Wolf]

They don't have a say.

Yeah they do. It's not their wall, they aren't commissioning it, they aren't asking for it, there is no way to make them pay for it. They are not going to pay for it. Period.

When they aid in the process of violating our laws they have an obligation to be met.

How is the Mexican government "aiding int he process of violation our laws?" And if you're going to go by that standard, America owes many places, including Mexico, a crap ton of money.

 

[tytlyf]

They'll believe everything comrade Trump tells them. In 6 months he'll give another reason to trust him on a different wall decision.

 

[Mister Emu]

Can you explain to me the legal theory under which the government can just claim these remittances?

Can you explain the legal theory that governments can't tax money leaving the country? Heck, Oklahoma already has a remittance tax.

Why?

Because they aiding criminal migrants in traveling to America. I'm actually not in full favor of Mexico paying for the entirety of the wall, rather that is the beginning point in negotiations.

It's USA citizens causing the problems.

It is both. We do need to have strict sanctions and easy nation-wide worker eligibility verification.

Yeah they do. It's not their wall, they aren't commissioning it, they aren't asking for it, there is no way to make them pay for it. They are not going to pay for it. Period.

Yes, we can make them pay for it. No, there is nothing they can do about it. Tax remittances to Mexico at 10% at it is payed for in 8 years and, again, Mexico can do nothing to stop that from happening.

How is the Mexican government "aiding int he process of violation our laws?"

By doing things like giving illegal migrants coming into Mexico from Guatemala travel passes to facilitate their movement to America, having government funded groups point the way and provide care for immigrants that travel through Mexico, to pay legal fees for illegal immigrants to go through programs like DACA. Mexico doesn't want central Americans stuck in Mexico so they shuffle them along to America and they do want Mexican immigrants in America so they can leech off of our economy.

And if you're going to go by that standard, America owes many places, including Mexico, a crap ton of money.

It's good to be king.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Do you think the Mexican government will pay for it later?

From former Mexican President Vincente Fox:

Trump may ask whoever he wants, but still neither myself nor Mexico are going to pay for his racist monument. Another promise he can't keep.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/817212404144766979

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Can you explain the legal theory that governments can't tax money leaving the country? Heck, Oklahoma already has a remittance tax.

NAFTA.

Unilaterally slapping tarrifs on other NAFTA signatories is a good way to end up in court, with a judgement against your country in the billions of dollars.

Fun fact: the US ended up paying $4 billion to Canada in repayment of improper tarrifs over a dispute about a decade ago: Canada–United States softwood lumber dispute - Wikipedia

 

[Watchmen]

As expected. The Trump haters are completely unimaginative.

 

[McBell]

As expected. The Trump haters are completely unimaginative.

So now people are supposed to imagine the wall is not a colossal waste of time and money?

 

[Mister_T]

They don't though. We can put a wall tax on remittances or a wall tariff until it's paid for; they have no say. Furthermore, they aren't in a situation to get into economic retaliation.

Theorizing and what will actually happen in reality/is legally allowed are two different things. Maybe you have not been reading what has been happening in Mexico lately with the cartels, but I'm pretty sure no one in charge there (cartels or otherwise) are actually worried any sort of economic retaliation and haven't been for a while.

This is all besides the point though that this yet another example of Trump pulling a fast one on his supporters...not that I feel sorry for them in the least.

 

[Watchmen]

So now people are supposed to imagine the wall is not a colossal waste of time and money?

Oh, it very well might be. What's unimaginative is that they can't understand there may be alternative ways to get Mexico to pay for the wall other than by outright payment up front. How about trade embargoes, using confiscated drug money, other fees, penalties etc.

 

[Quetzal]

What's unimaginative is that they can't understand there may be alternative ways to get Mexico to pay for the wall other than by outright payment up front. How about trade embargoes, using confiscated drug money, other fees, penalties etc.

All of which involve money, just in another form. How can Trump supporters be so unimaginative to not understand that?