Perspective: How to Prevent another San Bernardino Shooting

[Lyndon]

While you are at it you should ban the Old Testament and Mosaic law which is just as offensive.

 

[Crypto2015]

While you are at it you should ban the Old Testament and Mosaic law which is just as offensive.

There is a big difference between being offensive, which is not illegal, and inciting people to commit violence, which is illegal. The Old Testament does not incite people to violence because it is only meant to be applied by people living in the territory of Israel. Furthermore, the Old Testament does not instruct people to wage war on non-Jews. Finally, the Mosaic Law is not meant to be followed by Christians. This is explicitly stated in the New Testament. So, good luck in your future attempts at protecting an ideology (Sharia Law) that (1) considers women to be lower than men, (2) encourages people to mutilate the genitals of women, (3) considers non-Muslims to be animals, (3) instructs men to beat their wives, (4) does not recognize people's right to freedom of expression, etc.

 

[Lyndon]

Bible says exactly the same things, except for genital mutilation which isn't in the Koran or sharia law, its African custom practiced by Christians and Muslims in Africa,

 

[Crypto2015]

Bible says exactly the same things, except for genital mutilation which isn't in the Koran or sharia law, its African custom practiced by Christians and Muslims in Africa,

You have no idea of what you are talking about. Show me where does the Bible say that we should wage war on non-Jews just because they are non-Jews or that we should wage war on non-Christians just because they are non-Christians. I can show you where the Qur'an says that Muslims should wage war on non-Muslims just because they are non-Muslims. regarding female genital mutilation, you are utterly and completely wrong. Female genital mutilation is part of Sharia Law. The "Reliance of the Traveler" a Safi'i manual of Islamic Jurisprudence states the following:

Circumcision is obligatory (for every male and female) by cutting off the piece of skin on the glans of the penis of the male, but circumcision of the female is by cutting out the clitoris (this is called HufaaD).

 

[Revoltingest]

.....shutting down religious schools and intergrating kids into secular public schools is a good idea and stops the kind of segregation that can lead to conflict.

I don't think so.
I recently heard an interview with a young Muslim gal who didn't get much direction from her Muslim parents.
So she turned to the internet, & became more radicalized.
It might be much better to let religious schools continue for this reason, but regulate what is taught.
Schooling is already subject to regulation, & it's both legal & reasonable to prohibit advocacy of illegal acts.

 

[Laika]

I don't think so.
I recently heard an interview with a young Muslim gal who didn't get much direction from her Muslim parents.
So she turned to the internet, & became more radicalized.
It might be much better to let religious schools continue for this reason, but regulate what is taught.
Schooling is already subject to regulation, & it's both legal & reasonable to prohibit advocacy of illegal acts.

radicalisation is a complex process and thereadmittedly is no one single trigger. I think not seeing the people your supposed to hate and demonise in extremist ideologies however makes it easier. your more open to believing myths about other people when you don't have freinds of different beliefs and backgrounds.

 

[Revoltingest]

radicalisation is a complex process and thereadmittedly is no one single trigger. I think not seeing the people your supposed to hate and demonise in extremist ideologies however makes it easier. your more open to believing myths about other people when you don't have freinds of different beliefs and backgrounds.

I agree with this.
So the trick is to see that their religious education is monitored, while ensuring socialization with others.
Difficult task, eh?

 

[Laika]

I agree with this.
So the trick is to see that their religious education is monitored, while ensuring socialization with others.
Difficult task, eh?

there is only so much you can do, but creating an environment where there is openness to ideas does make it harder to assert superiority over other people. they aren't abstract when they are around you and that can be enough to get people to re-think the easy "solutions" presented by extreme ideas. it is easy to be extreme when you can't put a face to an "enemy" group. thats sort of what I'm getting at. the recognition of complexity makes people generally more moderate.

 

[Revoltingest]

there is only so much you can do, but creating an environment where there is openness to ideas does make it harder to assert superiority over other people. they aren't abstract when they are around you and that can be enough to get people to re-think the easy "solutions" presented by extreme ideas. it is easy to be extreme when you can't put a face to an "enemy" group. thats sort of what I'm getting at. the recognition of complexity makes people generally more moderate.

I see 2 paths regarding ideas.....
1) Illegalize the calls for illegal acts.
2) We can't eliminate access to wrongful ideas, but we can present peaceful alternatives, thereby preventing the echo chamber effect.

 

[Crypto2015]

How can you tackle radicalization without even addressing the ideology behind it?

 

[Crypto2015]

I see 2 paths regarding ideas.....
1) Illegalize the calls for illegal acts.
2) We can't eliminate access to wrongful ideas, but we can present peaceful alternatives, thereby preventing the echo chamber effect.

Incitement to hatred and subversion are already illegal almost everywhere in the western world.

 

[Lyndon]

You have no idea of what you are talking about. Show me where does the Bible say that we should wage war on non-Jews just because they are non-Jews or that we should wage war on non-Christians just because they are non-Christians. I can show you where the Qur'an says that Muslims should wage war on non-Muslims just because they are non-Muslims. regarding female genital mutilation, you are utterly and completely wrong. Female genital mutilation is part of Sharia Law. The "Reliance of the Traveler" a Safi'i manual of Islamic Jurisprudence states the following:

Circumcision is obligatory (for every male and female) by cutting off the piece of skin on the glans of the penis of the male, but circumcision of the female is by cutting out the clitoris (this is called HufaaD).

Your full of it, and your expressed intent just creates distrust and hatred for no good reason. You should be ashamed of yourself as a Christian.

 

[Crypto2015]

Your full of it, and your expressed intent just creates distrust and hatred for no good reason. You should be ashamed of yourself as a Christian.

Being a Christian was never about ignoring the evil in the world, but about denouncing it. How am I full of it? In what of the things I said was I wrong? By the way,I would like to separate Sharia Law from Islam precisely because I don't want the Muslims to be persecuted or hurt in any way. How do you think this conflict is going to end if NOTHING is done to tackle the ideology behind Islamic terrorism? You seem to think that you are defending the Muslims, when in fact you are digging their grave.

 

[Lyndon]

Yes, because the things you said are wrong.

 

[Crypto2015]

Yes, because the things you said are wrong.

Come on, man. You can't even point out what was wrong in what I said.

 

[Lyndon]

As I said you are wrong about female genital mutilation, it is not seen in the Middle East, it is an African cultural phenomenon, not an Islamic one. You also seem to know nothing about Sharia Law, Dawud pointed that out and you accused HIM of being ignorant about Islam. Your information sources are heavily biased.

 

[Crypto2015]

As I said you are wrong about female genital mutilation, it is not seen in the Middle East, it is an African cultural phenomenon, not an Islamic one. You also seem to know nothing about Sharia Law, Dawud pointed that out and you accused HIM of being ignorant about Islam. Your information sources are heavily biased.

It is true that female genital mutilation is not exclusively Islamic. However, female genital mutilation is regarded either as mandatory or as recommendable but all schools of Islamic jurisprudence. According to the Safi'i school of jurisprudence, which is one of the most important and influential schools of jurisprudence, female genital mutilation is mandatory. I even quoted a passage to prove it. That's why I said that Sharia law must be banned. The Islamic schools of jurisprudence teach things that are completely at odds with any free society. Islamic law (i.e., Sharia law) is utterly incompatible with all free societies. Furthermore, by banning Sharia Law, terrorism would decrease at least by 50%.

 

[Lyndon]

Again you're just spreading lies and hatred, none of this is true, do some real research before you spout off.

 

[McBell]

Again you're just spreading lies and hatred, none of this is true, do some real research before you spout off.

Don't get me wrong, I am not on either side of this contention.
However, you have not presented anything other than you shaking your head saying "you are wrong".
Now is the time to show he is wrong.
Until you do......

 

[Lyndon]

He hasn't presented anything to demonstrate he is right, so until then........