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"Pornography Offends the Holy Ghost"

What do you think of the video?

  • Right on point

    Votes: 8 34.8%
  • Fairly good

    Votes: 1 4.3%
  • Somewhat misleading

    Votes: 2 8.7%
  • Wholly alarmist

    Votes: 9 39.1%
  • A solution in search of a problem

    Votes: 3 13.0%

  • Total voters
    23

Skwim

Veteran Member
Just a few comments:
  • Porn seems to be an escape mechanism, an alternative to genuine human relationships.
And for some the only means to meet their sexual needs.

It is more addictive than drugs, many start out with what is "harmless" and are led into darker and darker pieces of it by the end.
Perhaps, but this would take evidence to be convincing. And not all addiction is equal. Some addictions can be extremely harmful, even deadly, and other addictions not so much at all.

It breeds violence, sex trafficking, degradation - back to the first point, the alternative to genuine human relationships leads not just to isolation, but to actual violence and abuse.
Some of it can. And back to your first point: For some it's the only outlet available, and never comes with violence or abuse.

Your overreaching generalization and sweeping condemnation is noted.
Here is a website - non-religious, non-political, peer-reviewed research based website:

Home - Fight the New Drug
Yeah, FTND was brought many posts ago, and dealt with.

Real, genuine relationships are healthy... that virtual/fake/pretend stuff? it is not healthy.
And generalizations such as this are unconvincing, and do nothing for your veracity. Might want to rethink your approach here.

.
 

idea

Question Everything
....If you are lucky enough to find a partner .... Don

I am not sure that it comes down to "luck", with 8 billion people on this earth there is quite a few to choose from. We are all imperfect humans of course, all of us are hard to live with and stay with - I think many relationships, especially those between people who are close enough to spend large parts of their lives together - it takes a lot of self-control, humility, anger management, and motivation to make it work... If you do not use porn, that physical part can be part of the motivation to help work things out...

Sex needs to be placed in its proper perspective.

1. No one has ever died from lack of sex. It is not like food, or air, no one has to have it. I think some justify porn use by saying they "have" to have it, that they will die etc. without it, and that is a lie. No one has ever died from lack of sex. Talk to some nuns, monks, etc., it is possible to live without it.

2. Sex is a very powerful tool that can encourage us to form meaningful relationships with one another if used correctly. It is a huge reward given to those who change themselves into someone desirable - and I am not talking about just physically desirable, but making themselves into someone who is kind/safe/caring/empathetic/listens/loves - making yourself into someone others want to be with and be around.

3. Sex based on lust alone is a very dangerous thing. It negates so much of what the more meaningful relationships are based on - attraction to character, security, support, loyalty - our worth is so much more than what lust entails. Consider family members - mother, father, brother, sister - think of someone who is special to you... how you want them to be treated and seen, and how you want yourself to be treated and seen.

Those who use porn are basically telling everyone else "this computer screen is more important to me than you are". That they are not interested in putting the time, effort, and self-control needed into forming a real relationship with anyone...

For those who struggle with this addiction - and be honest with yourself - it is a physical addiction worse than drugs - a support group is probably going to be needed...
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
I am not sure that it comes down to "luck", with 8 billion people on this earth there is quite a few to choose from. We are all imperfect humans of course, all of us are hard to live with and stay with - I think many relationships, especially those between people who are close enough to spend large parts of their lives together - it takes a lot of self-control, humility, anger management, and motivation to make it work... If you do not use porn, that physical part can be part of the motivation to help work things out...

Sex needs to be placed in its proper perspective.

1. No one has ever died from lack of sex. It is not like food, or air, no one has to have it. I think some justify porn use by saying they "have" to have it, that they will die etc. without it, and that is a lie. No one has ever died from lack of sex. Talk to some nuns, monks, etc., it is possible to live without it.

2. Sex is a very powerful tool that can encourage us to form meaningful relationships with one another if used correctly. It is a huge reward given to those who change themselves into someone desirable - and I am not talking about just physically desirable, but making themselves into someone who is kind/safe/caring/empathetic/listens/loves - making yourself into someone others want to be with and be around.

3. Sex based on lust alone is a very dangerous thing. It negates so much of what the more meaningful relationships are based on - attraction to character, security, support, loyalty - our worth is so much more than what lust entails. Consider family members - mother, father, brother, sister - think of someone who is special to you... how you want them to be treated and seen, and how you want yourself to be treated and seen.

Those who use porn are basically telling everyone else "this computer screen is more important to me than you are". That they are not interested in putting the time, effort, and self-control needed into forming a real relationship with anyone...

For those who struggle with this addiction - and be honest with yourself - it is a physical addiction worse than drugs - a support group is probably going to be needed...


Actually you are wrong. A lack of sex results in higher prostate cancer rates for men:

"As part of Harvard’s Health Professionals Follow-up Study, 29,342 men between the ages of 46 and 81 reported their average number of ejaculations per month in young adulthood (ages 20–29), in mid-life (ages 40–49), and in the most recent year. Ejaculations included sexual intercourse, nocturnal emissions, and masturbation. Study participants also provided comprehensive health and lifestyle data every two years from 1992 to 2000. The scientists found that men who ejaculated 21 or more times a month enjoyed a 33% lower risk of prostate cancer compared with men who reported four to seven ejaculations a month throughout their lifetimes."

Does frequent ejaculation help ward off prostate cancer? - Harvard Prostate Knowledge

The rest of your post merely appears to be personal bias.
 

idea

Question Everything
And for some the only means to meet their sexual needs.
.

Skwim, no one has ever died because they went without sex. You do not "need" sex like you need food, water, and air.

Is there anyone on here who is celibate that can talk about what life without sex is like?

Be honest about what "real love" is ... have hope that everyone on here has the ability to experience "real love".
 

idea

Question Everything
Actually you are wrong. A lack of sex results in higher prostate cancer rates for men:

"As part of Harvard’s Health Professionals Follow-up Study, 29,342 men between the ages of 46 and 81 reported their average number of ejaculations per month in young adulthood (ages 20–29), in mid-life (ages 40–49), and in the most recent year. Ejaculations included sexual intercourse, nocturnal emissions, and masturbation. Study participants also provided comprehensive health and lifestyle data every two years from 1992 to 2000. The scientists found that men who ejaculated 21 or more times a month enjoyed a 33% lower risk of prostate cancer compared with men who reported four to seven ejaculations a month throughout their lifetimes."

Does frequent ejaculation help ward off prostate cancer? - Harvard Prostate Knowledge

The rest of your post merely appears to be personal bias.

Haha, something tells me "prostrate cancer" is not the reason you use porn.

Be honest, real love is worth it.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Haha, something tells me "prostrate cancer" is not the reason you use porn.

Be honest, real love is worth it.

Real love is worth it, but you were wrong in your claim. You should at least admit that. As a man for health's sake you should have an orgasm on the order of once a day. Even most people in healthy relationships do not tend to make love that often.
 

Skwim

Veteran Member
Skwim, no one has ever died because they went without sex. You do not "need" sex like you need food, water, and air.
Gee, how thoughtful of you. Does this mean that because sexual dissatisfaction within marriage is the leading reason people cheat on their partners, married people should forego sex except for purposeful baby-making? Of course it does, because that's how you think :rolleyes:

Of The Eight Reasons that People Cheat on Their Partners:

1. Lack of sexual satisfaction in your primary relationship.
2. Desire for additional sexual encounters.
3. Lack of emotional satisfaction in your primary relationship.
4. Wanting emotional validation from someone else.
5. Falling out of love with your partner.
6. Falling in love with someone new.
7. Wanting to seek revenge.
8. Curiosity and desire for new experiences.
source

lack of sexual satisfaction is number one.

.




 

idea

Question Everything
Real love is worth it, but you were wrong in your claim. You should at least admit that. As a man for health's sake you should have an orgasm on the order of once a day. Even most people in healthy relationships do not tend to make love that often.

There are studies that show anything you want to show -
Bad news guys – celibacy probably makes you live longer | Metro News
Stay celibate to live longer
Celibacy and longevity
etc. etc.
wish there was someone who was celibate on here who would chip in.

In any event, there is "junk" food, and good food. Rationalizing eating junk food because food is needed to live is not justification for eating junk food. Healthy food is still healthy food.
 

idea

Question Everything
This is one of the dumbest things I've read in a while. This is up there with that "ejaculation causes a loss of nutrients" nonsense but even more offensive.

If you are not addicted, let's see how long you are able to abstain for then.

Gee, how thoughtful of you. Does this mean that because sexual dissatisfaction within marriage is the leading reason people cheat on their partners, married people should forego sex except for purposeful baby-making? Of course it does, because that's how you think :rolleyes:

Of The Eight Reasons that People Cheat on Their Partners:

1. Lack of sexual satisfaction in your primary relationship.
2. Desire for additional sexual encounters.
3. Lack of emotional satisfaction in your primary relationship.
4. Wanting emotional validation from someone else.
5. Falling out of love with your partner.
6. Falling in love with someone new.
7. Wanting to seek revenge.
8. Curiosity and desire for new experiences.
source
lack of sexual satisfaction is number one.

.



Again, that is like saying someone should cure their health issues by eating junk food.

Sure, many marriages have problems - the way to have a healthy marriage is not to cheat on your spouse, and watch porn etc. There are plenty of people who do make marriage work - amazing and wonderfully well - for their entire lives.

Those who are interested in something 'real', go talk to that old couple you know - the ones who have been married for 50 years, 75 years etc. and see what healthy relationships look like.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
There are studies that show anything you want to show -
Bad news guys – celibacy probably makes you live longer | Metro News
Stay celibate to live longer
Celibacy and longevity
etc. etc.
wish there was someone who was celibate on here who would chip in.

In any event, there is "junk" food, and good food. Rationalizing eating junk food because food is needed to live is not justification for eating junk food. Healthy food is still healthy food.
That is why studies have to be look at. The celibacy tests looked at people that lived in churches and other groups that banned sex. Those groups also tend to ban certain foods. It fails as a test since it was not one of the general population. There are too many other factors that were more likely to increase longevity.

By the way, it only seems longer.

At any rate the study that I linked was far superior since it was of the general population.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
If you are not addicted, let's see how long you are able to abstain for then.

To what purpose? Why should he abstain from an activity that is neither harmful and is enjoyable?

Again, that is like saying someone should cure their health issues by eating junk food.

Sure, many marriages have problems - the way to have a healthy marriage is not to cheat on your spouse, and watch porn etc. There are plenty of people who do make marriage work - amazing and wonderfully well - for their entire lives.

Those who are interested in something 'real', go talk to that old couple you know - the ones who have been married for 50 years, 75 years etc. and see what healthy relationships look like.

And there are plenty of people whose marriages cannot be saved. What are they supposed to do? If one is lucky enough and chooses well of course a happy marriage is preferable, but in the real world "happily ever after" is too often unattainable.
 

idea

Question Everything
..... There are too many other factors .....

For any study out there, there are "too many other factors"

To what purpose? Why should he abstain from an activity that is neither harmful and is enjoyable?

And there are plenty of people whose marriages cannot be saved. What are they supposed to do? If one is lucky enough and chooses well of course a happy marriage is preferable, but in the real world "happily ever after" is too often unattainable.

porn harmed my family, it harmed my children.
you have your experiences, I have mine.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
For any study out there, there are "too many other factors"

Wrong, if one properly uses statistics and aims a study properly there are not.

porn harmed my family, it harmed my children.
you have your experiences, I have mine.


How did it supposedly do so? Are you sure that you are blaming the correct agency? Correlation is not necessarily causation. By the way you in effect just contradicted your earlier claim about studies.[
 

Kangaroo Feathers

Yea, it is written in the Book of Cyril...
Not all who enter that industry enter it voluntarily.


It just happens to be a sore spot for me, as quite a few in my family have been victims of this industry.

Just a few comments:

  • Porn seems to be an escape mechanism, an alternative to genuine human relationships.
  • It is more addictive than drugs, many start out with what is "harmless" and are led into darker and darker pieces of it by the end.
  • It breeds violence, sex trafficking, degradation - back to the first point, the alternative to genuine human relationships leads not just to isolation, but to actual violence and abuse.

Here is a website - non-religious, non-political, peer-reviewed research based website:

Home - Fight the New Drug

After some very painful experiences (involving innocent children - VERY young innocent children) ... which led me to be in contact with others - too many others - with similar stories - our family is a proponent of "real love".

I do not care what religious or political viewpoints you hold - humans are social animals. Put someone in solitary confinement, and they will eventually go insane and kill themselves.

Real, genuine relationships are healthy... that virtual/fake/pretend stuff? it is not healthy.
Didn't really respond to my point, there, did you?
 

Kelly of the Phoenix

Well-Known Member
Maybe I'm just old-fashioned. But, I'd like to think that sex is still the most natural and the most powerful expression of the love between two people.
YOU feel that way. I feel that is a violation of my personal space. I do not want it. I do not need it. I do not die without it. My father felt that sex was just one of many ways to dominate women. As far as I'm aware he's never raped me, but there have been creepy moments. I will never be able to see sex as loving even though I concede others do. I should not wish to legislate my own psychological hang-ups. Hell, I don't even masturbate. I literally want NOTHING going up there. It takes all my willpower just to consent to a pap smear.
 

Truly Enlightened

Well-Known Member
YOU feel that way. I feel that is a violation of my personal space. I do not want it. I do not need it. I do not die without it. My father felt that sex was just one of many ways to dominate women. As far as I'm aware he's never raped me, but there have been creepy moments. I will never be able to see sex as loving even though I concede others do. I should not wish to legislate my own psychological hang-ups. Hell, I don't even masturbate. I literally want NOTHING going up there. It takes all my willpower just to consent to a pap smear.

We only have the illusion of "will power". The only power we voluntarily control is our "won't power". This is our conscious ability to ignore whatever the body is telling us not to ignore. Not only is the brain plastic and adaptable, but so is the body. Unfortunately the body must compensate for the "won't" decisions we make, or the habits we acquire(law of natural compensation). There will always be consequences as a result of decisions we make. It is certainly not unusual for some people to close down to any situation that they feel will bring them pain and discomfort, although I have never seen this level of sexual and social misanthropy. When we replace our tendency for avoidance and isolation, with the capacity for wonderment and an abject eagerness to participate, the pain and apprehensions associations with sex will become eye opening. To chose never to experience the ecstatic rapture of both pain and pleasure, or the feeling of total mutual abandonment, is simply unthinkable. But if it is by choice, it is simply a personal tragedy.

Although, I agree that correlation is not causation, but loneliness and isolationism can be more of a cause than a symptom in most mental health issues. The loneliness that arises from a lack of human closeness can easily bring about any number of mental health conditions(depression, social anxiety, addiction, lack of eye contact, sexual autism, even hording). In humans, closeness and bonding are fundamental to our mental well-being. They are the results of evolution and are genetically expressed. If we can't bond to each other naturally, then we will certainly bond with something else(drugs, possessions, porn, foods, routines, gambling, etc.), as a substitute for human closeness.

Although this is none of my business, the obvious question is why? There are a few questions I would need to ask, but certainly not in open forum. I have seen similar conditions before, but certainly not to this extent. True sex is not about the domination, debasement, subjugation, exploitation, or the submission of women as depicted in porn. It is about mutually satisfying, understanding, and knowing the sexual needs of each other, with compassion, patients, passion, without fear, guilt, or judgement. To achieve this level of self-discovery, contentment, and completeness in a relationship, is certainly worth the experienced gained through trial and error. With porn there is no mutual understanding, no intimacy, no chemistry exchanged, and no verbal or non-verbal communications. I would suggest for those who need the instant sexual gratification of virtual love, to save your money and try a sex worker. At least they are real, and professionals. I think you for sharing. I sincerely hope that you will not continue to isolate yourself away from any possibility of true intimacy and true pleasure, because of some root cause from your past. You seem too intelligent for that. Don
 

Skwim

Veteran Member
YOU feel that way. I feel that is a violation of my personal space. I do not want it. I do not need it. I do not die without it. My father felt that sex was just one of many ways to dominate women. As far as I'm aware he's never raped me, but there have been creepy moments. I will never be able to see sex as loving even though I concede others do. I should not wish to legislate my own psychological hang-ups. Hell, I don't even masturbate. I literally want NOTHING going up there. It takes all my willpower just to consent to a pap smear.
My sympathies for your loss and predicament.

.
 

Mock Turtle

Oh my, did I say that!
Premium Member
I've gone periods without watching porn, just like I've gone periods without playing video games or reading or listening to music, etc. :shrug:

What you're thinking of is a compulsion. Most people don't have that.

This is true, but I have noticed when one becomes the other though (an addiction) - which did happen to me at one time. :oops:
 
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