Powerlessness is a lie

[Tmac]

I thought I'd just explained why?

This doesn't tackle anything I said.

You guys are too much, you try to create situations that somehow you want me to believe didn't have an untold number of variables that needed to happen in order for the situation to exist and then say, this is powerlessness.

 

[blü 2]

the brain is the control center of the body, the mind houses consciousness.

It's physical, it's an integrated unit, and its parts all operate on a neuron-based system, so I wouldn't divide it beyond saying that the brain has different parts which it uses singly or in combinations for its various functions.

I see life as concentric circles with consciousness at its center.

I see life as one's sense of self being generated by the brain, which perceives the world through the senses and sets out to make sense of it using the kit of instincts, abilities and functions our genetics give us.

You may have come across >these experiments< back in 2008 which show that the nonconscious brain makes decisions and begins to act on them up to several seconds before the conscious brain is aware of the fact. They're only part of the reason why I think the conscious brain is much less important than has classically been asserted.

I don't think it [the brain] could grasp infinity without it [the mind].

I don't understand infinity except as the concept that the number line can be extended without limit. The word also applies to (a) that slippery paradox in maths, infinitesmals and (b) a set of ideas from Cantor which have no counterpart in reality; I can work the maths but I can't pretend to have any intuitive comprehension of the concepts.

 

[Tmac]

It's physical, it's an integrated unit, and its parts all operate on a neuron-based system, so I wouldn't divide it beyond saying that the brain has different parts which it uses singly or in combinations for its various functions.

I see life as one's sense of self being generated by the brain, which perceives the world through the senses and sets out to make sense of it using the kit of instincts, abilities and functions our genetics give us.

You may have come across >these experiments< back in 2008 which show that the nonconscious brain makes decisions and begins to act on them up to several seconds before the conscious brain is aware of the fact. They're only part of the reason why I think the conscious brain is much less important than has classically been asserted.

I don't understand infinity except as the concept that the number line can be extended without limit. The word also applies to (a) that slippery paradox in maths, infinitesmals and (b) a set of ideas from Cantor which have no counterpart in reality; I can work the maths but I can't pretend to have any intuitive comprehension of the concepts.

First let me say that I cannot find a response that would be an inclusive response to yours so I'll focus on the first paragraph.
By integrated unit are you saying that the mind isn't independent of the body, could not the mind see itself as whole even though the body might be less than whole?

 

[blü 2]

By integrated unit are you saying that the mind isn't independent of the body, could not the mind see itself as whole even though the body might be less than whole?

Hm. I'd say the 'mind' was a very loosely defined word for a selection of our brain functions, like self-awareness, memory, speech, ratiocination, deciding, moral impulses, and a few things like that.

 

[Revoltingest]

Reminds me of Henry Ford.....
"Whether you think you can or you think you can't, you're right."

For the aphorism challenged.....
If you believe you're powerless, then you are.

 

[Erebus]

You guys are too much, you try to create situations that somehow you want me to believe didn't have an untold number of variables that needed to happen in order for the situation to exist and then say, this is powerlessness.

Okay. Would you agree that there's a difference between having had a choice and currently having a choice?

 

[WalterTrull]

I mean, for a start, what need would a working mind have for a brain (let alone a body)?

Ay there's the rub. My hunch is that, on the one hand, it's our need to rationalize, on the other, something to do with parental protection. Still not seeing it clearly. If you do, would you explain it?

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

n less harsh terms its an excuse, we always have a choice. We are always making choices. Even if one is in a situation where opposition in any form results in death, we either choose to endure the situation or accept death. If we choose to endure then we make up words like powerlessness.
In most situation, we accept the term because the situation in question is not felt to be that relevant.
Life is, because we choose endure it as, we found it.

While I don't think we have power over everything, yeah, really there's no excuse because we're stronger than we think.

I agree, from what I have seen in life sometimes the fear of death is exactly what can get you killed.

Like, if you sense a car about to T-bone you and you hesitate and die, but if you had just gunned it, maybe they'd just hit your rear end and at least you'd be alive.

Oh, - just: If I'm driving a giant earth-mover, is mine the power or the earth-mover? I'm not doing the heavy lifting, but I am directing it.

Sometimes the greatest power is the willingness to accept we need to team up to get stuff done.

 

[WalterTrull]

How long do you think caution begins to look like a lack of trust. And you also skirted around the issue without saying that you choose to believe in God.

If I see a bon fire, walk up to it, feel the warmth, I suppose I could choose to not believe in fire, don't know why I'd bother though. Don't really need to trust in fire, I feel the warmth. Hopefully, someone would tell me not to pick up an ember in my bare hands. Maybe I'd ask why. Maybe I'd just go ahead and get burned,- not wise. Perhaps I'll just sit here and be warm for a while. Later, it's possible, I'll start to understand the many ways fire can be useful.

 

[Tmac]

While I don't think we have power over everything, yeah, really there's no excuse because we're stronger than we think.


Like, if you sense a car about to T-bone you and you hesitate and die, but if you had just gunned it, maybe they'd just hit your rear end and at least you'd be alive.


Sometimes the greatest power is the willingness to accept we need to team up to get stuff done.

I agree with your last sentence whole heartedly, actually your whole post, excluding that shaky part in the first sentence. Working on self can be done solo, correcting the problems we incur in existence requires consensus.

 

[Tmac]

Hm. I'd say the 'mind' was a very loosely defined word for a selection of our brain functions, like self-awareness, memory, speech, ratiocination, deciding, moral impulses, and a few things like that.

You think self awareness and morality are brain functions?

 

[Tmac]

Reminds me of Henry Ford.....
"Whether you think you can or you think you can't, you're right."

For the aphorism challenged.....
If you believe you're powerless, then you are.

Amen.

 

[sayak83]

Having a choice is power.

I statement "I had no choice than to give the guy with the gun my wallet in order to save my life.".. seems a perfectly reasonable statement to make. Isn't one's own life one of the most valuable things to protect and preserve?

 

[Tmac]

I statement "I had no choice than to give the guy with the gun my wallet in order to save my life.".. seems a perfectly reasonable statement to make. Isn't one's own life one of the most valuable things to protect and preserve?

Well I know it is for you but some people find things like honor, love and country, to name a few, worth dying for.

 

[blü 2]

My hunch is that, on the one hand, it's our need to rationalize, on the other, something to do with parental protection. Still not seeing it clearly. If you do, would you explain it?

When you say, our need to rationalize, do you mean the concept of the mind?

If you do, my guess would be that for many people the sense of self feels different to the sense of body, so a rather shifting collection of brain functions is thought of as 'mind'.

 

[blü 2]

You think self awareness and morality are brain functions?

Without a doubt.

There's nothing else they could be.

Aspects of our morality are genetic, for example. We find certain moral principles present in all civilizations, all tribes, everywhere: nurture and protection of children, dislike of the one who harms, like of fairness and reciprocity, respect for authority, loyalty to the group, and a sense of self-worth or virtue through self-denial. Other aspects of morality, like whether at a wedding a dowry, brideprice or nothing is payable, are part of cultural morality, which is variable, along with questions of vendetta, 'honor' and 'face', when you may fart, how to hold a knife and fork, and so on.

 

[sayak83]

Well I know it is for you but some people find things like honor, love and country, to name a few, worth dying for.

There are a few rare situations where one encounters things that may be worth courting death, but they are not as common as state or ideological propaganda usually tries to say. True morality lies in the preservation and flourishing of all human lives especially one's own. The life that one inherits is precious and one should be profoundly skeptical of all ideas promoting abstract virtues that are supposedly worth more than this one certain and invaluable gift of God.

 

[Tmac]

There are a few rare situations where one encounters things that may be worth courting death, but they are not as common as state or ideological propaganda usually tries to say. True morality lies in the preservation and flourishing of all human lives especially one's own. The life that one inherits is precious and one should be profoundly skeptical of all ideas promoting abstract virtues that are supposedly worth more than this one certain and invaluable gift of God.

If you hadn't put "especially one's own" I wouldn't have been able to think that maybe a coward wrote that for their own protection and others like them.

 

[Tmac]

Without a doubt.

There's nothing else they could be.

Aspects of our morality are genetic, for example. We find certain moral principles present in all civilizations, all tribes, everywhere: nurture and protection of children, dislike of the one who harms, like of fairness and reciprocity, respect for authority, loyalty to the group, and a sense of self-worth or virtue through self-denial. Other aspects of morality, like whether at a wedding a dowry, brideprice or nothing is payable, are part of cultural morality, which is variable, along with questions of vendetta, 'honor' and 'face', when you may fart, how to hold a knife and fork, and so on.

I think you are reaching but what will be gained? The idea of the thread is, powerlessness is a lie and you seem to think that in certain situations the mind/brain shuts down (although I don't think the brain ever shuts down) and the individual is powerless to make a choice, it as if the mind/brain betray the individual by taking away the power of choice but leaves the individual to witness their powerlessness. And some how there are no choices made that gets this individual into this situation.

 

[sayak83]

If you hadn't put "especially one's own" I wouldn't have been able to think that maybe a coward wrote that for their own protection and others like them.

Yes, well, it's difficult to expect much more than this from you.
A world full of cowards is a world without violence and killing. As someone said once, the meek shall inherit the world. So... on second thoughts, thank you for the compliment.