Lovely! I enjoyed reading it all!I do not want to start a new thread so I will just post it here since there has been some interest.
Here is my story as I related it to a Christian on this forum a few weeks ago. He was telling me about how he went from being a Catholic in his childhood to atheism in adulthood, and how he returned to Catholicism. The context is that he had a spiritual experience but I forgot all the details. So below is the story I related to him.
My story is no doubt a lot different from yours. I never really has any premonitions or spiritual experiences per se, except for the time when I first read Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh with serious intent and absolute desperation. That happened right after I had a life crisis about six years ago and I was at the brink of suicide. I had been at that brink many times before but this time was different because I had come back my religion after a long hiatus about a year and a half before that, so I was at a different place in my life. Before that when I was suicidal I had no hope... Anyhow, what happened was that I picked up that book called Gleanings and started to read it on the bus ride to work and it just hot me like a ton of bricks who God was and who Baha'u'llah was, and I started crying and could not stop. That was the real beginning of my spiritual journey.
Mind you, I had been a Baha'i for about 43 years at that time but I was not engaged and I knew nothing about God because that is not why I joined the religion; I joined because I am an idealist so I was drawn to the teachings and the primary message of Baha'u'llah, the unity of mankind and world peace.
Anyhow, I started in the middle of my story, so now I am going back to the beginning. I like telling stories almost as much as I like hearing them...
To try to make a long story short, my mother and father were raised as Christians, Greek Orthodox and Anglican, but they both dropped out of the Church long before their children were born, probably right after they married sometime in the 1940s. To not be a Christian in the United States was practically unheard of back in those days. So my brother and sister and I never saw a Bible or the inside of a Church and we never gave it a second thought.
Then when my brother was in his early 20s he got curious about religion so he read about all the great world religions, especially Christianity. As I recall he told me he read the Bible cover to cover five times. Then after all that he discovered the Baha'i Faith and read about it. I do not recall how long it was before he became a Baha'i, but it was in 1968. Then he told my sister and me about it in 1970 and we both read about it and became Baha'is shortly thereafter. About five years later he told my mother about it and she became a Baha'i, so that was the whole nuclear family because my father had died in 1964, before he ever heard of the Baha'i Faith. My father had one sister who was a confirmed atheist but all my mother's brothers and sisters were either Roman Catholic or Greek Orthodox.
I said I was going to try to make a long story short, but that has not worked out very well so far, so now I am going to try to be more concise and you can ask me any questions about the last part of my story if you want to. So after I became a Baha'i I had a lot of psychological problems. This was unrelated to the religion, but rather owing to the difficult childhood I had, so I was not very active in the religion for very long and eventually I dropped out of activities. I was in "recovery" for a long time, but I was also in college for over 15 years so I was very busy, However, I never lost my belief in Baha'u'llah, although I was not tight with God at all because I was never close to God in the first place, and I was angry at Him for my suffering for about 10 years before I returned to the religion..
The last part of this story starts in January 2013 when I decided to try to engage with my religion again and try to resolve my issues with God, and that is when I first came to forums. First In I started posting in a Baha'i forum and after that I branched out to other forums. That is when I started learning about Christianity and to a lesser extent about Judaism, Buddhism, and Hinduism. About a year after that I started my own forum but after that I started posting on a forum that was primarily nonbelievers and that became my primary forum until I left about two and a half years ago and came to this forum. I recently returned to that atheist forum so now I am here and there. I like talking to atheists because most of them are very sincere people, they just don't see any evidence for God. But also I have an atheist bent, although I never doubted God’s existence for one minute.
The last seven years has been quite a spiritual journey, and I think I have grown more in these years than in all the previous years put together, in spite of all the counseling and support groups I attended during the previous years. I believe it was my willingness to give my religion and God another chance as well as the participation in forums that helped me grow spiritually. I am quite an introvert so this gives me an opportunity to socialize without going out. Let me put it this way: My ordinary lifestyle is sheltering in place, so now everyone has experienced the way I normally live.
I sure hope I did not bore you to tears.
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Proof of Islam?
- Thread starter Wolf Spirit
- Start date
I agree, but it could be easily eradicated, it isn't, because Hate is supposedly supposed to be here, at large, in many ways. Death doesn't seem to benefit our bodies either, it appears we might not be here to be catered to, but rather made to struggle through combat and torture in order to survive just a little longer in an infinitesimaly small particle of a mad piece of "outsider art".
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
You are preaching to the choir.
I double dare you to go and tell that to some Baha'is. They love the loving God as much as Christians do. Most people love a loving God, but I believe it is a fantasy and I cannot live a fantasy.
I think thats all who might half-listen, the rest of the sound blocked by singing from oneself and others, waiting for cues to harmonize, and possibly tinnitus from a life under storm.You are preaching to the choir.
I think one should profit from all they can however they can without consequences short or long term. So what does it take at "bare minimum" to be considered a "practicing Bahai" and at "maximum" to be considered a "true / best" Bahai?
I want answers for this from each participant here representing each faction or group.
What are all the requirements and practices of being a bare minimum whatever and a maximum whatever:
Sunni Muslim
Shia Muslim
Sufi Muslim
Bahai
Sikh
Hindu
Atheist
Jew
Christian
Witch
Spiritualist
Falun Gong
Communist
Liberal
Conservative
Socialist
Anarchist
Stoic
Epicurean
Hedonist
Platonist
whatever else.
Its ok, a person can answer on behalf of other factions, they don't need to be practicing, just what they understand or know what qualifies one at bare minimum and is the maximum version step by step in bullet points covering all that has to be done and what that is based on and why.
The Christians may especially profit from thinking about this, as many modern Christians seem to basically be nothing, do nothing, except just saying they are Christian.
The Muslims have the 5 pillars though some say "just shahada" is enough to be considered a Muslim which is lol absolutely ridiculous I think but that is the bare minimum for some.
People with knowledge of Hindu practices can make a clear outline of requirements to "Be" and be "Being" an active mainstream true Hindu as well as any other types.
Lets have it laid all out here.
I think Duncan can answer for a lot of factions due to their intensive studies.
If its all laid out, it can help people see what they are, what they want to be, what they couldn't be, what they aren't considered to be, and why!
Like, are you performing 5 daily worship sessions? The ablution? No detail should be spared!
I want answers for this from each participant here representing each faction or group.
What are all the requirements and practices of being a bare minimum whatever and a maximum whatever:
Sunni Muslim
Shia Muslim
Sufi Muslim
Bahai
Sikh
Hindu
Atheist
Jew
Christian
Witch
Spiritualist
Falun Gong
Communist
Liberal
Conservative
Socialist
Anarchist
Stoic
Epicurean
Hedonist
Platonist
whatever else.
Its ok, a person can answer on behalf of other factions, they don't need to be practicing, just what they understand or know what qualifies one at bare minimum and is the maximum version step by step in bullet points covering all that has to be done and what that is based on and why.
The Christians may especially profit from thinking about this, as many modern Christians seem to basically be nothing, do nothing, except just saying they are Christian.
The Muslims have the 5 pillars though some say "just shahada" is enough to be considered a Muslim which is lol absolutely ridiculous I think but that is the bare minimum for some.
People with knowledge of Hindu practices can make a clear outline of requirements to "Be" and be "Being" an active mainstream true Hindu as well as any other types.
Lets have it laid all out here.
I think Duncan can answer for a lot of factions due to their intensive studies.
If its all laid out, it can help people see what they are, what they want to be, what they couldn't be, what they aren't considered to be, and why!
Like, are you performing 5 daily worship sessions? The ablution? No detail should be spared!
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
There might be more, but I am kind of in the run right now, so I am going to tell you the two most important requirements for being a Baha'i, and they are called the Twin Duties. The first duty is recognition of Baha'u'llah as the Manifestation of God for this age and the second duty is adherence to the ordinances He set forth in His Book of Laws (The Kitáb-i-Aqdas – The Most Holy Book).
“The first duty prescribed by God for His servants is the recognition of Him Who is the Day Spring of His Revelation and the Fountain of His laws, Whorepresenteth the Godhead in both the Kingdom of His Cause and the world of creation. Whoso achieveth this duty hath attained unto all good; and whoso is deprived thereof, hath gone astray, though he be the author of every righteous deed. It behoveth every one who reacheth this most sublime station, this summit of transcendent glory, to observe every ordinance of Him Who is the Desire of the world. These twin duties are inseparable. Neither is acceptable without the other. Thus hath it been decreed by Him Who is the Source of Divine inspiration.
They whom God hath endued with insight will readily recognize that the precepts laid down by God constitute the highest means for the maintenance of order in the world and the security of its peoples. He that turneth away from them, is accounted among the abject and foolish. We, verily, have commanded you to refuse the dictates of your evil passions and corrupt desires, and not to transgress the bounds which the Pen of the Most High hath fixed, for these are the breath of life unto all created things. The seas of Divine wisdom and divine utterance have risen under the breath of the breeze of the All-Merciful. Hasten to drink your fill, O men of understanding! They that have violated the Covenant of God by breaking His commandments, and have turned back on their heels, these have erred grievously in the sight of God, the All-Possessing, the Most High.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 330-331
The entire passage can be read here: The Twin Duties
Muffled
Jesus in me
I believe I mean that an incarnation of God would speak every word as truth but Krishna says that animals have souls and they do not.
Muffled
Jesus in me
There is no God, but there are prophets / sons / messengers / manifestations / mahdis sent by God / Allah. Go figure.
I believe Jesus is God in the flesh. I believe that is much better than prophets, messengers, manifestations, or mahdis.
Muffled
Jesus in me
I believe it is not enough because it can't save you.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Your belief does not make that a reality.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
I believe that only caring about being saved is selfish.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
It is. That is why we requested the Lord to appear in nine avataras. One can't have enough of them.
Only your deeds save you. I think Jesus must have told you that.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Jesus sure as heck did say that, but most Christians don't pay much attention to what Jesus said.
Matthew 25:45-46 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me. And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.
Duncan
Member
Please would like to show me where Jesus said I am God?
Duncan
Member
So as I said in my previous post, the Bahais faith has nothing to with Islam, they believe that GOD has revealed Himself to man by means of Divine Manifestations, including Abraham, Moses, Krishna, Zoroaster, the Buddha, Jesus, Muhammad, the Bab, and Bahaullah. They believe that these messengers were provided to guide mankind through an evolutionary process in which the appearance of the Bab initiated a new age for mankind. The Bahais say that to date is message is the fullest revelation of GOD's will and that it is the primary GOD given instrument that will make world unity possible.
One of the basic precepts of Bahais that all the great religions of the world are divine in origin, that their basic principles are in complete harmony. They differ only in their nonessential aspects of their doctrines.
Bahais beliefs include the oneness of GOD, the soul's immortality, and the evolution (biological, spiritual, and social) of mankind. On the other hand, they reject the common concept of angels. They also reject the Trinity, and the reincarnation teaching of Hinduism.
The brotherhood of man and equality of women are major features of Bahai belief. Bahais practice monogamy. At least once a day, they pray any one of three prayers revealed by Bahaullah. They practice fasting from sun rise to sun set during the 19 days of Bahai month of Ala, which falls in March. The Bahai calendar consists of 19 months , and each having 19 days.
The Bahai faith does not have many set rituals, nor does it have clergy. Any who profess faith in Bahaullah and accept his teachings may be enrolled as members. They meet for worship on the first day of every Bahai month.
The Bahais see themselves as having the mission of the spiritual conquest of the planet. They try to spread their faith through conversation, example, participation in community projects, and information campaigns. They believe in absolute obedience to the laws of the country in which they reside, and though they vote, they abstain from participation in politics. They prefer non-combatant duty in the armed forces when possible but are not conscientious objectors.
I will go through the rest one by one InshaAllah
Duncan
Member
So who can save you brother?
Do the Bahai perform the 5 pillars? What are they missing?
Duncan
Member
Again brother Bahai are not Muslims its has nothing to do with Islam, It is not a part of it for them to have pillars.
What can save us, if not God? If you say Jesus, then why do you think so or why are you convinced of that?
The Muslims depend on God to save them if they follow the Qur'an and believe what it says.
The Christians believe God will save them too, the difference being that the Christians say God incarnated exclusively into Jesus and that Jesus / God had to be killed and ressurected to overcome some requirement and now only can people have eternal bodies rather than being shades in Hades. Today, Christians don't often talk about why, but are raised to just say things like "only through the sacrifice of Jesus and his death was the debt owed by all sinful humans paid in his blood, and so God sacrificed himself as his only begotten son so that all mankind who accept that may be saved by God.
The Buddhists believe one can save oneself through certain practices and that no God of any sort is necessary, but that a system is in place where one can ascend through practices, meditations, realizations.
The Qur'an says anyone at all who by whatever has ended up doing the right thing and is a good believerm who worships God, they will be forgiven and rewarded easily by God who doesn't requireone to say Jesus is God exclusivelt incarnate.