Protestants don't know their Bible!

[PruePhillip]

Jesus didn’t write a book, he started a church. He gave the church leaders and gave these leaders his authority to teach and to forgive sins. He told us to listen to the church.

The church wrote the new testament and has proclaimed throughout the world for nearly 2000 years.

And this church MADE NO MENTION of any Easter, Christmas, transubstantiation, indulgences, rosaries, Popes, Cardinals,
Cathedrals, seven-deadly-sins, confessionals, Crusades or Inquisitions.
These doctrines did to Christianity what the Pharisees and Saducees did to Judaism.
The disciples wrote nothing outside of what Jesus said and lived.

 

[pearl]

Your "church" according to Revelation 17 is a daughter of Babylon, who will soon fall (Rev 18:2), and those hanging on to the pope, will be "cut off" (Isaiah 22:25).

It does not occur to you that the only reason there is the Apocalypse for you to use as a weapon against the Church is because the Church included it in the Canon? The Bible you stated you read and study is a product of that very Church.

 

[PruePhillip]

It does not occur to you that the only reason there is the Apocalypse for you to use as a weapon against the Church is because the Church included it in the Canon? The Bible you stated you read and study is a product of that very Church.

Yes, and it embarrasses the Catholic Church. The fact is the Canon was composed of books that people in general
felt were worthy of inclusion. So Peter's Gospel is included and Philip's Gospel is not, for instance.
But the RCC doesn't make a big deal of the New Testament. Many RCC's don't even read it or encourage others to
read it. Reference to the whore that sits on seven hills must be an awkward verse!

 

[pearl]

Reference to the whore that sits on seven hills must be an awkward verse!

No matter how hard the anti-Catholics try, the 'whore' is not the Roman Church, it refers to the Roman Empire, during the time of Roman persecutions of Christians.

 

[2ndpillar]

It does not occur to you that the only reason there is the Apocalypse for you to use as a weapon against the Church is because the Church included it in the Canon? The Bible you stated you read and study is a product of that very Church.

It does not occur to you that the only reason there is the Apocalypse for you to use as a weapon against the Church is because the Church included it in the Canon? The Bible you stated you read and study is a product of that very Church.

The canon of the daughter of Babylon contains both the message of the devil, and the message of the son of man. (Matthew 13:39-42), and has remained intact until the "end of the age" (Matthew 13:24-30). The book of Revelation was not in all early canons, and Luther tried desperately to remove it, as well as James, as they were a testament against his church and its false gospel of grace/lawlessness..

 

[2ndpillar]

No matter how hard the anti-Catholics try, the 'whore' is not the Roman Church, it refers to the Roman Empire, during the time of Roman persecutions of Christians.

It kind of falls back to context. The "whore"/"harlot", daughter of Babylon (Zech 17:5), referred to in Revelation 17:16, refers to the Jews, also a harlot daughter, in which the "whore of Babylon", a description of a Roman priest, Luther, with respect to the Roman church, tortured and burned Jews and heretics by their Inquisition arm, headed by the pope, as well as the Jews killed by a horn of the 8th head of the beast, Rome, in the form of the leader of the 3rd Reich, Hitler. Czar/Caesar Putin, also a horn of the 8th head of the beast, sent agents to kill the Jewish head of Ukraine, although Putin and Stalin would fall under the Orthodox arm of the Roman Church. As for the "woman" sitting on the scarlet beast with seven heads, that would be Babylon, the mother of harlots, sitting on all the heads of the beast (Revelation 17:3), not just Rome.

 

[Muffled]

I believe I know my Bible very well and I consider myself reformed not protestant. The former formation of the church has lapsed into grave error and it was necessary to separate from that error. We are past protesting. It evidently was not a word to the wise.

 

[Muffled]

Peotestants do have a priesthood. Jesus is the only high priest between the people and God. Jesus never prayed the rosary and never made the sign of the cross. A church that does those things is making its own rules and not following Jesus.

I believe as a Baptist I believe in the priesthood of believers.

 

[Muffled]

You really need to investigate what Luther actually believed concerning Mary, from the source itself, not anti Catholic propaganda.

Whoever is weak in faith can utter no Hail Mary without danger to his salvation. (Sermon, March 11, 1523).Who possess a good (firm) faith, says the Hail Mary without danger! Our prayer should include the Mother of God.. .What the Hail Mary says is that all glory should be given to God, using these words: "Hail Mary, full of grace. The Lord is with thee; blessed art thou among women and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus Christ. Amen!" You see that these words are not concerned with prayer but purely with giving praise and honor.. .We can use the Hail Mary as a meditation in which we recite what grace God has given her. Second, we should add a wish that everyone may know and respect her...He who has no faith is advised to refrain from saying the Hail Mary. (Personal Prayer Book, 1522).

“It is an artcle of faith that Mary is the Mother of the Lord and still a virgin…Christ, we believe, came forth from a womb left perfectly intact.” (Works of Luther, V. 11, pp319-320; V. 6, p 510)

John Calvin: “there have been certain folk who have wished to suggest from this passage (Mt 1:25) that the Virgin Mary had other children than the Son of God, and that Joseph had then dwelt with her later; but what folly this is! For the gospel writer did not wish to record what happened afterwards; he simply wished to make clear Joseph’s obedience and to show also that Joseph had been well and truly assured that it was God who had sent His angel to Mary. He had therefore never dwelt with her nor had he shared her company…And besides this our Lord Jesus Christ is called the firstborn. This is not because there was a second or third, but because the gospel writer is paying regard to the precedence. Scripture speaks thus of naming the first-born whether or no there was any question of the second.” (Sermon on Matthew 1:22-25, published 1562)
Ulrich Zwingli: “I firmly believe that Mary, according to the words of the gospel as a pure Virgin brought forth for us the son of God and in childbirth and after childbirth forever remained a pure, intact Virgin.”.” (Zwingli Opera, Corpus Reformatorum, Berlin, 1905, in Evang. Luc., Op. comp., V6,1 P. 639

All three of the first reformers, Luther, Calvin, and Zwingli, accepted and defended this doctrine completely. So, if the Catholic Church believes in this doctrine and the reformers believed in this doctrine–by whose authority and when was this doctrine rejected by all the Protestant Churches?

I believe then that all three were in error. Just because they were leaders and well educated doesn't mean they were always right about everything.

 

[pearl]

Persecution of Christians in the Roman Empire - Wikipedia

 

[pearl]

I believe then that all three were in error. Just because they were leaders and well educated doesn't mean they were always right about everything.

True. The point was that it was not these particular, original Reformers that denied Marian belief, but later reformers.

 

[PruePhillip]

No matter how hard the anti-Catholics try, the 'whore' is not the Roman Church, it refers to the Roman Empire, during the time of Roman persecutions of Christians.

Yes, it seems to have something to do with Rome. But the 'whore' seems to be more a spiritual, religious
entity. This same personage profits from religious idols and deals not in empires but dead men's souls.

 

[KW]

The widely used canon of today was compiled during the era of the beast with two horns like a lamb, Constantine, who was to "deceive" "those who dwell on the earth" (Rev 13). Yeshua gave a message, which was repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand (Matthew 3), and produce "good fruit", lest you be cut down and thrown into the fire. Your "church" of today cannot forgive sins, which is evident in they can not heal their followers, raise the dead, or cast out demons. Their message is the false gospel of grace, per the false prophet Paul. If you want your sins forgiven, you have to actually find a righteous man, confess your sins, and have the righteous man pray to God for you, for God does not listen to the prayers of sinners. (John 9:31) (James 5:16) Your "church" according to Revelation 17 is a daughter of Babylon, who will soon fall (Rev 18:2), and those hanging on to the pope, will be "cut off" (Isaiah 22:25).

This is all fantasy babel.

Did you make this up yourself?

 

[KW]

The New Testament was not written by any church. Various people wrote their thoughts and ideas as inspired by God. Years later these writtings were combined into the Bible.

All the writers were members of the Church.

The Church compiled, protected and proclaimed his teachings throughout the world.

Jesus started a church and used it to spread the gospel worldwide. Go anywhere in earth and you will find Catholics feeding the hungry, helping the sick, and sharing the love of Jesus.

1.2 billion strong and growing.

 

[lostwanderingsoul]

All the writers were members of the Church.

The Church compiled, protected and proclaimed his teachings throughout the world.

Jesus started a church and used it to spread the gospel worldwide. Go anywhere in earth and you will find Catholics feeding the hungry, helping the sick, and sharing the love of Jesus.

1.2 billion strong and growing.

The writers may have been members of A church but there was no catholic church at that time. I am completely sure not one gospel writer ever said he was catholic and never made the sign of the cross or prayed the rosary.

 

[KW]

The writers may have been members of A church but there was no catholic church at that time. I am completely sure not one gospel writer ever said he was catholic and never made the sign of the cross or prayed the rosary.

It was the church. Catholic just means universal. One church for all. There was only one. That church is still the home of most Christians.

 

[metis]

The writers may have been members of A church but there was no catholic church at that time. I am completely sure not one gospel writer ever said he was catholic and never made the sign of the cross or prayed the rosary.

The Church was started by Jesus and the first name for it appears to be "the Way". In the 2nd century, "Christian" was adopted but "catholic" [universal] and "orthodox" [truth] became used as descriptors. In the 3rd century "Catholic" became the main name used for the Church, and during the Great Schism many centuries later, "Orthodox" began to be used by the eastern sect.

 

[2ndpillar]

This is all fantasy babel.

Did you make this up yourself?

The

This is all fantasy babel.

Did you make this up yourself?

I don't know. It seems that the canon used by most "Christians" today, was put together in 367 A.D. by the bishop of Alexandria, a co conspirator of the Trinity doctrine at the Council of Nicaea, convened by the Roman emperor Constantine, who was the "beast with two horns like a lamb", who was to "deceive" "those who dwell on the earth" (Revelation 13).
The Development of the Canon of the New Testament - Athanasius (ntcanon.org)
That canon was produced on the feast of Easter, Astarte, a feast day set during the Council of Nicaea, convened by the 7th head of the beast of Revelation 17.

 

[2ndpillar]

All the writers were members of the Church.

The Church compiled, protected and proclaimed his teachings throughout the world.

Jesus started a church and used it to spread the gospel worldwide. Go anywhere in earth and you will find Catholics feeding the hungry, helping the sick, and sharing the love of Jesus.

1.2 billion strong and growing.

Keep in mind, that it is the "many" who are on the wide road to "destruction" (Matthew 7:13),. As for the number of Catholics, my whole family is basically Catholic, because they were born Catholic. When it comes to following the pope, I am not sure any of them heed him at all, and I have two sisters who went to nunneries. The Catholics can't even find enough priest to herd their undisciplined flock, who remain unfed and unhealed. The "fat shepherds" (Ez 34) are looking at their own "destruction" (Ez 34:16).

 

[2ndpillar]

It was the church. Catholic just means universal. One church for all. There was only one. That church is still the home of most Christians.

It was in 380 A.D., by decree of Theodosius, that the Nicene Trinitarian Christianity was to be the only legitimate Imperial religion, and the only one entitled to call itself Catholic. The Catholic church is simply a daughter of Babylon, who sits on the beast, as in the Roman empire, and is a source of "abominations" (Rev 17). The Catholic church is built on the back of Roman emperors, and is "drunk with the blood of saints", as exampled with the Inquisition headed by the pope. Any one deferring to the Church as their fathers, which killed supposed heretics by burning them alive, is destined to have the blood of all the righteous fall on them (Matthew 23:30).