Quran and Science : Just wanted some comments

[Panda]

Sorry but I was unable to understand the comment. Can u explain?

The verse you quoted shows nothing.

 

[MFaraz_Hayat]

The verse you quoted shows nothing.

Well, doesn't it say that skins would be restored so sinners would feel pain? I mean how obvious can it get?

 

[Panda]

The pain is felt due to the pain receptors in skin.These receptors send the electrical nerve impulse to the brain.
If the skin is deeply damaged, third degree burns, the pain receptors are destroyed. Therefore these burns are less painful than second degree burns.
Please also comment on: post number 74,46 and 1 (original post).

Well done, you managed to say what I said.
The pain is not felt in the skin. Everything we experience is in the brain. Yes signals from the nerves in the skin transmit a signal to the brain but the pain is in the brain.

 

[MFaraz_Hayat]

Well done, you managed to say what I said.
The pain is not felt in the skin. Everything we experience is in the brain. Yes signals from the nerves in the skin transmit a signal to the brain but the pain is in the brain.

Well, so? He Quran does not say that pain is felt in the skin. Go and read the verse again. It says skins will be restored so sinners feel pain. Indicating that there is something in the skin, due to which we feel pain. Pointing towards the pain receptors.

 

[Panda]

Well, doesn't it say that skins would be restored so sinners would feel pain? I mean how obvious can it get?

Yup. However at the time it would be normal to think that pain is experienced in the area pain is being inflicted upon. The verse you are quoting does not show science in the Quaran.

 

[MFaraz_Hayat]

Yup. However at the time it would be normal to think that pain is experienced in the area pain is being inflicted upon. The verse you are quoting does not show science in the Quaran.

I don't get it. I mean I have posted so many verses yet all have been passed out as guesses? I mean, why wasn't science good enough to guess that, at that stage? Anyway, again another verse ( which I clearly believe shows science and so does Prof. Tagatat Tejasen) has been rejected by you people.
Tell me, by theory of probability how many chances did Prophet Muhammad (P.B.U.H.) had to get all these guesses 100% correct?
Plz comment on post 77, 1 and 46.

 

[Panda]

I don't get it. I mean I have posted so many verses yet all have been passed out as guesses? I mean, why wasn't science good enough to guess that, at that stage? Anyway, again another verse ( which I clearly believe shows science and so does Prof. Tagatat Tejasen) has been rejected by you people.
Tell me, by theory of probability how many chances did Prophet Muhammad (P.B.U.H.) had to get all these guesses 100% correct?
Plz comment on post 77, 1 and 46.

Well none of these guesses show anything. They are so ambiguous they could mean almost anything. They are not 100% correct and definitely do not prove define revelation

 

[MFaraz_Hayat]

Well none of these guesses show anything. They are so ambiguous they could mean almost anything. They are not 100% correct and definitely do not prove define revelation

Can u plz explain the ambiguity when Quran says that in an embryo first come the bones over which muscles grow?
"then We made out of that
lump bones and clothed
the bones with flesh;"
Is this ambiguous? I think not. If you think that any other meaning can be attached to it, feel free to do so.

 

[credance]

Read the verse again. Quran clearly states that skins will be restored, so that they face Penalty ( experience pain). A person still burns when the skin is removed, but feels less pain. That is the reason why second degree burns are more painful than third degree burns. In third degree pain receptors themselves are damaged.
It is differing opinion.I think that a rapist should be punished in this manner.

After all this I think I finally get what you are saying.
Hell is a womb like place deep in the root of mountains where sinners (disbelievers) are held in a state of perpetual embryonic development to maximize and prolong the pain and suffering. Cool!

But whats the point? Would this be for the entertainment of Allah or the believers (non sinners)?

 

[MFaraz_Hayat]

After all this I think I finally get what you are saying.
Hell is a womb like place deep in the root of mountains where sinners (disbelievers) are held in a state of perpetual embryonic development to maximize and prolong the pain and suffering. Cool!

But whats the point? Would this be for the entertainment of Allah or the believers (non sinners)?

I think a rapist deserves this punishment, not for non-sinners and Allah's pleasure but for the crime he committed.

 

[credance]

It is differing opinion.I think that a rapist should be punished in this manner.

Naturally this would not include "booty rapist" or a woman who dared to go out of her house alone, or tempted a good believer by showing to much skin. She would most certainly be asking for it. Scientifically, a man can't be expected to keep his lust in check.

 

[MFaraz_Hayat]

Naturally this would not include "booty rapist" or a woman who dared to go out of her house alone, or tempted a good believer by showing to much skin. She would most certainly be asking for it. A man can't be expected to keep his lust in check.

Lets just keep this in our minds and check on Day Of Judgement that who is burning in hell fire. And can we now plz return to the original topic.

 

[credance]

I will bring the beer and marshmellows if you will bring the shish ka bobs.
Back to the topic:
Where is the scientific logic behind the "fact" that if a woman discharges first the child will look like her and if a man discharges first the child will look like him?

 

[McBell]

I don't get it.

Neither do I.
Why in the world do you have to believe that the koran/quran (or however it is spelled) has to be explaining science in a manner that can be turned and changed as scientific knowledge changes.

I mean I have posted so many verses yet all have been passed out as guesses? I mean, why wasn't science good enough to guess that, at that stage? Anyway, again another verse ( which I clearly believe shows science and so does Prof. Tagatat Tejasen) has been rejected by you people.
Tell me, by theory of probability how many chances did Prophet Muhammad (P.B.U.H.) had to get all these guesses 100% correct?
Plz comment on post 77, 1 and 46.

You act as though the verses are written like the "explanations" you provide with them.
The fact is that they are not written in any such way that they can mean only one thing.

Yet you go one like there is only one possible way to interpret them.
You also get upset when others disagree with your interpretation.
You even hint to burning in hell over it.

I also do not understand why you try so hard to make Muslims and everyone else for that matter, out to be so stupid back then.
That there was no way that they could know that when you put your hand in a fire that it causes pain.
That they were so stupid that they could not possibly know about fetus, even after observing miscarriages.

If I were A Muslim, I would, quite frankly, be rather ticked off at how you claim my ancestors to be so stupid.

 

[Don Penguinoini]

Lets just keep this in our minds and check on Day Of Judgement that who is burning in hell fire. And can we now plz return to the original topic.

Day of JUdgement? Burn in hell? YOu actually believe in this?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Like I said before: It's physically impossible for the earth's crust to hold absolutely firm under 5100 KM of molten liquid lava in the outer core. For the slippage to be moving only about 200mm per year I say the mountains are doing a good job. It only makes sense that something must be holding the tectonic plates together, and mountains are the only logical explanation. Unless you guys can offer another explanation of how the plates are held together.

The real test of how "good a job" mountains are doing to resist the movement of tectonic plates would be the difference between the rate at which the plates are moving now and the rate at which they'd move without mountains present. What reason do you have to claim that mountains reduce the rate of plate movement... in any case on Earth?

And nothing is holding tectonic plates together. They move independently.

Well, I did some research on the net and there is no denying that mountains indeed have deep roots. If you are unsure search Google on topic of isostasy and mountain formation etc. I think that peace4all is trying to imply is, that as we all know that large parts of earth's lithosphere is floating on the underlying layer, the asthenosphere, the mountains having deep roots ( look at it logically) having deep roots, would hinder movements caused by such floating. ( i took some info from information available on online Britannica)

My point about the term "mountain" was a semantic one: usually, at least in English, the "mountain" is considered to be only the portion above the surface. The crust may be thicker underneath, but it's not "mountain".

However, your point about the "deep roots" still makes no sense. Please explain the mechanism by which the "deep roots" of a mountain would slow plate movement.



And for both of you: pegs are fixed in place, not "slow moving". When I put my tent pegs in the ground, my tent doesn't slowly wander across my campsite, it stays where I put it.

 

[Quoth The Raven]

And for both of you: pegs are fixed in place, not "slow moving". When I put my tent pegs in the ground, my tent doesn't slowly wander across my campsite, it stays where I put it.

Clearly your tent pegs are deficient in some manner.
In answer to post 1, again:
Qur'an and Science: Embryology It's not a bad article, and appears quite well researched, despite where it's located. I can say that, because I actually read it, suffering from the delusion that the content was somewhat more important than the accompanying illustrations. A radical idea I know...
Now, before we scream 'bias!' (like we kind of did before), I'd just like to note that 'The Commission on Scientific Signs' - from whence come all these 'scientific accuracies' - can not exactly be considered an unbiased source (no matter how far you stretch) and has been said by people cited as non-Islamic expert references by that very organisation to employ some pretty dodgy methods of 'verification'.
Oh, and as to you asking if I'd read the latest version of Professor Moores textbook, the one quoted was a later edition than the much lauded revised 3rd edition with additional Quranic references.
So, in short, your reference in this case contradicts your revealed scientific information by virtue of a later edition of his textbook (if you'd like I can go find some further experts in the field who agree with the previously cited portion of textbook), and the '3 veils' that you tried to save your 'science' with is nothing that wasn't documented well before by people like Galen.
Unless we're going to insist now that not only were these people completely stupid and unobservant, but also existed in a vaccuum, which at this stage would come as no great surprise.

 

[MFaraz_Hayat]

I will bring the beer and marshmellows if you will bring the shish ka bobs.
Back to the topic:
Where is the scientific logic behind the "fact" that if a woman discharges first the child will look like her and if a man discharges first the child will look like him?

Quotation plz.

 

[MFaraz_Hayat]

My point about the term "mountain" was a semantic one: usually, at least in English, the "mountain" is considered to be only the portion above the surface. The crust may be thicker underneath, but it's not "mountain".

However, your point about the "deep roots" still makes no sense. Please explain the mechanism by which the "deep roots" of a mountain would slow plate movement.



And for both of you: pegs are fixed in place, not "slow moving". When I put my tent pegs in the ground, my tent doesn't slowly wander across my campsite, it stays where I put it.

I don't know that what you are implying by saying that pegs don't move. Please explain further. Secondly, it is not I who has termed these " deep roots". It is mentioned in wikipedia as well as other geology books. Did you check the book " Earth" ?

 

[MFaraz_Hayat]

Neither do I.
Why in the world do you have to believe that the koran/quran (or however it is spelled) has to be explaining science in a manner that can be turned and changed as scientific knowledge changes.

You act as though the verses are written like the "explanations" you provide with them.
The fact is that they are not written in any such way that they can mean only one thing.

Yet you go one like there is only one possible way to interpret them.
You also get upset when others disagree with your interpretation.
You even hint to burning in hell over it.

I also do not understand why you try so hard to make Muslims and everyone else for that matter, out to be so stupid back then.
That there was no way that they could know that when you put your hand in a fire that it causes pain.
That they were so stupid that they could not possibly know about fetus, even after observing miscarriages.

If I were A Muslim, I would, quite frankly, be rather ticked off at how you claim my ancestors to be so stupid.

I donot provide single interpretations. Proof is the word Alaqah. I provided three interpretations for it and all are correct.
So do you think that miscarriaged fetus are it? Could they have possibly shown the teeth like marks on embryo (chewed like lump, mudgah In Quran)? Could they have shown that first the bones grow and then the muscles? I think these things occur at microscopic level. At first, as we all know the embryo is pretty small.
As far as burning of hand is concerned. Why does the Quranic verse especially says that skins would be restored? Why inner flesh and other parts not mentioned? Flesh would have seemed more obvious, "at that time" as you people put it.
Imagine, you people do not accept a single verse of Quran to be divine, and here I am frightening you guyz with verses about hell. The intention of the posting of this verse was to show that Quran puts emphasis, on restoration of skin so that sinners may feel pain.
I am not implying my ancestors were stupid. This is the Word Of God, not mine, not Prophet Muhammad's nor anyone else.