Rape?

[Me Myself]

You say "do you understand" as if you think that's actually true. It isn't. It's a rape myth. Virtually all convicted sex offenders had the option of consensual sex at the time they committed the crime. So obviously they choose sexual assault for some other reason than sexual gratification.

They also had the chance to display anger and domination in a wide number of other ways

 

[Alceste]

They also had the chance to display anger and domination in a wide number of other ways

And they do.

 

[Me Myself]

Still wondering if anyone wants to touch it... my argument which heavily suggests the motivations of someone committing a rape will always include an element inherent violent, thus making all rape violent and all rapists willfully committing violence.

I agree. I wonder if there is anyone here who doesnt. So far I think we all agree rape is violence. The thing being discussed is whether or not sexual gratification is posible motivation.

 

[Alceste]

I agree. I wonder if there is anyone here who doesnt. So far I think we all agree rape is violence. The thing being discussed is whether or not sexual gratification is posible motivation.

Why do you resist accepting that domination is the motivation? If it was sexual gratification, a wank would do the job. Failing that, they could have consensual sex with a willing partner.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

Why do you resist accepting that domination is the motivation? If it was sexual gratification, a wank would do the job. Failing that, they could have consensual sex with a willing partner.

I've seen it argued over and over again that it isn't just about domination, but domination plus something else that needs to be looked at and talked about.

I've argued that getting turned on is there, but it's just along for the ride of the will to dominate. It's an a supplementary position, but not what drives people to rape.

Somebody can be so turned on that what they want in sexual gratification can be to orgasm (for instance), but it takes a very distinct motivation to completely dismiss another person's consent. Domination, control, punishment, etc., or any other motivation that de-humanizes another person.

 

[Me Myself]

I've seen it argued over and over again that it isn't just about domination, but domination plus something else that needs to be looked at and talked about.

I've argued that getting turned on is there, but it's just along for the ride of the will to dominate. It's an a supplementary position, but not what drives people to rape.

Somebody can be so turned on that what they want in sexual gratification can be to orgasm (for instance), but it takes a very distinct motivation to completely dismiss another person's consent. Domination, control, punishment, etc., or any other motivation that de-humanizes another person.

Empathy is a form of constraint. Motivation plus lack of constraint (empathy) equals action being performed.

 

[Me Myself]

Why do you resist accepting that domination is the motivation? If it was sexual gratification, a wank would do the job. Failing that, they could have consensual sex with a willing partner.

And if all they wanted was domination they could have just attained a position of power in their jobs or social lives that didnt involve sex.

Domination alone doesnt make an erection happen.

 

[Alceste]

And if all they wanted was domination they could have just attained a position of power in their jobs or social lives that didnt involve sex.

Domination alone doesnt make an erection happen.

They do usually use domination and aggression in many other aspects of their lives. If you are a violent and aggressive person, why NOT commit sexual aggression in addition to all the other ways you express aggression in your life?

I have this uncle. We got on fine when I was a kid, until one day he was tickling me. Kids get tickled all the time, of course, and it's a game. It's fun for everybody, and the tickler stops when they get the sense the ticklee has really had enough. Not my uncle Dave though. I had had enough, and he just kept tickling. I started to get scared, and feel helpless, and get angry, and there was this look in his eye that he knew, and he liked that. Ever since that day I considered him dangerous and untrustworthy. Years later I discovered he used to beat up his wife. (Heck, maybe he still beats her. She's Catholic, so she'll never kick him to the curb). He likes to hurt people. His kids don't like him very much, especially his daughter, and I don't really want to know what he was doing to them, but if I've met one person in my life who I sincerely believe has the capacity to be a sex offender, it's him.

 

[Titanic]

I have met a sex offender before. Was not a good time by any mean's.

 

[Alceste]

Here, just to lighten the tone -

[youtube]zVsDEySJeUg[/youtube]
Sex Offender Rap.wmv - YouTube

 

[Titanic]

Here, just to lighten the tone -

[youtube]zVsDEySJeUg[/youtube]
Sex Offender Rap.wmv - YouTube

Thank's. This thread is pretty "deep".

 

[Vinayaka]

And if all they wanted was domination they could have just attained a position of power in their jobs or social lives that didnt involve sex.

Domination alone doesnt make an erection happen.

How do you know what happens inside a criminal perverted mind? Seeing a little kid shouldn't make an erection happen either, but apparently it does.

 

[Father Heathen]

Yes, the connection may be subtle to some. MMA, boxing, the more violent ones probably do the most damage. I can't even watch it. It's legalised street fighting, and if you've seen someone smash a broken glass into someone else's face in a street fight, well??? I don't see a whole lot of difference between watching somebody smash their opponent's head repeatedly, to a brutal repeated rape.

Oh, Jesus Christ, give me a break!

Unlike "street fighting", MMA has strict rules, the athletes are well trained and matched by rank and weight class, and obviously they're willing participants. There is an expectation and standard of sportsmanship, discipline and professionalism within MMA. To compare it to rape is wholly asinine and is an insult to the sport and to the athletes. Your comments reflect upon nothing more than your own insecurity, over-sensitivity and squeamishness.

 

[Alceste]

How do you know what happens inside a criminal perverted mind? Seeing a little kid shouldn't make an erection happen either, but apparently it does.

Heck, just waking up in the morning makes an erection happen. It's a ridiculous standard for judging people's motive for wanting a cup of coffee.

 

[dust1n]

I agree. I wonder if there is anyone here who doesnt. So far I think we all agree rape is violence.

Again, not even close to what I was saying. Don't worry about it though, I was addressing a couple of specific people earlier.

 

[TheDude79]

I certainly think that in many or most people that a lack of sex changes a person's psychology and it can also aggravate existing psychological disorders.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Well there's the disconnect, then. I don't really give a fiddler's fart exactly what is going through the mind of any individual perpetrator of any violent assault at the exact moment of the crime.

Ah, that is the disconnect then. I think the more we understand about something, the more we're able to analyze it and enact possible solutions. This is especially true of human behavior.

All the argumentative fallacies and rhetorical devices in the world won't alter this fundamental view, so I suppose we're at an impasse.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

Ah, that is the disconnect then. I think the more we understand about something, the more we're able to analyze it and enact possible solutions. This is especially true of human behavior.

All the argumentative fallacies and rhetorical devices in the world won't alter this fundamental view, so I suppose we're at an impasse.

Personally, I see the psychological profile as important. But the disconnect is whether or not criminal profiling of rapists includes if somebody is turned on or is seeking sexual gratification, IMO.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Personally, I see the psychological profile as important. But the disconnect is whether or not criminal profiling of rapists includes if somebody is turned on or is seeking sexual gratification, IMO.

That's certainly been a disconnect from the start, and a point that we'll all have to agree to disagree on.

 

[Sha'irullah]

It's not rape if you just say yes