Razan Al-Najjar: Palestinian medic who saved lives shot dead by Israeli sniper

[Kangaroo Feathers]

Cite said law

Article 36 and 37 of the Second Geneva Convention.

Is this seriously the first time you've heard of this rule, or is this just generic knee jerk, throw anything and hope, "Israel, right or wrong!" rhetoric?

Customary IHL - Rule 25. Medical Personnel

 

[dfnj]

See:Razan Al Najjar: Palestinian medic who saved lives shot dead by Israeli sniper

To condense the article, the story was about a young Palestinian medic who apparently was less than a 100 yards from the fence where she ran with her hands up to attend to a protestor who was apparently injured. Paramedics arrived to assist both the man and Al Najjar but soon after assistance came shots rang out and Al Najjar fell to the ground. After being rushed to a nearby field hospital Al-Najjar was later pronounced dead. I think what made the article poignant with me was when her mother was there while they were working on Al Najjar, her mother lifted up her blood-soaked medical vest to say "this is my daughter's weapon with which she used to fight the Zionists," then pulled out two unopen bandaged rolls and said "these were her ammunition."

The loss of life whether you agree or disagree with the situation is tragic and is a political nightmare for the Israeli government. We can have a discussion about rock throwers and whether they're dangerous or not is one thing, but medical professionals wear certain colors for a reason. Now, I've read some critiques on this matter and of course, Neocons will always point to this being a plan by Hamas.But after seeing her brief story online I'm not so sure this young lady was ready for death. The more non-combatants die whether you agree with them being out there or not will definitely persuade the world on this matter concerning the issue between Palestinians and Israelis.

This reporter's story really change my view on Israel:

Just because Arabs enslaved Jews thousands of years ago doesn't justify genocide.

How many dead Arabs are enough?

More than 200 civilians killed in suspected U.S. airstrike in Iraq

It would be much cheaper in the long run if we air lifted every building, road, brick, and people and just move the entire state of Israel to some part of Arizona or New Mexico. Even put in a fake ocean and state wide climate control would still be a lot cheaper than what we are doing now.

 

[dfnj]

True.
But there are degrees of wrong.

Hamas regularly instigates violence. Israel, not so much.

It's not that IsraeI is entirely innocent either. But let's face it. Muslims are more inclined towards violence than Zionists. As a group, over all.
Tom

There are 1.6 billion Muslims in the World. Given the way Muslims have been treated since 9/11 you could argue the opposite is the case. I'm actually more amazed they tolerate all the bombings in the ME.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

This reporter's story really change my view on Israel:

Just because Arabs enslaved Jews thousands of years ago doesn't justify genocide.

How many dead Arabs are enough?

More than 200 civilians killed in suspected U.S. airstrike in Iraq

It would be much cheaper in the long run if we air lifted every building, road, brick, and people and just move the entire state of Israel to some part of Arizona or New Mexico. Even put in a fake ocean and state wide climate control would still be a lot cheaper than what we are doing now.

I've seen the point made elsewhere that ~4000 Americans died on 9/11, but ~ 50000 Americans died on the roads the same year. Imagine if all the money that has been spent in Iraq and Afghanistan as a direct result of 9/11 had instead been spent on a "war on bad driving" how much more beneficial for everyone that would have been?

Full disclosure: I was a vocal supporter of both invasions at the time, and participated in the Iraq occupation in '05. I've changed my position based on the evidence. What really bothers me are the people who, not only haven't learned anything, but are still keen for more.

 

[Flankerl]

genocide

Its funny how populations usually decrease during a genocide.

Well in Palestine they just go up.


Weird.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

Article 36 and 37 of the Second Geneva Convention.

Is this seriously the first time you've heard of this rule, or is this just generic knee jerk, throw anything and hope, "Israel, right or wrong!" rhetoric?

Customary IHL - Rule 25. Medical Personnel

No comment? I'm shocked.

 

[dfnj]

Its funny how populations usually decrease during a genocide.
Well in Palestine they just go up.
Weird.

"Published in March by Physicians for Social Responsibility, the study, conducted by a team that included some Nobel Prize winners, determined that at least 1.3 million people have died as a result of war since Sept.11, 2001, but the real figure might be as high as two million. The study was an attempt to “close the gaps” in existing research, including studies like the Iraq Body Count,” which puts the number of violent deaths in that country at about 219,000 since 2003, based on media reports of the time period."

Do The Math: Global War On Terror Has Killed 4 Million Muslims Or More

I've seen estimates has high a 8 million. I don't even like the rag heads. But when you drop 35,000 bombs on the Middle East every year for no reason at some point it becomes a war crime.

More than 200 civilians killed in suspected U.S. airstrike in Iraq

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

Do The Math: Global War On Terror Has Killed 4 Million Muslims Or More

But they're the bad guys because a tiny minority of them fight back.

 

[dfnj]

But they're the bad guys because a tiny minority of them fight back.

I've heard an Israeli hard-liner say it doesn't matter if Palestinian children die because they are just going to grow up to be terrorists anyway.

Just because a few thousand years ago Arabs enslaved Jews doesn't mean the Israelis get a free pass to commit crimes against humanity. There has to be a shred of human decency at some point. Arabs today should not be held responsible for thousand year old crimes.

 

[columbus]

Imagine if all the money that has been spent in Iraq and Afghanistan as a direct result of 9/11 had instead been spent on a "war on bad driving" how much more beneficial for everyone that would have been?

During the year or so prior to the Iraq invasion my Dad was suffering from some serious heart issues. He spent a lot of time watching TV, especially Fox. So when I visited, which was a lot, so did I.
The lies and distortions spewing from the Bush administration through Fox news were maddening. And he was buying it, hook line and sinker. He and I were used to vein popping arguments about politics, and this produced some doozies! Which really upset my mother, because screaming matches weren't on his heart surgery recovery program.
Tom

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

I've heard an Israeli hard-liner say it doesn't matter if Palestinian children die because they are just going to grow up to be terrorists anyway.

Just because a few thousand years ago Arabs enslaved Jews doesn't mean the Israelis get a free pass to commit crimes against humanity. There has to be a shred of human decency at some point. Arabs today should not be held responsible for thousand year old crimes.

Arabs today should be held accountable for contemporary crimes, but that doesn't make shooting medics and civilians OK.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

During the year or so prior to the Iraq invasion my Dad was suffering from some serious heart issues. He spent a lot of time watching TV, especially Fox. So when I visited, which was a lot, so did I.
The lies and distortions spewing from the Bush administration through Fox news were maddening. And he was buying it, hook line and sinker. He and I were used to vein popping arguments about politics, and this produced some doozies! Which really upset my mother, because screaming matches weren't on his heart surgery recovery program.
Tom

Hey, my Dad still buys into it all even though I've swung away from my earlier blind idealistic nationalism. My Dad is one of the most generous, helpful, caring and intelligent individuals you will ever meet, so it baffles and confuses me that he is so hooked.

edit: Hope your Dad's doing better now

 

[dfnj]

Arabs today should be held accountable for contemporary crimes, but that doesn't make shooting medics and civilians OK.

The way Israelis do not like Arabs seems to me to be more than just contemporary.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

This reporter's story really change my view on Israel:

Just because Arabs enslaved Jews thousands of years ago doesn't justify genocide.

How many dead Arabs are enough?

More than 200 civilians killed in suspected U.S. airstrike in Iraq

It would be much cheaper in the long run if we air lifted every building, road, brick, and people and just move the entire state of Israel to some part of Arizona or New Mexico. Even put in a fake ocean and state wide climate control would still be a lot cheaper than what we are doing now.

I see your video and raise you another hellish reality

 

[Epic Beard Man]

If it is beside the issue don't make that claim if you can't substantiate it.




Do Jews really have to die to further our cause? Is that really the kind of crap this is?
More of them die than of us which means without a doubt that they are the good guys?
And Israel already lost the PR battle in 1967 when it became clear that it was stronger than its barbarian neighbours.




Even if? EVEN IF?

GO AWAY. <- This is censored. You know what it actually means.

Its in all their media. In school. On TV. On the Radio.
Absolutely everywhere.
They train kidnappings in elementary school. But man those Jews... they are really evil.

And you actually say "Even if".


We obviously have lost the PR battle. But that doesn't mean that we will roll over for your allies to murder us.




Water cannons in the middle east? That is just dumb.
Tear gas is used.
The IAF drops leaflets over the strip that people should stay away from the damn border.
Rubber bullets against probably armed people? This is not a demonstration. Among the people are Hamas and Islamic Jihad operatives armed with explosives.
You don't stop people armed with explosives with a rubber bullet.

Calls for negotiation? What is there to negotiate for?
Perhaps allow a few breach the wall and let them run through a nearby Israeli village?

Oh and the US can cut its ties with Israel. It won't matter.

Wanna know why?

The last line of defence against maniacs who want to destroy the only Jewish country on earth.


Oh and Israel is buddying up with India. Sorry.





So everyone is just shot at randomly. Good.




Oh man I got a genius idea. Why not surround your troops with a wall of medics. This way the soldiers can't be shot at.

Wow I wonder why no one has ever done this before.




One of those poor medics was part of the Hamas security. Literally a terrorist.
It is almost as if they wear medic clothes to hide in the masses.
It is almost as if they already used ambulances in the past to move their terrorists around unhindered.

But hey who cares. Evil Yahudi killed peaceful protesters.




On a scale from 1 to 10, how much does it annoy you that they can't effectively breach the border?

You’re a heartless person I’m sure if someone put a bullet in a friend you loved the way Israelis defense forces did that young girl your tune would be different. I’m so glad you’re not representative of the many Israeli Jews. I just cannot wait until the Christian fundies that support Israel die off and actual real progressives can take charge and take support away from Israel including our weapons that goes both to Israel and Saudi Arabia.

I sometimes wonder if you can actually tie your own geology to the actual tribe of Israel

 

[Epic Beard Man]

I support a Palestine that is not occupied militarily

 

[columbus]

The way Israelis do not like Arabs seems to me to be more than just contemporary.

Perhaps the Israeli attitudes have been shaped by the events of '48, '67, '73, and the fact that Gaza is run by an organization with the destruction of Israel in their charter?
Tom

 

[columbus]

You’re a heartless person I’m sure if someone put a bullet in a friend you loved the way Israelis defense forces did that young girl your tune would be different.

Prior to joining RF, I had never been in a place where the Zionist, Palestinian, and Peace narratives were all together on a level playing field. My sympathy for the Palestinians has taken quite a dive.

One reason is the same one that causes me to doubt the Hamas claim that IDF targeted a medic. More than once, here on RF, claims about IDF malfeasance have been made only to be demonstrated to be distortions. Two that come to mind involved "children".
One was about IDF celebrating the sniper shooting of a Palestinian child. It turned out to be the targeting of an 18 y/o throwing gasoline bombs.
Another claimed that IDF targeted sleeping children. Turned out that they were targeting the cache of missiles in the basement of the building. They gave the Palestinians warning through an NGO. Instead of getting the children out of the building, they left them to die. Then cranked up the media, which appears to have been their intent by housing children on the floor above the weapons in the first place.

You can read about this for yourself, right here on RF. I believe that our member Matemkar started both threads.
Tom

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

Perhaps the Israeli attitudes have been shaped by the events of '48, '67, '73, and the fact that Gaza is run by an organization with the destruction of Israel in their charter?
Tom

LOAC is still a thing, even when fighting people you really don't like.

 

[columbus]

LOAC is still a thing, even when fighting people you really don't like.

But did it happen?
Did she get hit by mistake? Did someone from Hamas shove her into the line of fire for the media coverage?
I don't know, but I don't trust Hamas.
Tom