"Religion of Peace?"

[Notanumber]

pic.twitter.com/KiPmS1SgHJ

Yeah, religion of peace.............just watch and listen the video.

What country and were those in uniforms police or military?

It was horrible to watch but educational none the less.

 

[JustWondering]

From the comments section - in those 7 countries, they are Christians,Jews,orthodoxs and other religions, so this isn't a "muslim" ban

This is how bad the situation is getting in Britain.

Armed police trained to shoot terrorists involved in lorry attacks

You do realize that if foreign countries hadn't been CONSTANTLY interfering and causing trouble in the middle east for the past five decades this stuff wouldn't be happening at all. You might be tempted to commit terrorism if some foreigners blew up your family in one of their MANY botched drone strikes on your home town, don't you think? If we break the needless cycle of violence and interfering in other sovereign nations affairs the situation will actually improve. The 1% that profit off this madness of course will continue polluting the airwaves with xenophobia and war propaganda so they can send your gullible kids to another country to die so they can line their pockets with more money. No, you're not interested in that, you just want to smear people who are different than you. Have fun with your corporate sponsored Islamophobia.

 

[JustWondering]

This article doesn't make the same claims you're making.

They clearly support my claims. Perhaps a picture of a horse wearing blinders would be a more appropriate avatar for you.

 

[JustWondering]

Allow me some time to research your quotations and I will get back to you. Sorry, but Christianity originated with Jesus Christ, long after the bronze age. I know what you are trying to say though, that since Christianity is linked to Judaism, that what you see in the founding of Judaism that is wrong ( I will dispute that ) is part of Christianity. That I will accept, but surely you recognize that the founding of the original Israel and what you are concerned about was 3,000 years ago, and that Israel ceased establishing itself then, in a tiny area. Islam began in 600 A.D and it conquered Christian Lebanon in the 1960's - 80's. Unwarranted violence by anyone is wrong, but Christians don't give up the right of self defense, individually or collectively. You brought up the crusades. Well, initially they were in response to 200 years of moslem warfare in Christian lands and constant harassment by them on shared borders. They were tiny in comparison to moslem conquest and killing. You are trying to draw a moral equivilncy, unless you are dishonest or ignorant of the facts, it can't be done. I will respond to your verses within 24/48 hrs,

You forgot to answer my last two questions. Don't you want peace? Do you honestly think that bashing Muslims/Islam is going to foster peace?

 

[JustWondering]

The US isn't a warmongering nation, that is utter nonsense. Korea, a response to an unprovoked attack upon an ally which we pledged to defend. VN, infiltration into SVN by NVA forces violating a border of an ally, Afghanistan, refusal to turn over bin laden after an ultimatum to do so. Iraq 1, invasion of Kuwait, an ally, Iraq 2 failure to adhere to cease fire agreement from Iraq 1, 22 UN resolutions ignored for inspection of nuclear facilities, removal of camera's mandated inside nuclear facilities, refusal to allow inspections mandated in other area's. Used chemical weapons against the Kurds, given ultimatum to comply, refused, goodbye saddam

You seem ignorant about this stuff called oil. You see, the west wants it, the middle east has it, so we bust heads when we don't get what we want. Why didn't we go into Saudi Arabia when most of the 911 hijackers were from Saudi Arabia? Secondly, other countries have sovereignty to do what they want. America isn't beholden to the demands of other countries, why do you seem to think that other countries are beholden to what America wants?

 

[JustWondering]

First, I trust no journalistic sources. A war has been declared upon us and we have the right of self defense. al qaeda and isis are the enemy and we have the right to destroy them. Any civilian casualty is horrendous, but in war they occur. Look at what the entities we are fighting do, then imagine what they would do if they were unchecked, more genocide than they have already wrought.

American interference created ISIS in the first place!! How naïve can you possibly be? They hate us over there because we occupy their countries and kill their people. Not hard to figure out. Then people like you but into the corporate funded war propaganda that the only way to fix it is to kill more people, a lot of them civilians. But that's the Christian thing to do I guess.

 

[hughwatt]

You do realize that if foreign countries hadn't been CONSTANTLY interfering and causing trouble in the middle east for the past five decades this stuff wouldn't be happening at all. You might be tempted to commit terrorism if some foreigners blew up your family in one of their MANY botched drone strikes on your home town, don't you think? If we break the needless cycle of violence and interfering in other sovereign nations affairs the situation will actually improve. The 1% that profit off this madness of course will continue polluting the airwaves with xenophobia and war propaganda so they can send your gullible kids to another country to die so they can line their pockets with more money. No, you're not interested in that, you just want to smear people who are different than you. Have fun with your corporate sponsored Islamophobia.

So it's the drone attacks which so angered Muhammad and his god that started all the homicide bombings, vehicles being used as killing machines, shootings and stabbings, etc? Watch the videos I posted here The Great Palestinian Lie and tell me Muslims/jihadists are the victims you portray them to be.

 

[icehorse]

They clearly support my claims. Perhaps a picture of a horse wearing blinders would be a more appropriate avatar for you.

Just so you know, most people on this forum will view your use of ad hominem attacks as a weakness of your arguments.

In post #587 you said the motivation for toppling Assad was to build a pipeline.

Your article on Kerry says the motivation for toppling Assad is because regional leaders view him as destabilizing the region.

Those are two very different motivations.

 

[Augustus]

In post #587 you said the motivation for toppling Assad was to build a pipeline.

Aaaaarrrgghhhh, pipeline arguments make we want to poke my eyes out. 20 years of the same vapid, evidence free, pre-conceived nonsense.

Kosovo, Afghanistan, Syria... Pipelines one and all apparently.

Strangely enough no pipelines ever appear. Being consistently wrong for 20 years still doesn't put off the pipeline fanboys though.

 

[shmogie]

American interference created ISIS in the first place!! How naïve can you possibly be? They hate us over there because we occupy their countries and kill their people. Not hard to figure out. Then people like you but into the corporate funded war propaganda that the only way to fix it is to kill more people, a lot of them civilians. But that's the Christian thing to do I guess.

Nothing to do with Christianity. I agree to a certain extent. I was a neo con, and truly believed that giving Iraq a shot at democracy was a noble thing. However, I now know that these tribal cultures with the ideal leader being an absolute theocrat/plutocrat are incapable of having a democratic society. So, kill the terrorists as well as possible, and allow those nations to do whatever they want to do on their own. Except in our own self defense, all of those middle eastern countries aren't worth the life of one more American soldier. You are correct, the taliban was thrown out of Afghanistan, Iraq was pretty much pacified, then that ultimate liberal president, and his maniacal sec. of state threw it ll away, destabilizing both countries, as well as Syria and Libya Creating isis and allowing the taliban back into the ,game, there are your culprits, blame them.

 

[shmogie]

You seem ignorant about this stuff called oil. You see, the west wants it, the middle east has it, so we bust heads when we don't get what we want. Why didn't we go into Saudi Arabia when most of the 911 hijackers were from Saudi Arabia? Secondly, other countries have sovereignty to do what they want. America isn't beholden to the demands of other countries, why do you seem to think that other countries are beholden to what America wants?

Well, we aren't getting much oil from Iraq. Soon the entire point will be moot, The US has enough reserves for total independce for a century.

 

[icehorse]

American interference created ISIS in the first place!! How naïve can you possibly be? They hate us over there because we occupy their countries and kill their people. Not hard to figure out

I'll agree that some horrible western interventions are a factor in the state of the ME. But you disregard centuries of history when you claim what you claim above. E.g. how do relatively recent western interventions create Muslim sectarian violence that's over a 1000 years old?

 

[icehorse]

You seem ignorant about this stuff called oil.

This one wasn't directed at me, but you really ought to lay off the ad hominem attacks.

 

[shmogie]

You forgot to answer my last two questions. Don't you want peace? Do you honestly think that bashing Muslims/Islam is going to foster peace?

Of course I want peace. The truth is the truth, not bashing. If the sunlight of truth shows what islam is, they should be able to live with it, after all it.s their religion. I am accountable for the religion founded in the NT, they certainly should account for their religion founded in the koran and hadith. The thread asks, is their religion a religion of peace, their holy books show that it isn't.

 

[shmogie]

You do realize that if foreign countries hadn't been CONSTANTLY interfering and causing trouble in the middle east for the past five decades this stuff wouldn't be happening at all. You might be tempted to commit terrorism if some foreigners blew up your family in one of their MANY botched drone strikes on your home town, don't you think? If we break the needless cycle of violence and interfering in other sovereign nations affairs the situation will actually improve. The 1% that profit off this madness of course will continue polluting the airwaves with xenophobia and war propaganda so they can send your gullible kids to another country to die so they can line their pockets with more money. No, you're not interested in that, you just want to smear people who are different than you. Have fun with your corporate sponsored Islamophobia.

Oh please. This is pap.modern islamic terrorism began in 1947 with the creation of the state of Israel. Hezbollah, the PLO, hamas, Iranian support after the crazy mullahs took over is about this. Their attacks on Americans and the US is about Israel, even the we feed most of the so called Palestinian refugees who refused to live in a Jewish state. Lebanon, a Christian nation was invaded by these hordes of palestinians, and is now a muslim country where Christians are second class citizens. You want to blame someone, blame the UN that created the state of Israel, or that grandaddy of liberal thought, the Soviet union, who made the motion for the creation of Israel. isis is motivated by it's religion, not a bad drone strike, after all they brutally murder their own people, because they think they aren't moslem enough

 

[J2hapydna]

Of course I want peace. The truth is the truth, not bashing. If the sunlight of truth shows what islam is, they should be able to live with it, after all it.s their religion. I am accountable for the religion founded in the NT, they certainly should account for their religion founded in the koran and hadith. The thread asks, is their religion a religion of peace, their holy books show that it isn't.

Why don't you call it Orthodox Shariaists and leave the phrase Islam out of it? Then you could support the people who follow other forms of Islam and who want reform in Orthodox Islam.

There could be several reasons for this including, we joined Saudi Arabia in spending 100s of millions of dollars in discouraging Muslims from making peace with the Russians and encouraging them to brutally fight the Russians to the death by popularizing this medieval form of Islam as real Islam. This was Islam that was akin to the racist form of Christianity that was followed in the west by the KKK and had its roots in the Justinian code. It is interesting how some Christians seem oblivious to the murderous evil past of their own religion.

 

[shmogie]

Why don't you call it Orthodox Shariaists and leave the phrase Islam out of it? Then you could support the people who follow other forms of Islam and who want reform in Orthodox Islam.

There could be several reasons for this including, we joined Saudi Arabia in spending 100s of millions of dollars in discouraging Muslims from making peace with the Russians and encouraging them to brutally fight the Russians to the death by popularizing this medieval form of Islam as real Islam. This was Islam that was akin to the racist form of Christianity that was followed in the west by the KKK and had its roots in the Justinian code. It is interesting how some Christians seem oblivious to the murderous evil past of their own religion.

No, I am not oblivious to the sad actions of. people who claimed to be Christians. They shall be severely judged for their actions. Lets be clear though, If we were to judge by body count, islam would win hounds down. However, evil is evil wherever it is found, and where evil was done under the guise of Christianity, it was despicable

I am aware of a number of islamic scholars and clerics who promoted a peaceful and reformed islam around 1900. I believe they were ultimately pretty much eliminated by 1920. One of my contemporary hero's is Dr. Jasser. A patriotic American physician who served long in the navy, and is a Muslim. However he is a powerful spokesman for the reform of islam, and for islam to get out the government business. Needless to say he is in danger and gets death threats from moslems on a regular basis. IF, just IF islam could reform itself, give up it's political and domineering characteristics as Dr. Jasser and his Muslim organization envisions, there would be no problem living peacefully and with respect with the rest of us who live that way, Christians, Buddhists, Hindu's, Sikh,s, Taoists, B'hai, you name it.

 

[hughwatt]

Why don't you call it Orthodox Shariaists and leave the phrase Islam out of it? Then you could support the people who follow other forms of Islam and who want reform in Orthodox Islam.

By whose authority? Who decides? Are Muslims to hold a referendum? In which countries? What would they call it, Shexit?

This was Islam that was akin to the racist form of Christianity that was followed in the west by the KKK and had its roots in the Justinian code. It is interesting how some Christians seem oblivious to the murderous evil past of their own religion.

I posted several Islamic sources detailing Islam's code of violence for all Muslims to follow. Have you not read these?

Violence carried out in the name of Allah and Muhammad is approved in Islam.

 

[J2hapydna]

No, I am not oblivious to the sad actions of. people who claimed to be Christians. They shall be severely judged for their actions. Lets be clear though, If we were to judge by body count, islam would win hounds down. However, evil is evil wherever it is found, and where evil was done under the guise of Christianity, it was despicable

I am aware of a number of islamic scholars and clerics who promoted a peaceful and reformed islam around 1900. I believe they were ultimately pretty much eliminated by 1920. One of my contemporary hero's is Dr. Jasser. A patriotic American physician who served long in the navy, and is a Muslim. However he is a powerful spokesman for the reform of islam, and for islam to get out the government business. Needless to say he is in danger and gets death threats from moslems on a regular basis. IF, just IF islam could reform itself, give up it's political and domineering characteristics as Dr. Jasser and his Muslim organization envisions, there would be no problem living peacefully and with respect with the rest of us who live that way, Christians, Buddhists, Hindu's, Sikh,s, Taoists, B'hai, you name it.

I think we are seeing eye to eye. I have seen Z. Jasser on TV and you are right, people like him are peaceful. Perhaps he can be an agent of change for the orthodoxy. There have been other Sunni reformers too such as Sir Syed Ahmad Khan in India. Then, there are the Quranists. Also the Aga Khanites among the Shia. There are other small sects such as Sufi and Ethiopians in Islam that are peaceful too. On the other hand all suicide bombings in the west seems to be linked to Orthodox Shariaist Islam. So wouldn't it be better to focus on the sect that needs the most reform rather than blame an entire religion? This way we avoid being labeled bigots and have help from those peaceful people within the religion who want to see positive change

 

[shmogie]

I think we are seeing eye to eye. I have seen Z. Jasser on TV and you are right, people like him are peaceful. Perhaps he can be an agent of change for the orthodoxy. There have been other Sunni reformers too such as Sir Syed Ahmad Khan in India. Then, there are the Quranists. Also the Aga Khanites among the Shia. There are other small sects such as Sufi and Ethiopians in Islam that are peaceful too. On the other hand all suicide bombings in the west seems to be linked to Orthodox Shariaist Islam. So wouldn't it be better to focus on the sect that needs the most reform rather than blame an entire religion? This way we avoid being labeled bigots and have help from those peaceful people within the religion who want to see positive change

Once again, you may be right. If you live in America, you know we cherish the tight of free speech. I have seen disgusting things said and done with Christian symbols, and images of Christ, but we consider free speech to include even this. A recent poll of American muslims found 60% of them believe that anyone who "defames" the prophet, should be killed. To me, that is taking a cherished right of Americans and speaking very dangerously about it. One can only wonder about other things. I have been fascinated by the Sufi, very interesting.