Religion spreads hate & intolerance

[Wannabe Yogi]

People are very quick to state that religion is not involved when i think it is.

De-nile is not just a river in egypt.

 

[Smoke]

It is the evil within the person that compels them not their religion.

All too often, it is the evil within people that shapes and defines their religious beliefs and practices. Religion is not evil by definition, but many religious people do great evil in direct obedience to the teachings of their religions. The absolute refusal of so many religious people to own up to this fact suggests that some religions spread not just hate and intolerance, but general rational and moral incapacity.

 

[sandandfoam]

All too often, it is the evil within people that shapes and defines their religious beliefs and practices. Religion is not evil by definition, but many religious people do great evil in direct obedience to the teachings of their religions. The absolute refusal of so many religious people to own up to this fact suggests that some religions spread not just hate and intolerance, but general rational and moral incapacity.

I disagree Smoke
There was a Catholic man murdered in Coleraine by a loyalists the other day Nine men in custody over Coleraine murder - Ireland, Breaking News - Belfasttelegraph.co.uk
It could be argued that religion was the cause of this murder. Rubbish IMO.
It could be argued that soccer is as much a factor here as religion. That would be nonsense too.
People who do bad things will try to find a cloak and religion can be a convenient one.

 

[Smoke]

I disagree Smoke
There was a Catholic man murdered in Coleraine by a loyalists the other day Nine men in custody over Coleraine murder - Ireland, Breaking News - Belfasttelegraph.co.uk
It could be argued that religion was the cause of this murder. Rubbish IMO.
It could be argued that soccer is as much a factor here as religion. That would be nonsense too.
People who do bad things will try to find a cloak and religion can be a convenient one.

I didn't say that religion is the cause of all evil. When religious adherents commit evil in obedience to the teachings of their religious leaders, though, and both the leaders and the adherents believe they're acting for religious reasons, only those who are determined to deny the obvious can convince themselves it has nothing to do with religion.

 

[sandandfoam]

When religious adherents commit evil in obedience to the teachings of their religious leaders, though, and both the leaders and the adherents believe they're acting for religious reasons, only those who are determined to deny the obvious can convince themselves it has nothing to do with religion.

Perhaps I am determined to deny the obvious. I don't think I am, but in truth it is impossible to look at oneself dispassionately, so (as with almost everything) I am not certain.
The way I organise my thoughts I imagine that I classify some you might refer to as 'religious leaders' as nutjobs. Maybe we differ on who we classify as religious?

 

[Smoke]

The way I organise my thoughts I imagine that I classify some you might refer to as 'religious leaders' as nutjobs. Maybe we differ on who we classify as religious?

Maybe so, although I have no objection to classifying a great many religious leaders as nutjobs. In some religions, being a nutjob is practically a requirement for leadership.

 

[Enoch07]

All too often, it is the evil within people that shapes and defines their religious beliefs and practices. Religion is not evil by definition, but many religious people do great evil in direct obedience to the teachings of their religions. The absolute refusal of so many religious people to own up to this fact suggests that some religions spread not just hate and intolerance, but general rational and moral incapacity.

Many a atheist, Christian, pagan, wiccan, satanist, and just about everything but Buddhism has committed evil violent acts in some way shape or form. (Go ahead post the violent Buddhist link, i know your dieing to.) All religions are completely different, yet there will always be violence and murder even if you could somehow make religion go away. What is the common variable here? The people themselves. The only way to stop hate and intolerance is if people just stopped existing. That is cold hard proof that it is our human nature that causes us problems, not religion.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

It is the evil within the person that compels them not their religion.

Yeah, but religion can make you feel so GOOD about it!

 

[Smoke]

Many a atheist, Christian, pagan, wiccan, satanist, and just about everything but Buddhism has committed evil violent acts in some way shape or form.

Yes, but the question is whether they do it for religious reasons. Often they do -- though I'm not aware of Wiccans or Satanists doing so.

(Go ahead post the violent Buddhist link, i know your dieing to.)

Not really. One reason I was attracted to Buddhism is that Buddhists behave better than the adherents of the religions I grew up amongst.

All religions are completely different, yet there will always be violence and murder even if you could somehow make religion go away. What is the common variable here? The people themselves.

No kidding. But what effect does religion have on people? Does it encourage them in their bigotry and violence? Does it encourage them to think that their hatred and violence are expressions of the will of God? Does it encourage people to commit evil acts even when they would otherwise not? The answer is different for different religions, but Christianity and Islam, for instance, don't have a very good track record at all.

 

[Nepenthe]

Yeah, but religion can make you feel so GOOD about it!

I can't frubal you so this'll have to do.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

But what effect does religion have on people? Does it encourage them in their bigotry and violence? Does it encourage them to think that their hatred and violence are expressions of the will of God? Does it encourage people to commit evil acts even when they would otherwise not?

Religion doesn't kill people,
People kill people.

 

[Smoke]

Religion doesn't kill people,
People kill people.

Of course. And quite often, religious people kill people for religious reasons.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Religion doesn't kill people,
People kill people.

So everybody who has ever killed in the name of religion would have killed somebody without religion anyway?

 

[ChristineES]

Sort of reminds of my Church experience on last Saturday night: we gathered up our swords, killed all the non-Christians we could find, burned down their houses, and oh, wait, we did not do that- we sang some songs, listened to some teaching from Matthew chapter 24, and socialized.

 

[Quiddity]

Religious people kill for similar reasons atheist do....They both attach meaning to something and act upon it.

It's just so much easier to identify a dogma, then an atheist personal beliefs.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

So everybody who has ever killed in the name of religion would have killed somebody without religion anyway?

No. I'll even give an example. During the Crusades, the Pope had to publish something that said it was ok for Christians to kill infidels because Christ had said we should turn the other cheek and not kill people. So they had to amend the rules to make it allowable. So these people would not have automatically been killers. But you can still see how their rulers manipulated the religion to get them to do what they wanted. Was it the religion that did the killing or the men using the religion as an excuse to wage war and steal land?

 

[Jordan St. Francis]

Of course. And quite often, religious people kill people for religious reasons.

Yes, and this must be admitted if it is also to be admitted that religion has any effect on people. Religion, it is argued, will change you. We can't claim the good results and slough off the bad. We have to discern what is the source of any particular action. This does not mean that every terrible thing done by religious people is a strictly or even primarily a religious affair. But we can't let systems of thought off the hook by reducing everything to individual decisions. Then all we are left with is Liberal religion and its private sphere.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Sort of reminds of my Church experience on last Saturday night: we gathered up our swords, killed all the non-Christians we could find, burned down their houses, and oh, wait, we did not do that- we sang some songs, listened to some teaching from Matthew chapter 24, and socialized.

You're not doing it right.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

Of course. And quite often, religious people kill people for religious reasons.

Yep, and in Texas, we kill them back.

Although, I question the quite often part of your comment. How do you define quite often. My first thought when I hear the phrase is that it speaks of a majority but I don't think it is, or that you meant it that way. Do you have examples to share?

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

You're not doing it right.

Yeah. Our church events usually involve wine, women and song. Although the women probably say wine, men and song. Hmmm, I wonder what the PC version of that phrase would be. I better schedule a committee meeting to discuss it. At least we have the an excuse, err, I mean topic for our next church event.