Replacing/Removing God/Religion

[Thief]

Actually, his post made perfect sense. You can't force yourself to believe in something. You believe in something because of certain experiences and occurances in your life that lead you to believe something. You did not "choose" to believe something. Your mind naturally believed with no choice involved. Likewise, since you did not choose your beliefs, you cannot willingly just "choose" to believe something different. I could no more "choose" to believe in the Christian god as I could "choose" to believe in winged ferrets. My mind has no basis to substantiate either of those beliefs, thus...I cannot just believe in them simply because I "choose" to.

This describes a process of elimination.
You can't prove it...you choose to say no.
Still a choice.

As the possibilities are reduced your choices number fewer and fewer.
I suppose, if you are diligent, you can reduce your options to the point where you have no choice but to nod your head.
Do you think you will find God?

 

[Draka]

This describes a process of elimination.
You can't prove it...you choose to say no.
Still a choice.

As the possibilities are reduced your choices number fewer and fewer.
I suppose, if you are diligent, you can reduce your options to the point where you have no choice but to nod your head.
Do you think you will find God?

Belief is not a choice. You're simply not understanding this. You cannot just make your mind up to "choose" to believe in anything. I can choose to perhaps say I believe in something to appease someone else, but just because I said it does not make it so. I cannot choose to believe something when I have no personal proof or evidence to do so.

I've found many gods. Any particular you one you're looking for?

 

[Dunemeister]

Becuase superstition tends to impede the acquisition of knowledge, and knowledge is a key factor in being able to make decisions which will result in lowered human suffering.

We don't need knowledge for this, we need ethics. Atheism has nothing on religion as far as ethics goes.

 

[blackout]

People's suffering cannot be reduced to platitudes.
(superstition, knowledge, ethics)

We live in the midst of such a complex mess
it reduces us basically to "every man for himself".

Do I have the time or resources to help you?
No.
Do you have the time or resources to help me?
Probably not.

Gee. I wonder who'se got the time and the resources.

 

[blackout]

I wanna know when we're gunna remove the elite from their thrones
and replace the entire system.

(I'm not holding my breath. Though I might be better off.)

 

[Thief]

Belief is not a choice. You're simply not understanding this. You cannot just make your mind up to "choose" to believe in anything. I can choose to perhaps say I believe in something to appease someone else, but just because I said it does not make it so. I cannot choose to believe something when I have no personal proof or evidence to do so.

I've found many gods. Any particular you one you're looking for?

Does this mean you have no faith?
Faith by definition has no proving.

I believe in the Almighty.
The term is self explanatory.

 

[blackout]

My "faith" has primarily to do with "the suspension of disbelief".

For the pruposes of transformation.


It has NOTHING at all to do with a (wholly) "seperate" entity.

I do not evidence that gOd IS a seperate entity.
(any more than you and I are seperate entities)

 

[Magic Man]

:no:
Scientology of the soccer world.

I will continue to bear witness until you've seen the light of the great Red Devils, you poor thing. You're welcome in advance.

 

[Smoke]

Well, we all know that Man Utd. is the one true football team. :yes:

:yes::yes:

:no:
Scientology of the soccer world.

There is none so blind as him who will not see.

 

[Draka]

Does this mean you have no faith?
Faith by definition has no proving.

I believe in the Almighty.
The term is self explanatory.

I have faith in what I believe to be true for I have had it either proven to me or eluded to by experiences I have had. I may not be able to prove to you what I believe, but I believe because I have been given enough evidence that I consider it enough proof for me to believe. I did not choose to recieve such evidence, nor did I choose for my mind to process said evidence in the way that it did. But, as it has processed such evidence, I have no other way to believe other than that which I believe.

I am to assume you are trying to refer to the Abrahamic god as being the deity which you believe in. And no, I don't believe in it, nor do I ever think I will as the evidence I have been presented with determines otherwise.

 

[Thief]

I have faith in what I believe to be true for I have had it either proven to me or eluded to by experiences I have had. I may not be able to prove to you what I believe, but I believe because I have been given enough evidence that I consider it enough proof for me to believe. I did not choose to recieve such evidence, nor did I choose for my mind to process said evidence in the way that it did. But, as it has processed such evidence, I have no other way to believe other than that which I believe.

I am to assume you are trying to refer to the Abrahamic god as being the deity which you believe in. And no, I don't believe in it, nor do I ever think I will as the evidence I have been presented with determines otherwise.

We are not so different. But I'm not chasing after God as you assume.
I don't follow congregation.
I believe in the Almighty because it makes good sense to do so.

I believe in life after death. I will crossover.
I am willing to assume you will do likewise.
And again for the 6billion others who will die within our life time.

If there is no "Greater than thou" in charge...we will be standing up from our bodies, into chaos.....
total chaos.

You might not like the idea, of Someone making judgment calls.
But without Him...you will not have peace.

 

[Draka]

We are not so different. But I'm not chasing after God as you assume.
I don't follow congregation.
I believe in the Almighty because it makes good sense to do so.

I believe in life after death. I will crossover.
I am willing to assume you will do likewise.
And again for the 6billion others who will die within our life time.

If there is no "Greater than thou" in charge...we will be standing up from our bodies, into chaos.....
total chaos.

You might not like the idea, of Someone making judgment calls.
But without Him...you will not have peace.

I never made any such assumption about you "chasing" anything. I said I assumed you were referring to the Abrahamic god as the god you believe in. I simply don't believe in that particular idea of deity. In my beliefs, the Divine is far greater than any one "god" is. And I have peace, thanks anyway.

 

[Thief]

I never made any such assumption about you "chasing" anything. I said I assumed you were referring to the Abrahamic god as the god you believe in. I simply don't believe in that particular idea of deity. In my beliefs, the Divine is far greater than any one "god" is. And I have peace, thanks anyway.

So...you won't be crossing over?

 

[Draka]

So...you won't be crossing over?

I guess that depends on what you are talking about "crossing over" to. I don't believe physical death is the end for us, but there are different things that may happen to us after death.

 

[Thief]

I guess that depends on what you are talking about "crossing over" to. I don't believe physical death is the end for us, but there are different things that may happen to us after death.

By all means...please continue.

 

[Draka]

Well, as I see it, there are a variety of afterlife possibilities. I think a lot of it has to do with our spiritual progression and age and also with, perhaps, the way we die. I believe in reincarnation, I have experienced ghosts, and I think there is an afterlife existence (Summerland) which can be what we make of it. I also believe that once a spirit has gone through enough incarnations and it has gained enough (though I certainly don't claim to know how much is enough) wisdom then the spirit can return, or reintegrate, with the Source/Divine. This all leaves open many possibilities for afterlife. One may cling to life or feel stuck, or even not realize they have died and, thus, hold on to this earthly world...hence ghosts. Some may choose to stay in Summerland for a while or perhaps choose to reincarnate right away. In my beliefs...it is all spirit based. What the individual spirit needs at that time.

So, no, I don't believe in just "crossing over" to Heaven or wherever you may think we go. I believe that there are many options and possiblities and not all spirits take the same ones.

 

[Tiapan]

I do not believe it would be possible to get rid of religion. If one looks at the Soviet Union, and their attempt to rid themselves of religion. It could be said that by doing so, they unintentionally created a state religion, the deity being the ruler. For the most part, I would say this is true with any country that tries to rid religion. They simply, not intentionally, replace with a state religion.

I believe people need that. You could get rid of God, but something else would replace it.

Sure but that is a culture where education was minimal, Australia on the other hand has witnessed religion die a natural death generally, displaced by law and education.

However we do get odd batches of forgien immigrants, asylem seekers from africa and the middle east that still exhibit tribal religious customs such as Islam, that have trouble assimilating here.

Cheers

 

[Thief]

Well, as I see it, there are a variety of afterlife possibilities. I think a lot of it has to do with our spiritual progression and age and also with, perhaps, the way we die. I believe in reincarnation, I have experienced ghosts, and I think there is an afterlife existence (Summerland) which can be what we make of it. I also believe that once a spirit has gone through enough incarnations and it has gained enough (though I certainly don't claim to know how much is enough) wisdom then the spirit can return, or reintegrate, with the Source/Divine. This all leaves open many possibilities for afterlife. One may cling to life or feel stuck, or even not realize they have died and, thus, hold on to this earthly world...hence ghosts. Some may choose to stay in Summerland for a while or perhaps choose to reincarnate right away. In my beliefs...it is all spirit based. What the individual spirit needs at that time.

So, no, I don't believe in just "crossing over" to Heaven or wherever you may think we go. I believe that there are many options and possiblities and not all spirits take the same ones.

We are not so different. What you call Summerland, could be what I call the presence of God. It's only the visual terms that get in the way.
On a larger scheme, is it not the visual terms of religion that separate one religion from another?
There is only one Almighty.
There is probably only one approach.
If we take away religion...the visual terms....won't we all get along so much better?

 

[TheKnight]

Is religion and/or god something that could be removed from human society?

Not without great damage to human society. Like it or not, religion has taken a large part in building and maintaining human society.

It is called intellectual and emotional maturity. The realization we are quite alone and totally responsible for our lives. There is no fairy god-father looking out for you. No Jewish zombie is coming back to set things right. No magical spell or incantation will help you. No prayer or cry in the nite to some supernatural force will do anything other make you feel like you did something.

There is nobody or anything anywhere that gives a frack about us but US. We can expect from the universe exactly what we see; cold and detached indifference.

Grow up! Live your own life on your own terms. There will be no second chance. Don’t waste this spangle of existence on some myth, legend, placebo, fairy tale, or imaginary friend.

You are a perfect example of the Atheist who sheds religion as a teenager and holds on desperately to that immature teenage mentality never seeking to grow into maturity as a human being. How pathetic.

 

[Draka]

We are not so different. What you call Summerland, could be what I call the presence of God. It's only the visual terms that get in the way.
On a larger scheme, is it not the visual terms of religion that separate one religion from another?
There is only one Almighty.
There is probably only one approach.
If we take away religion...the visual terms....won't we all get along so much better?

But, see, it is the mentality that "There is probably only one approach" that hangs religions in the first place. By thinking there is one "approach" when it comes to spirituality we limit ourselves to perhaps knowing so much more. It is more than just the "visual terms" that seperate us, it is the human ego. The thought of being "right" or having all the "correct" answers. With or without "religion", there is still spirituality and beliefs, and there are still going to be thoughts of what is "right". The trick is not to let go of religion or beliefs, but to let go of ego. To know that you don't know. To be open to being wrong, yet knowing it is possible to have a bit of "truth". If everyone were to just say, I believe what I believe, but I know you believe differently and you could be "right" as well and realize there is enough room in existence for us all to have some glimpse of "truth" and yet never have the bigger picture, we'd "all get along so much better".