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Replacing/Removing God/Religion

Gabethewiking

Gabethewiking

Active Member
Thief said:
People often do things because they feel like it.
But of course you also thought about it.
And because you 'chose' to do the 'right', and the recipients did benefit....
You would be deemed...'rational', 'social', 'morally upright', a 'philanthropist'.

Planning doesn't mean you had to write it done first.

But if you had done so...the scheme of things might have gone better,
and even more people would have benefited from your benevolence.

Now if you were driven purely by your feelings....would you not be more an animal?
Or do you prefer Dr.Jekyll / Mr. Hyde?
Click to expand...

No, I did not "think" about it, I do it spontaniously, this is unvalid after thought, I am trying to rationalize my actions even if it was spontanious.

I am an animal by the way, Homo sapien sapien to be specific, a Naked Ape.


A serious question related to the topic Thief, How do you relate to the fact that the more secular a people are, the more giving helpful and less problems they have, whiles the more religious they are the more STDs, Violence and Poverty there is.

It seems Religion seem to somehow be directly linked to problems, of course, it could be something else but for some reason Religion seems linked to "bad", and secular societies to "good", they do good, give most help, have the most safe and stable societies and so on.

What do you think about this?
 
Tiapan

Tiapan

Grumpy Old Man
When you drive a car, you can get from A to B without having a clue how the gadget under the bonnet (the engine) works. When the earth was discovered to be round not flat, to most humans it made no difference. Yet in both instances the understanding of the principles advanced mankind.

Humans deal with billions of decisions each day subconsciously and autonomously, yet consciously we only percieve the filtered representations of a tiny fraction of these decision processes. The rest have been subconsciously ignored because lower processes have addressed and prioritized them out of consciousness.

Religion is a thought process where everything we don't understand or want to work out can be thrown. Individually this unclutters the consciousness with an easy answer to everything we dont want to think about. Making day to day existence easier.

This works for many people, but only the critical review of the mechanisms of the natural universe around us will advance us as a species and society. As the use of entheogens has adequately demonstrated all we see is a perception, a summation of our sensory inputs filtered by the brain condensed to a summary and presented in a feed back loop to our consciousness as critique of us relative to our environment. Religion is one of these perceptual processes. It doesnt matter if it is right or wrong, it simply is there as a mechanism in the filtering out process, to make survival a little easier.

So religion fills a gap for many people in there daily decision making. Institutionalized Religions evolve slowly adjusting to new facts altering weekly to cater growing "known" as the frontier of the "unknown" is pushed back. I think many non abrahamic religions have simply renamed "natural" and "universe" with the word GOD, although I personally don't see the need for iconising that which is the natural scheme of things myself.

In conclusion religion will continue to evolve and become closer to the truth as facts of how the universe works are gradually accepted and incorporated.It is interesting to note that science not religion leads the way of change, which would indicate to me that religion itself is no longer causal or an instigating mechanism.

Cheers
 
Last edited:
L

lockyfan

Active Member
Thief said:
Are you not attempting to remove religion with a religious quote?

How about....
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

With this one cornerstone...all prophets are the same.
No prophet stands well without it.

This one doctrine could take down all religion...unite all men.
There is only one God.
There should be only one faith.
Click to expand...

Yes there should be one faith and the bible speaks of that.

I use the bible not from a religious standpoint but from God's satandpoint. He is the one opinion that should matter. And it is in the scriptures
 
Gabethewiking

Gabethewiking

Active Member
lockyfan said:
Yes there should be one faith and the bible speaks of that.
Click to expand...

Why?

And other religions says the same, you do not find it strange that the religion you where indoctrinated into and the society you live in is Christian, and here you are, Christian... A mere coincidental accident, correct? Or could it be related somehow?

...the bible not from a religious standpoint but from God's satandpoint....
Click to expand...

AHA! A Freudian slip :p
 
Thief

Thief

Rogue Theologian
Gabethewiking said:
No, I did not "think" about it, I do it spontaniously, this is unvalid after thought, I am trying to rationalize my actions even if it was spontanious.

I am an animal by the way, Homo sapien sapien to be specific, a Naked Ape.


A serious question related to the topic Thief, How do you relate to the fact that the more secular a people are, the more giving helpful and less problems they have, whiles the more religious they are the more STDs, Violence and Poverty there is.

It seems Religion seem to somehow be directly linked to problems, of course, it could be something else but for some reason Religion seems linked to "bad", and secular societies to "good", they do good, give most help, have the most safe and stable societies and so on.

What do you think about this?
Click to expand...


This paragraph shows how your logic is failing.

You allow for yourself your good nature, claiming it is spontaneous and thinking about it is not required.
It should then follow in like manner that bad things happen spontaneously...without thought....without religion.

You can't blame religion as a the source of bad things.
 
Gabethewiking

Gabethewiking

Active Member
Thief said:
This paragraph shows how your logic is failing.

You allow for yourself your good nature, claiming it is spontaneous and thinking about it is not required.
It should then follow in like manner that bad things happen spontaneously...without thought....without religion.

You can't blame religion as a the source of bad things.
Click to expand...

Certainly not, Religion is needed if you are a good person wanting to do bad things.

Religion is, as you may know if you read History, responsible for most of the evils in the world and if not the direct cause, it is used as a Cause, see Middle East or our own CHRISTIAN warriors killing MUSLIMS in Iraq..... Do you think it would happen if they had the same faith as "us americans" (I am not considered a real american as I do not believe in gods).
 
Thief

Thief

Rogue Theologian
Gabethewiking said:
Certainly not, Religion is needed if you are a good person wanting to do bad things.

Religion is, as you may know if you read History, responsible for most of the evils in the world and if not the direct cause, it is used as a Cause, see Middle East or our own CHRISTIAN warriors killing MUSLIMS in Iraq..... Do you think it would happen if they had the same faith as "us americans" (I am not considered a real american as I do not believe in gods).
Click to expand...

You're confusing religion and politics.
But of course...it's the confusion that leads to strife.
 
EverChanging

EverChanging

Well-Known Member
I don't know if religion can be replaced for all people, but perhaps for some. There are perfectly moral people who have no specifically religious inclinations or practices.

I think what happen is that religion must evolve to accommodate our times. I am a very religious person even though I am a Humanist and atheistic in regard to supernatural god concepts or any other supernatural reality. Mind you, this is not something I have always liked about myself, especially since I share the concerns of many atheists and Humanists about superstition and harmful religion, but this is the way I am: I can think metaphorically, I enjoy doing so, I am interested in religion, and it is an art form to me. There have been radical mystics in the history of Christianity, Judaism, and Islam (and the other world religions) who were basically atheists, so I am not entirely unique.

I use ritual for the psychological effect it has on me. I calm my mind with mantras and meditation. I draw inspiration from different religious perspectives and sources. But I also think very analytically and do not believe in free will, dualism, supernatural gods, ghosts, magic, souls, afterlives, or bumps in the night. I have come across atheists that would ridicule someone like me for my inclinations, and I find this disappointing because an atheist is essentially what I am. Through my spiritual practices, I have found a way to relate to the universe as a whole and experience moments of transcending beauty, to be a part of the flow of all things. I'm a nicer person to be around. I have an easier time "controlling" my anxiety and making the right decisions (or, more accurately, I am more likely to be compelled to do these things.)

I understand why atheists and Humanists want to rid the world of fundamentalism and religious fanaticism. But I don't understand why anyone would want to abolish a spirituality like mine -- one that has helped me become a much more compassionate person, a path in which I acknowledge, essentially, that even a blade of grass is my equal. But I suppose I can't be too disappointed in these people -- I don't believe in free will, after all, so my hurt feelings or anger usually don't last.
 
Thief

Thief

Rogue Theologian
Gabethewiking said:
Indeed. So you are claiming that Religion is not Politics?

.... This is going to be interesting...
Click to expand...

But very brief......
Stand behind a pulpit and say to your fellowman...."God wants you to...."
Religion.

Stand behind a podium and say to your fellowman...
"I have the plan. It's good for me. It's good for you."
Politics.

Blending the two methods happens all the time.
Hence a chaotic...and sometimes psychotic world.
 
McBell

McBell

Admiral Obvious
Thief said:
But very brief......
Stand behind a pulpit and say to your fellowman...."God wants you to...."
Religion.

Stand behind a podium and say to your fellowman...
"I have the plan. It's good for me. It's good for you."
Politics.

Blending the two methods happens all the time.
Hence a chaotic...and sometimes psychotic world.
Click to expand...
So when Bush claimed that god wanted him to....?
 
L

lockyfan

Active Member
Thief said:
Are you not attempting to remove religion with a religious quote?

How about....
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

With this one cornerstone...all prophets are the same.
No prophet stands well without it.

This one doctrine could take down all religion...unite all men.
There is only one God.
There should be only one faith.
Click to expand...

And God will create that one faith.... In his own time
 
sandandfoam

sandandfoam

Veteran Member
atotalstranger said:
Is religion and/or god something that could be removed from human society? If so, could they simply be removed, or would they need to be replaced with something else? If so, what thing(s) could serve as adequate replacement(s) for religion and/or god? Essentially, if there are components of god/religion which fill a necessary role for people in general, what are these components, and what else shares them?
Click to expand...


Are you familiar with or do you have an opinion on the post-theistic God advanced by Spong?
 
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