Richard Dawkins Facepalms at Deepak Chopra

[Rick O'Shez]

As much as I feel sorry for you for what you have done to yourself, what you are saying above is little more than a faith statement.

There is nothing wrong with religious beliefs, the difficulties begin when people come to think of their beliefs as definite "facts" and give their imaginings ontological status. The next stage is the assumption of "superior" knowledge and a preaching career!

 

[godnotgod]

As much as I feel sorry for you for what you have done to yourself, what you are saying above is little more than a faith statement. Even the nugget "you understand the nature of each and every phenomena" is a gross distortion as you certainly show no evidence of understanding very much, let alone "each and every phenomena". I do understand that a given human animal could convince themselves that they were intuiting reality so, especially if they had consciously detached themselves from their reasoning faculties.

All I am saying is that, if you understand the nature of one phenomena, you understand the nature of all phenomena. Please note that I am not saying you know everything. That is knowledge. I am not talking about knowledge. I am talking about the underlying condition of Reality that is the same everywhere. Basically, your consciousness is the same kind of consciousness as mine and everyone else's, though our minds have differing views. That makes consciousness universal. This has nada to do with faith. It is not a belief, but a logical conclusion.

So are you going to continue to attack my pointing finger, or have a glance at the moon?

 

[godnotgod]

There is nothing wrong with religious beliefs, the difficulties begin when people come to think of them as "fact" and give their imaginings ontological status.

Are you going to answer my question?

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Are you going to answer my question?

I have answered your question. Asking a counter question is a very familiar evasion tactic that you use. Clearly you can't answer the question I posed. The sad thing is that your ego won't allow you to just say "I don't know".

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Basically, your consciousness is the same kind of consciousness as mine and everyone else's, though our minds have differing views. That makes consciousness universal.

So human consciousness has a consistent quality? Yes, probably. But what has that got to do with "Pure Consciousness", "Cosmic Consciousness" and Brahman?

Your thinking is incoherent, a complete muddle, a random emission of contradictory ideas and ill-defined jargon.

 

[godnotgod]

Zen is a derivative of the Chinese Ch'an school of Mahayana Buddhism. "Zen" is derived from "Chan" which in turn is derived from "dhyana", meaning meditation. In any case yin / yang is a Taoist rather than a Buddhist idea.

It is a principle in Eastern thought, in Buddhism, even though it may have originated in Taoism. It is not exclusive to Taoism. It is also a principle in Zen. So what's your gripe?

And despite your attempt to muddy the water, sunyata does clearly contradict the Brahman-style reification of consciousness that you've been preaching for the last 89 pages. Sunyata means that consciousness is also empty, dependently arising, empty of inherent existence, so it directly contradicts your notions of "Pure Consciousness" and "Cosmic Consciousness."
http://plumvillage.org/news/thich-nhat-hanh-new-heart-sutra-translation/[/QUOTE]

It is because of Emptiness that all things can manifest. There is no contradiction between Hinduism and Buddhism. That contradiction is only superficial, and exists only in the mind.

You're trying to make out that Buddhist teachings support your new-age Hinduism, but they don't. You're trying as usual to force square pegs into round holes and making an awful mess.

I disagree with you, and agree wholeheartedly with Bijoy H. Boruah, who is far, far more intelligent and knowledgable than the likes of you and your stagnant backwater teachings.

 

[godnotgod]

I have answered your question. Asking a counter question is a very familiar evasion tactic that you use. Clearly you can't answer the question I posed. The sad thing is that your ego won't allow you to just say "I don't know".

But I do know. That is why I ask the question: 'what is in your mind to make you think consciousness is limited?' You can't answer the question because you not only don't know, you are asking from the POV of your conditioned mind, which has been taught that consciousness is limited, because YOU are limited by choice. What good is your stagnant backwater Theravada teaching if you cannot recognize such conditioning? And answer my second question: 'Does Theravada teach that the Buddha attained Enlightenment?'
You know the answer, but refuse to answer because you will be putting yourself in checkmate, which both of us know is the case at this point, don't we?

 

[Rick O'Shez]

There is no contradiction between Hinduism and Buddhism.

Whatever.

I'm tired of your nonsense and games, onto ignore you go.

 

[godnotgod]

So human consciousness has a consistent quality? Yes, probably. But what has that got to do with "Pure Consciousness", "Cosmic Consciousness" and Brahman?

Nothing. But why do you ask? Apparently you are not paying attention to the flow of thought and are confused, as...

Your thinking is incoherent, a complete muddle, a random emission of contradictory ideas and ill-defined jargon.[/QUOTE]

 

[Runewolf1973]

It is because of Emptiness that all things can manifest.

If everything is pure nothingness/emptiness then there can be no manifestation of "things".

 

[godnotgod]

Whatever.

I'm tired of your nonsense and games, onto ignore you go.

A good way to avoid answering my questions since doing so would expose what an ingrown stagnant mentality you possess, or which possesses you.

By putting me on ignore you pretend to be in authoritative control, but the fact of the matter is that you don't know Jack sh*t. You can't answer questions or refuse to altogether, and have difficulty understanding simple things. All because you are enslaved by the old paradigms. It also shows that you are copping out because you see that what I am saying is truthful, but admitting it would upset your priggish mental condition. Good riddance!

 

[godnotgod]

If everything is pure nothingness/emptiness then there can be no manifestation of "things".

It is precisely because of emptiness that all things are manifest. Go somewhere quiet and look into this. It may dawn on you someday, and when it does, will be unmistakably clear to you.

 

[godnotgod]

Whatever.

Go ahead. Cling to your precious duality. Doing so will forever prevent you from seeing how Buddhism and Hinduism are complementary, rather than contradictory. IOW, you will never pierce the facade of the illusion, always responding to appearances, rather than getting to the root of things.

Everything I say appears to you as a muddle because you want to impose a strict set of rules onto Reality, and force Reality to conform to a concept of Reality that 'makes sense' to your conceptual mind. But concept and nature do not together go,and the result is paradox, to which your rational mind just says: 'someday we will have the answer', meaning a rational explanation, when there is no such thing! And on and on you go, being led by the nose by maya.

 

[Runewolf1973]

It is precisely because of emptiness that all things are manifest. Go somewhere quiet and look into this. It may dawn on you someday, and when it does, will be unmistakably clear to you.

If it is so unmistakably clear to you then you should have no problem just answering the question instead of just telling me to go look for it myself. If all is pure nothingness, then what are these things and how do they manifest?

 

[godnotgod]

If it is so unmistakably clear to you then you should have no problem just answering the question instead of just telling me to go look for it myself. If all is pure nothingness, then what are these things and how do they manifest?

How are YOU being manifested?

Are you living It, or is It living you?

I cannot have your experience for you. You have to go see for yourself. Even if I could explain it item by item, you would not believe anything I say, and would demand evidence. All I can do for you is to point to the moon.

"Place no head above your own"
Buddha

The spiritual experience is

"a flight of the alone, to the Alone"
Plotinus

https://www.theosophical.org/files/resources/articles/StateofAloneness.pdf

 

[Runewolf1973]

How are YOU being manifested?

Are you living It, or is It living you?

I cannot have your experience for you. You have to go see for yourself. Even if I could explain it item by item, you would not believe anything I say, and would demand evidence. All I can do for you is to point to the moon.

"Place no head above your own"
Buddha

The spiritual experience is

"a flight of the alone, to the Alone"
Plotinus

https://www.theosophical.org/files/resources/articles/StateofAloneness.pdf

You're not answering the question. That tells me you don't know the answer.

 

[godnotgod]

You're not answering the question. That tells me you don't know the answer.

That question can't be answered for you. You can only answer it for yourself. There is no rational explanation.

Have you considered how you are being manifested, here, now?

 

[Runewolf1973]

That question can't be answered for you. You can only answer it for yourself. There is no rational explanation.

Have you considered how you are being manifested, here, now?

Through interactive forces.

 

[godnotgod]

Through interactive forces.

Can we simply cut to the chase, and say that it is the Universe that is manifesting itself as you?

 

[Runewolf1973]

Can we simply cut to the chase, and say that it is the Universe that is manifesting itself as you?

Part of the universe is manifesting as me, yes.