School, NYPD 'cannot guarantee Jewish students' safety - Columbia rabbi tells Jewish students to leave Campus

[IndigoChild5559]

In the context of discourse about the war and which limits said discourse should have, consider that to many people—for example, many Arabs and Arab Americans (especially ones with ties to Palestinians or family and friends from there)—support for Netanyahu's government and the IDF's actions in Gaza comes across similarly to how support for Hamas comes across to you. Outrage and disgust at support for either group's killing of civilians seem to me understandable, valid, and worthy of consideration.

There is no reason on this planet the justifies calling for genocide or that excuses what happened on 10/7. None.

 

[Clizby Wampuscat]

In the context of discourse about the war and which limits said discourse should have, consider that to many people—for example, many Arabs and Arab Americans (especially ones with ties to Palestinians or family and friends from there)—support for Netanyahu's government and the IDF's actions in Gaza comes across similarly to how support for Hamas comes across to you. Outrage and disgust at support for either group's killing of civilians seem to me understandable, valid, and worthy of consideration.

The difference I see is that people that support Israel are not calling for the killing of civilians, pro Hamas people are calling for the killing of all Israelis because that is what the Hamas leadership is calling for.

 

[Debater Slayer]

There is no reason on this planet the justifies calling for genocide or that excuses what happened on 10/7. None.

I didn't say there was. I'm only saying that many people view supporting the IDF on a college campus similarly to how you view supporting Hamas there. In that light, policing campus speech in a consistent and fair manner is no small feat, as necessary as it is.

 

[The Hammer]

Is a valid concern as antisemitism runs rampant now, but there is hope as there are enough people around who still cares enough for Israel and its people fighting these terrorists along with their vocal antisemitic supporters.

People need to be reminded that they are there for education and not activism by pathological pro terror fanatics trying to stir up trouble with people who just want to learn and be left alone.

Can I care about Jewish people but not Israel, seems like they aren't mutually exclusive

 

[Twilight Hue]

The difference I see is that people that support Israel are not calling for the killing of civilians, pro Hamas people are calling for the killing of all Israelis because that is what the Hamas leadership is calling for.

AntiSemites don't want to acknowledge that fact. They think Palestinian terrorists are sweet misunderstood victimized puppy dogs.

 

[Debater Slayer]

The difference I see is that people that support Israel are not calling for the killing of civilians, pro Hamas people are calling for the killing of all Israelis because that is what the Hamas leadership is calling for.

"People that support Israel" are a large group with a wide range of views, not a monolith. There are pro-Israel people who have indeed supported bombing civilians, specifically protested to cut off aid to Gazans (examples here, here, and here), or excused the IDF's killing of tens of thousands of Gazans, around half of whom are children.

Whether one sees a difference or not, it is a fact that many people, who include students, perceive support for the IDF and Hamas very similarly. My point in bringing that up is that a university trying to police campus speech, to the point of bringing in law enforcement, should ask itself how to maintain student safety and prevent hate speech while remaining consistent and not letting any form of support for killing and hatred slide just because it is popular among government officials.

 

[Revoltingest]

There is no reason on this planet the justifies calling for genocide or that excuses what happened on 10/7. None.

There has been terrorism / violent resistance / rebellions
throughout history, eg, the Haitian Revolution, French
WW2 resistance, John Brown. To judge such violence as
wrong, & consequently give no thought to why it exists,
or solutions to end it....this will inexorably lead to more
violence on both sides.

Israel can't expect peace to result from escalating its
brutality. It must begin a truth & reconciliation process
to face its many decades of apartheid, group punishment,
torture, theft, murder, & now genocide. Only then will
there be any chance of peace.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

My point in bringing that up is that a university trying to police campus speech, to the point of bringing in law enforcement, should ask itself how to maintain student safety and prevent hate speech while remaining consistent and not letting any form of support for killing and hatred slide just because it is popular among government officials.

My concern is not hate speech but threatening speech.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

The difference I see is that people that support Israel are not calling for the killing of civilians, pro Hamas people are calling for the killing of all Israelis because that is what the Hamas leadership is calling for.

touche

 

[IndigoChild5559]

I didn't say there was. I'm only saying that many people view supporting the IDF on a college campus similarly to how you view supporting Hamas there. In that light, policing campus speech in a consistent and fair manner is no small feat, as necessary as it is.

Because they don't have a clear head. They don't understand what the word genocide means, nor are they willing to admit that genocide is not the intention of the IDF.

To reiterate Clizby's point, where do you see those who support Israel and the IDF calling for the deaths of all Palestinians?

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Can I care about Jewish people but not Israel, seems like they aren't mutually exclusive

Whether anti-Zionism is antisemitism is a whole other discussion. I have to begin getting ready for Passover, and such a long and complex post is just more than I can do this afternoon.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

AntiSemites don't want to acknowledge that fact. They think Palestinian terrorists are sweet misunderstood victimized puppy dogs.

They really have no comprehension that by saying things like "We are Hamas!" they are going to usher in another holocaust.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

There are pro-Israel people who have indeed supported bombing civilians,

Again, you are mischaracterizing what is actually going on. The IDF is NOT targeting civilians.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

There

Sorry, you lost your moral credibility when you excused calls for genocide and the actions of 10/7, and I no longer read or reply to your posts.

 

[Revoltingest]

Sorry, you lost your moral credibility when you excused calls for genocide and the actions of 10/7, and I no longer read or reply to your posts.

I can understand your vexation.
A tip....
Try to understand, rather than reflexively
leap to moral judgement. It will not only
prevent such errors, but it will improve
your moral compass.

 

[Lyndon]

The Israeli leadership is perpetrating genocide on the Palestinians, if pointing that out is anti semitic then there is something wrong with what semitism stands for

 

[IndigoChild5559]

I can

Sorry, you lost your moral credibility when you excused calls for genocide and the actions of 10/7, and I no longer read or reply to your posts.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

The Israeli leadership is perpetrating genocide on the Palestinians, if pointing that out is anti semitic then there is something wrong with what semitism stands for

Nope. Genocide is the deliberate attempt to completely exterminate a tribe, nationality, race, or religion. The IDF is NOT trying to exterminate the Palestinians. It is trying to destroy Hamas, which is a very different thing. As long as you continue to accuse the IDF of genocide, you are out of touch with what is really going on.

 

[Revoltingest]

The Israeli leadership is perpetrating genocide on the Palestinians, if pointing that out is anti semitic then there is something wrong with what semitism stands for

"Semitism" is coming to mean "kill the Muslims, & take their land."
So yes, I'm "anti" that.

But really, they're all Semitic people in that conflict.
So I'm "anti-oppression", "anti-apartheid",
"anti-terrorism", "anti-genocide", "anti-starvation",
& "pro solutions yielding peace & justice for all".

 

[Revoltingest]

Nope. Genocide is the deliberate attempt to completely exterminate a tribe, nationality, race, or religion. The IDF is NOT trying to exterminate the Palestinians. It is trying to destroy Hamas, which is a very different thing. As long as you continue to accuse the IDF of genocide, you are out of touch with what is really going on.

The 1948 UN definition of "genocide" applies
to Israel. Complete extermination isn't part
of it.

Genocide Convention - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

To believe that killing so many innocent civilians,
destroying so many homes, killing so many
children, maiming so many more, using starvation
as a weapon, etc is really about defeating Hamas
is a delusion at best.
Israel's brutality & death dealing will only inspire
more violence.