Science can say nothing about existence of God

[leibowde84]

and you simply want to be stubborn

God first....then substance......

Why wouldn't the singularity be included in the cosmos? That would be counter-intuitive if it wasn't.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

If you're interesting in getting a better understanding of Buddhist teachings then you need to spend some more time with the texts and put aside the preconceptions you have, at least temporarily. Here are some suggestions:
Heart Sutra: http://plumvillage.org/news/thich-nhat-hanh-new-heart-sutra-translation/
Phena Sutta: http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/sn/sn22/sn22.095.than.html
MN1: https://suttacentral.net/en/mn1
I would recommend focussing on source material like this. There is a lot of stuff on the internet but much of it is of questionable value because it is just somebody's else's opinion or interpretation, in some cases interpretations of interpretations, second-hand speculation. Obviously an intellectual understand of such texts is only the first stage, so don't confuse that with realising the truths that they convey, that requires practice.

If you're not interested that's fine, but if you want to understand properly you have further work to do.

Seriously...how old are you...your memory is poor, we've been over this before..I've probably been posting on the Buddhist forums longer than you and have...I apply my Buddhist learning in the form of dhyan everyday of my life and have been doing so for decades.... I never read the Buddhists teachings as an intellectual pursuit...but for liberation from the wheel of suffering...ie.the end of karma and rebirth...

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Seriously...how old are you...your memory is poor, we've been over this before..I've probably been posting on the Buddhist forums longer than you and have...I apply my Buddhist learning in the form of dhyan everyday of my life and have been doing so for decades.... I never read the Buddhists teachings as an intellectual pursuit...but for liberation from the wheel of suffering...ie.the end of karma and rebirth...

Oh, I forgot, you know everything. Strange that you still don't understand sunyata....and quite a lot of other stuff about Buddhist teaching and practice. Oh well.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Oh, I forgot, you know everything. Strange that you still don't understand sunyata....and quite a lot of other stuff about Buddhist teaching and practice. Oh well.

Oh I understand alright....but it can only be realized when the mind is still....but if you want to think it means some conceptual interpretation detached from the actual realization of a mind empty of conceptual pop corn...along with all the other hypocrites...who is to stop you...

From the teachings of Bodhidharma....And the sutras say, "Go beyond language. Go beyond thought." Basically, seeing, hearing, and knowing are completely empty. Your anger, Joy, or pain is like that of puppet. You search but you won’t find a thing. According to the Sutras, evil deeds result in hardships and good deeds result in blessings. Angry people go to hell and happy people go to heaven. But once you know that the nature of anger and joy is empty and you let them go, you free yourself from karma. If you don’t see your nature, quoting sutras is no help, I could go on, but this brief sermon will have to do.".

From the teaching of Jesus... Matthew 23:13 But woe to you, teachers of the Law, hypocrites! For you shut up the kingdom of heaven against men; for you neither go in yourselves, nor do you allow those who are entering to go in.

 

[Thief]

Our understanding of the singularity (if that was actually even the case) is far too undeveloped to make any kind of valid choice. That's my point.

it's simple....it's one way or the other....
Spirit first?...or substance....

consequence follows and it's not rocket science.

 

[Thief]

Indeed. I think it's partly to do with uncertainty being quite uncomfortable, people want to arrive at an "answer".

compared to being uncomfortable with Someone Greater?

 

[Thief]

the title of the thread is correct....
science can say nothing about the existence of God.

science can lead you to a point of decision
it cannot make that choice for you.

still it remains .....an object at rest will remain at rest.
dead things do not beget the living

Spirit first.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

compared to being uncomfortable with Someone Greater?

"Someone Greater" is a comfortable solution to the state of uncertainty. But only to the feeling of uncertainty.

 

[leibowde84]

it's simple....it's one way or the other....
Spirit first?...or substance....

consequence follows and it's not rocket science.

It's not rocket science, it's cosmology. Something that you and I both don't know nearly enough to make any kind of decision on this. My argument is that your insistence on making a decision so prematurely, without nearly enough information and scientific understanding, is ludicrous.

 

[leibowde84]

the title of the thread is correct....
science can say nothing about the existence of God.

science can lead you to a point of decision
it cannot make that choice for you.

still it remains .....an object at rest will remain at rest.
dead things do not beget the living

Spirit first.

This is merely an assumption argued from ignorance. We don't know for certain whether these things are necessarily true when speaking of singularities. We know practically nothing about them, which makes any guess as to "which came first (spirit or substance)" utterly ridiculous.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

It's not rocket science, it's cosmology. Something that you and I both don't know nearly enough to make any kind of decision on this. My argument is that your insistence on making a decision so prematurely, without nearly enough information and scientific understanding, is ludicrous.

Indeed. There is still much to learn and rushing to conclusions is neither sensible or necessary

 

[Thief]

It's not rocket science, it's cosmology. Something that you and I both don't know nearly enough to make any kind of decision on this. My argument is that your insistence on making a decision so prematurely, without nearly enough information and scientific understanding, is ludicrous.

you can say as you please about not wanting to make a decision.....

that doesn't I can't
doesn't mean I shouldn't....

if you can't....too bad for you.

 

[Thief]

This is merely an assumption argued from ignorance. We don't know for certain whether these things are necessarily true when speaking of singularities. We know practically nothing about them, which makes any guess as to "which came first (spirit or substance)" utterly ridiculous.

and you stand in ignorance.....this is what you insist upon....
you don't know....

 

[gnostic]

and you stand in ignorance.....this is what you insist upon....
you don't know....

No one know what a singularity is.

You certainly don't know what the singularity, so you are just as ignorant AS EVERYONE ELSE.

Anyone claiming to conclusively know what a singularity is, is either delusional or simply liar.

Spirit first.

This "spirit first" bulls### is simply your unsubstantiated personal opinion, which itself, indicate that you don't even know what this "spirit" is.

The whole "spirit first" is just another one of your useless rant, because it rely on your superstitious belief, which is what superstition is - it is someone's ignorance; your own ignorance for instance.

The "spirit first" is not truth. That just simply you, don't know what this spirit is, and you are too blind to see that you have nothing beyond your personal belief (which is superstition). And it is belief in a myth.

Seriously, what does this "spirit first", if it isn't you expressing your superstition?

As you keep saying in your posts, faith requires no proof. This is true, because faith = superstition in a myth.

The only person insisting in ignorance is you.

 

[McBell]

and you stand in ignorance.....this is what you insist upon....
you don't know....

You act as though honesty is a bad thing...

 

[prometheus11]

it's simple....it's one way or the other....
Spirit first?...or substance....

consequence follows and it's not rocket science.

No need to choose. Spirit and substance are two sides of the same coin. When you put a quarter in the machine, neither side goes in before the other.

Now, unless you can PROVE something about "spirit" you have nothing to prove me wrong with. Do you?

 

[Thief]

No need to choose. Spirit and substance are two sides of the same coin. When you put a quarter in the machine, neither side goes in before the other.

Now, unless you can PROVE something about "spirit" you have nothing to prove me wrong with. Do you?

I walk into a room and find the table empty....
I return later and find a coin on the table.....Someone has been there.

If I retrun to find the coin spinning on it's edge.....Someone is close by.

choose.

 

[Thief]

You act as though honesty is a bad thing...

ignorance is a bad thing
I've taken care the pivot points.....

seems you are content as you are

 

[LuisDantas]

People often don't make a point of deluding themselves, particularly when they realize that certain ideas are fully fictional.

 

[prometheus11]

I walk into a room and find the table empty....
I return later and find a coin on the table.....Someone has been there.

If I retrun to find the coin spinning on it's edge.....Someone is close by.

choose.

Choose what?

If your god is all, why can't spirit and substance be one and the same just two aspects of one existence?

Why does this truth bother you so much?