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Setting The Bible Reader Straight

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3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
If that is true? Then? Your god is a monster.

Your god inspired Exodus 21: Wherein slaves are condoned, and their care is discussed. Never prohibited.

Vile, Evil at best.

Nonsense. That was the culture of the nations of the day for various reasons. Some people went into slavery to pay off debt. Others through captivity as a result of war and still others over poverty as they had no way of looking after themselves except to work. Other cultures brought and sold people as slaves. This was a result of the customs of mankind on mankind and not God's will just like poligomy. The care of slaves is discussed because people were abusing slaves who had no way to look after themselves accept through slavery.

What would be more evil in the day; sending a slave out on the street with no food, selter or clothing and no way to look after themselves until they starved to death or taking someone in and letting them work for you and providing them witrh food, shelter and clothing?

This is not justifying slavery it is simply pointing out that your argument is impractical for the time period.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
If you did provide a post addressing post # 281 linked you would have posted the link. Thankyou for proving my point that your not being honest here and running away from a debate. It seem you do not know how to debate properly. Your the one running away when your claims and posts are challenged. :)

No, your time to protest was when it was posted. I am not doing your homework for you. If you want to discuss it again there is a price to pay.

It is amazing how many that claim to be a Christian constantly go against what the Bible says.
 

3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
One note on that verse. It is abused by apologists quite often. It does not state that the Bible is correct. It only says that it is inspired by God and is useful. So though the Genesis stories are all clearly false they still can teach a lesson in morals. But in no way does that support your claims that the Bible is without error. And of course using the Bible to "prove" the Bible is only circular reasoning. It builds a house of cards that collapses at the first breeze. It is why wise Christians do not make the error of breaking the Second Commandment by treating the Bible as a "graven image".

Sure it proves God's Word is correct. God cannot lie *ROMANS 3:4. It is clear man lies as is shown through your false claims and you not understanding the scriputures you are quoting from as shown through this thread because you do not know God you do not know his Word. :)
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Why because I disagree with a post of your and call it optimistic? So in your view people can agree with your posts or not at all :)
There are specific rules on how the rating system is to be used. They are not to be used negatively. That is not what the optimistic is for, and when someone is not telling a joke it is a big no-no to use the funny rating.

Once again, you claim to be a Christian.
 

3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
No, your time to protest was when it was posted. I am not doing your homework for you. If you want to discuss it again there is a price to pay.
It is amazing how many that claim to be a Christian constantly go against what the Bible says.

Nonsense! I posted it and you ignored it and would not respond to it so it was brought up. Then you tried to make out you responded to it when you didn't :)
 

3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
There are specific rules on how the rating system is to be used. They are not to be used negatively. That is not what the optimistic is for, and when someone is not telling a joke it is a big no-no to use the funny rating. Once again, you claim to be a Christian.

I see so why have an optimistic? I am allowed to disagree with you. :)
 

3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
False. Once a person recognizes that "magic" is not real, and is never has valid explainatory power?

Then it never is valid for anything-- because the person knows better.

Once? Everyone just knew, that Lightning was from Magic from Zeus (or some other Sky God).

Now? We understand what lighting actually is: Static Electricity, created when mass volumes of air are moved rapidly across the lands. Exactly like rubbing your shoes on carpet or a balloon on wool-- only on a vastly larger scale. NOT MAGIC.

Never again will the nonsense word "Magic" give explanatory power, to any one who is thinking.

True! As posted earlier many things before science discovered it would have been thought as magic before it was discovered through science. :)
 

3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
I am not your friend. You would have to quit lying, just for starters....

Please tell me what lies I have said? If you cannot why pretend that I am? Seems like a habbit with you guys. Seriously though, according to the scriptures, me believing in God's Word and understanding the scriptures differently to you as an "unbeliever" only shows God's Word true and it is you who lies *ROMANS 3:4. You do not know God because you do not know God's Word. That is where your confusion is.

I talk about the evil that is "god" for the same reason doctors speak of disease, and police talk of crime...

Sadly you do not know what your talking about because you do not believe God or know his Word. If you knew God's Word you would not God is love to those who believe and follow his Word. If you do not you will see that you are indeed fighting against God. Not a very nice place to be come judgment day when you have to give account of yourself to God for the life you lead and for denying and rejecting his Word *HEBREWS 10:26-39.
 

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
The answer is in the scripture that was provided did you read it? Here let me post the whole reference...

2 TIMOTHY 3:16 [16], All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness.

That's how :)
Inspiration =/= dictation. A sunrise may inspire me to write a piece of music, but the notes and their arrangement are my own, not those of the sunrise.

Now, if the sunrise spoke to me and said, “I want you to write these notes,” then that would be dictation. But Timothy doesn’t say that scripture is the dictation of God, now does it?
 

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
Not at all. The wisdom of men is foolishness with God.
Hmm... I wonder, then, if scholarship is all foolishness, how did the ancients arrive at the Masoretic Text or the LXX from which translations have been taken, or the KJV that allows you to be able to read the Bible, or the Hebrew transliteration guides you have “made use of” in this thread?

Hint: the wisdom of scholarship.
 

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
Keep in mind that the Jewsprofessed already to believe and follow God's Word but did not know that the scriptures pointed to JESUS and God's plan of salvation for all mankind
Keep in mind that it’s always a mistake to read “Jesus” into any of the Hebrew texts.
 

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
When the context of all the scriptures in relation to ISAIAH 40:22 are added from ISAIAH 40:17-25. The topic of conversation is not a flat earth. It is the omnipotence or greatness of God in relation to all mankind. The Hebrew definition of a single word in HEBREWS 40:22 in relation to God sitting on top of the circle of the earth H2329 חוּג; chûg From H2328; means a circle: - circle, circuit, compassive. This Hebrew words is applied to the rest of the Hebrew words in the scriputure in ISAIAH 40:22 and read in context of ISAIAH 40:17-25 to understand it's application and topic of conversation. No where in this chapter is it talking about a flat earth.

When applying the concepts of both the sciences of astrophysics and astronomy in application to ISAIAH 40:17-25 (read the passage if you do not believe me)...

The scriptures says that God sits, as a judge or governor upon his throne, upon the circle of the earth; or, above the circle; far above this round earth, even in the highest heavens; from whence he looketh down upon the earth, where men appear to him like grasshoppers. He alludes to one that looks down upon the earth below him from some high place. This is the context.

In space on the earth, above (upon) and below is wherever you maybe on the earth which is determined by gravity. There is no up and down in space as up and down is everywhere in space depending on where gravity is. "Down" is simply the direction gravity is pulling you, and "up" is just the opposite direction wherever you are on earth.

This means in the scriptures in Isaiah 40:15-25 that God is everywhere! Our planet is only one of many planets and stars in one of many universes and galaxies. Since there is gravity everywhere in space, there is also an up and down everywhere in all directions in space. There is no such thing as a flat earth in scripture. It is only you trying to deny God's Word with your own words which are not God's Word but your words because you do not know God or his Word.

Your welcome :)
This isn’t cogent to my post.
 

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
It is God's Word written by people. Although some of it is directly God's Word *Exodus 20:1-17; Exodus 32:16

Your welcome :)
Again: show me where Timothy uses the term “dictation.” Further, when Timothy wrote that, the only scripture that existed was the Hebrew text. Therefore, it cannot refer to the NT texts, as you’ve been claiming. You’re in over your head, Bud.
 

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
According to the scriptures though God is not willing for any of us to perish
If God is not willing that any should perish, and if God’s promises include the fact that the world will be saved through Jesus, then either he’ll is empty or the Bible is untrue when it comes to the whole “perishing in the lake of fire” thing. Is God omnipotent? Does God give us this hope that God does not will for us to perish?

Methinks that the Xtian hope lies precisely in the fact that “God does not so will,” and that, in the end, God will accomplish God’s purposes.

Who’s the “unbeliever” in God’s purposes now? (Hint: it ain’t me)
 

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
On that day there is no more opportunities and invitations hear God's Word and to return to God
Doesn’t the Bible promise that the good shepherd will search until we are found?

Doesn’t the say that the father wait at the door until the prodigal returns?

Isn’t that what God’s kingdom is like?

Not “until dark” or “only for a given amount of time.” Until. Period.
 

Milton Platt

Well-Known Member
`owph also specifically means bird and fowl. And 94% of the Bibles I checked used one of these two words in Lev. 11:13. That you find "any kind of creature with wings" to be the best translation is interesting, but hardly persuasive.

.
I can see the Bible-thumper's point about the flying creature thing...it's kinda fuzzy. But then why would a god write a book that requires expertise in a language that was basically dead for many years in order to understand it? It doesn't really buy them anything.
 

3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
I can see the Bible-thumper's point about the flying creature thing...it's kinda fuzzy. But then why would a god write a book that requires expertise in a language that was basically dead for many years in order to understand it? It doesn't really buy them anything.

Hi Milton, good question. From a Christian perspective God does not require expertise in a dead languange. He has given his Word to mankind translated in nearly every language of the world today. That said according to the scripture we cannot understand God's Word unless we ask God to be our guide and teacher as we seek to know him *John 14:26; Hebrews 8:11; John 16:13; John 7:17; John 8:31-36.
 

3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
Inspiration =/= dictation. A sunrise may inspire me to write a piece of music, but the notes and their arrangement are my own, not those of the sunrise.
Now, if the sunrise spoke to me and said, “I want you to write these notes,” then that would be dictation. But Timothy doesn’t say that scripture is the dictation of God, now does it?
Your other post here...
Again: show me where Timothy uses the term “dictation.” Further, when Timothy wrote that, the only scripture that existed was the Hebrew text. Therefore, it cannot refer to the NT texts, as you’ve been claiming. You’re in over your head, Bud.
Your argument is non sequitur and here is why....

The scripture does not use the word or idea of dictation (word for word) but the idea that the message comes from God. According to the scriptures...

2 TIMOTHY 3:16 [16], All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness

The Greek word used of "INSPIRATION" is θεόπνευστος G2315; theopneustos; From G2316 and a presumed derivative of G4154; divinely breathed in: - given by inspiration of God.

This word occurs nowhere else in the New Testament. It properly means, God-inspired - from Θεός Theos, "God," and πνέω pneō, "to breathe, to breathe out." The idea of "breathing upon, or breathing into the soul," is that which the word naturally conveys. Thus, God breathed into the nostrils of Adam the breath of life Genesis 2:7, and thus the Saviour breathed on his disciples, and said, "receive ye the Holy Ghost;" John 20:22.

The idea here is that the life was in the breath and in the words given by inspiration of God, and that an intelligent spirit was communicated with the breath. It's meaning is that God put his words into Holy men as they were moved by the Holy Ghost *2 Peter 1:21 and these men wrote God's Word and given to mankind. It is therefore God's Word written through people for mankind. Although some of it is directly God's Word spoken and written by God himself. *Exodus 20:1-17; Exodus 32:16

Other verses hold similar meanings...

2 PETER 1:20-21 [20], Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. [21], For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

"For the prophecy came not in old time" - Margin, or, "at any." The Greek word (ποτὲ pote) will bear either construction. It would be true in either sense. What was true of them, however, is true of all prophecy, that it is not by the will of man. The word "prophecy" here is without the article, meaning prophecy in general - all that is prophetic; or, in a more general sense still, all that the prophets taught, whether relating to future events or not.

"By the will of man" - It was not of human origin; not discovered by the human mind. The word "will," here seems to be used in the sense of "prompting" or "suggestion;" men did not speak by their own suggestion, but as truth was brought to them by God.

"But holy men of God" - Pious men commissioned by God, or employed by him as his messengers to mankind.

"Spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost" - Compare 2 Timothy 3:16. The Greek phrase here (ὑπὸ Πνεύματος Ἁγίου φερόμενος hupo Pneumatos Hagiou pheromenos) means "borne along, moved, influenced" by the Holy Ghost. The idea is, that in what they spake they were "carried along" by an influence from above. They moved in the case only as they were moved; they spake only as the influence of the Holy Ghost was upon them. They were no more self-moved than a vessel at sea is that is impelled by the wind; and as the progress made by the vessel is to be measured by the impulse bearing upon it, so the statements made by the prophets are to be traced to the impulse which bore upon their minds. They were not, indeed, in all respects like such a vessel, but only in regard to the fact that all they said as prophets was to be traced to the foreign influence that bore upon their minds. (source here in this section on Peter is mostly from Barnes notes on the bible)

Hope this helps :)
 
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3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
Keep in mind that it’s always a mistake to read “Jesus” into any of the Hebrew texts.

According to the scriptures many of the old testament scriptures pointed to JESUS as the MESSIAH and foretold of his coming. JESUS is God and God has many names. :)
 
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